GHA Coaches and Network Warrington bus wars

[northwichcat]

I am sorry to disagree but the timetable clearly shows that generally speaking Network Warrington will leave the Warrington Interchange on the hour which is 25 minutes after GHA Coaches service. Only three NW Services i.e. 15.30, 16.30 and 17.30 services will leave Warrington five minutes before GHA Coaches. However there is an 08.30 no. 46 from Warrington but this will terminate at Stretton. Going the other way from Northwich to Warrington generally speaking most NW Services will leave Watling Street four minutes before GHA. There are just one or two exceptions.

I was using Traveline which isn`t 100% reliable for dates after a timetable change. If you have a link to a full clear timetable perhaps you can share it?

 

[kagreen]

Unfortunately I haven't a link. I was given this timetable on application to Network Warrington and I am sure you will be able to obtain one if you also apply to them. However, if you need any further details of the revised services on the 46 and or 16 or 16a services from the 1st September please let me know and I will pass any information which I have on to you.

 

[northwichcat]

The new 46 service is apparently replacing the 45A and 45C services (the 45C serves Mid-Cheshire and John Deanes Colleges) but the change is being made a week before the school/colleges break up for Christmas, which seems a strange time to change it.

Also surprising - according to the Winsford Guardian the last Winsford-Liverpool run will be on 12th December, the cancellation applying from 19th December. The Saturday before Christmas (19th December this year) is usually one of the busiest shopping days of the year.

 

[northwichcat]

From 14th GHA's 45 service will leave Northwich 1 minute ahead of Network Warrington's 45 service, 3 minutes ahead at Comberbach and exactly the same time at Stretton and Stockton Heath. I'm really surprised the TC accepted GHA's variation request for the 45 as I thought two similar services within 5 minutes of each other can't usually happen.

 

[the101]

From 14th GHA's 45 service will leave Northwich 1 minute ahead of Network Warrington's 45 service, 3 minutes ahead at Comberbach and exactly the same time at Stretton and Stockton Heath. I'm really surprised the TC accepted GHA's variation request for the 45 as I thought two similar services within 5 minutes of each other can't usually happen.

There are a very small number of reasons why a TC's office can legitimately knock back a service registration and they are related to objections from various bodies and Traffic Regulation Orders, which the TCs themselves are responsible for. Network Warrington and GHA could run at exactly the same times over exactly the same routes if they wanted to, although such 'bus wars' are very much ill-advised at the moment with the elephant in the room of franchising/quality contracts destined to become more to the forefront of many councils' thoughts.

 

[northwichcat]

So it turns out the GHA Warrington services are departing Northwich 1 minute before the Network Warrington bus arrives but the Network Warrington bus is scheduled to stop there for 5 minutes.

New GHA timetable: http://www.ghacoaches.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/GHA-Warrington-A5-4pg-Flyer-24-11-2015.pdf

Current Network Warrington timetable: http://www.networkwarrington.co.uk/...bdac24bcd9578b4541b4095a1e40f2.1439887370.pdf

 

[northwichcat]

There's been reports GHA having not been operating their 16 and 46 services for the past couple of weeks, yet they've not cancelled the services and the 45 services have still been running as usual.
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It's getting worse for GHA. They obviously can't find enough DDA compliant buses and have resorted to using N8 GHA on their Warrington services. Given what happened to Warrington Coachways I don't think GHA will last much longer in Warrington, if they don't cancel their services soon the Traffic Commissioner will do it for them if GHA are lucky, the TC could do much worse than just cancel them!

I also wonder what GHA are going to find to be able to run the new services they've registered if they can't find suitable buses to run their existing services.

 

[323235]

I've already reported another GHA service to the traffic commissioner - the P1 Middlewood - Hazel Grove for cancellations, ending short and reliability over a 12 month or so period . Perhaps if someone could also report these issues then it might help trigger a wider investigation and drive up standards within the company.

 

[northwichcat]

I've already reported another GHA service to the traffic commissioner - the P1 Middlewood - Hazel Grove for cancellations, ending short and reliability over a 12 month or so period . Perhaps if someone could also report these issues then it might help trigger a wider investigation and drive up standards within the company.

According to a Facebook post both Denbighshire Council and Bus Users Cymru put in complaints to the TC in January, not only for not operating services but also not responding to complaints from passengers when they don't run services.

