fare evasion prosecution

[angelo995]

Hey guys on my way to work I made a stupid mistake to pay for like 80% of fare price by getting journey shorter than intended. When I saw the revenue officer I bought the ticket on the spot. Of course, I got caught and got questioned to be sent to the prosecution office. They know I did it intentionally which made it even worse. I understand I should get punished for my actions so I ain't gonna say I don’t deserve this or any sort like that. I am okay paying the penalty whether it be 100 like the inspector said or 400 like the ones I read in news. I just don’t wanna have to do court as it will be a hassle. I told the investigators in the additional comment I am okay to pay the fine as I made mistakes. What are the chances it will just be an out-of-court settlement rather than a summons? Especially since they know mine was intentional rather than a simple excuse of “forgetting”. I didn’t wanna lie my way out to avoid digging a deeper grave. This is a first-time offense and no way of planning to do it again but it's the intent that I had that makes it worse in this case scenario. This is deffo the stupidest thing I did. Any ideas would help.

This is with GWR who does say they will try any chance to avoid taking to court but the anticipation of waiting for the letter is making it hard for me to focus. My reasoning for doing this was mostly due to thinking I would just have to pay an in-person fine at worse but did not realize the severity of my actions. I was thinking of sending an email of apology to the prosecution office but I been seeing mixed opinions about not doing anything until I receive a letter but I don't know when that will be.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hey guys on my way to work I made a stupid mistake to pay for like 80% of fare price by getting journey shorter than intended. When I saw the revenue officer I bought the ticket on the spot. Of course, I got caught and got questioned to be sent to the prosecution office. They know I did it intentionally which made it even worse. I understand I should get punished for my actions so I ain't gonna say I don’t deserve this or any sort like that. I am okay paying the penalty whether it be 100 like the inspector said or 400 like the ones I read in news. I just don’t wanna have to do court as it will be a hassle. I told the investigators in the additional comment I am okay to pay the fine as I made mistakes. What are the chances it will just be an out-of-court settlement rather than a summons? Especially since they know mine was intentional rather than a simple excuse of “forgetting”. I didn’t wanna lie my way out to avoid digging a deeper grave. This is a first-time offense and no way of planning to do it again but it's the intent that I had that makes it worse in this case scenario. This is deffo the stupidest thing I did. Any ideas would help.

This is with GWR who does say they will try any chance to avoid taking to court but the anticipation of waiting for the letter is making it hard for me to focus. My reasoning for doing this was mostly due to thinking I would just have to pay an in-person fine at worse but did not realize the severity of my actions. I was thinking of sending an email of apology to the prosecution office but I been seeing mixed opinions about not doing anything until I receive a letter but I don't know when that will be.

Well the regular advice on here is to wait for their letter to you and this can take some time (6 to 8 weeks maybe) - then make your apologies then and no point in doing this yet as they will not have an idea as to who is writing to them about what, as the report about you will not be set up on their systems. When it is it will generate the letter to you that you must reply to.

Assuming you gave accurate name and address and they took those details down correctly.

You can read the GWR fare evasion / prosecutions policy via a booklet you can download from their website. Probably worth you doing this whilst you wait to hear from them.

Bear in mind if you have done this before and purchased tickets on line they will probably check your online purchase history (from whoever you bought tickets from) and find out if they think there are other cases where you have evaded the fare. If that is the case