Given the rivalry between GHA and Network Warrington I wouldn't be surprised if NW staff started reporting GHA for not operating services in Warrington and putting non-DDA vehicles on.
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I see GHA have been on their Facebook page today (for the first time since December) and instead of replying to posts about buses not operating they've deleted them all.
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On VOSA today:

PC0001977/61 - WARRINGTON BOROUGH TRANSPORT LTD T/A NETWORK WARRINGTON, WILDERSPOOL CAUSEWAY, WARRINGTON, WA4 6PT
Variation Accepted: Operating between Warrington (Interchange) and Northwich (Watting Street ) given service number 45/46 effective from 04-Apr-2016. To amend Route, Stopping Places and Timetable.

 

[323235]

They've also prevented people from posting comments, very unprofessional in my view.

 

[northwichcat]

They've also prevented people from posting comments, very unprofessional in my view.

Everyone who's posted comments about buses not turning up, non-accessible single deckers being used etc. seems to have been blocked from posting comments but they are still allowing people who haven't previously complained to post comments. It's resulting in more and more comments appearing on two Facebook pages which have been set up specifically for posting bad experiences with GHA.

 

[northwichcat]

According to Cheshire West council all Network Warrington 46 services will start/terminate in Northwich from 4th March opposed to continuing to Wincham.
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PC1098981/37 - G H A COACHES LTD, UNIT 11, VAUXHALL INDUSTRIAL ESTATE, RUABON, WREXHAM, LL14 6UY
Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Warrington Interchange and Dallam, Harrison Square given service number 16 effective from 18-Apr-2016.

PC1098981/42 - G H A COACHES LTD, UNIT 11, VAUXHALL INDUSTRIAL ESTATE, RUABON, WREXHAM, LL14 6UY
Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Northwich, Watling Street and Warrington, Europa Way given service number 46 effective from 18-Apr-2016.

Not a surprise as GHA were rarely running the 16 and 46 services.

 

[Statto]

Deleted

 

[Y961 XBU]

Bus War over as GHA have cancelled their 45 Service

PC1098981/27 - G H A COACHES LTD, UNIT 11, VAUXHALL INDUSTRIAL ESTATE, RUABON, WREXHAM, LL14 6UY

Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Northwich and Warrington given service number 45 effective from 29-Apr-2016.

 

[northwichcat]

I hope it means other services get revised as Network Warrington cancelled all their Wincham-Northwich services as a result of the GHA 45 services.

 

[323235]

Does this operate out of Winsford? Hopefully if so it should bring stability and extra resources to routes affected by missing buses.

 

[Danfilm007]

Only saw 1 GHA Centro to Chester on the 84 whilst I was going to Ellesmere Port, saw 2 C84s and 1 Arriva 84 going to Crewe (and an President 82 in all red). GHA must have been having a good day again.

 

[northwichcat]

Does this operate out of Winsford? Hopefully if so it should bring stability and extra resources to routes affected by missing buses.

Posted on another forum the Metrocities are to be transferred to Shropshire to go on the 576 route and the Centros branded for the 576 are going to go to Tarvin to go on the 84.

Although it should still reduce the likelihood of cancellations due to driver shortages at the Winsford depot.

 

[northwichcat]

Bus War over as GHA have cancelled their 45 Service

PC1098981/27 - G H A COACHES LTD, UNIT 11, VAUXHALL INDUSTRIAL ESTATE, RUABON, WREXHAM, LL14 6UY

Cancellation Accepted: Operating between Northwich and Warrington given service number 45 effective from 29-Apr-2016.

GHA are still playing nasty though. There was a healthy loading on the 13:20 (GHA) leaving Northwich today BUT the bus arrived at about 20 past and sat in the bus stand for 5 minutes after it's scheduled departure time meaning the Network Warrington bus couldn't get in to the stand until 1 minute before it's scheduled departure time, despite the Network Warrington bus arriving only a couple of minutes after the GHA bus.

 

[northwichcat]

Following a review of our operations we will be withdrawing our bus services 16 & 16A between Warrington Interchange, Warrington General Hospital and Dallam and services 45 & 46 between Northwich and Warrington Interchange.

The last day of operation for services 16,16A & 46 will be Saturday 16th April and the last day of operation for service 45 will be Friday 29th April.

We would like to thank our customers for using our service and apologise for any inconvenience the withdrawal of these services causes.

There are alternative bus services on all of these routes operated by Network Warrington who operate a comprehensive network of bus services in and around Warrington. For information on their bus services please visit their website by clicking this link.

http://www.ghacoaches.co.uk/warrington-area-bus-services-1616a45-46/

Credit to GHA for telling their passengers to use Network Warrington's services.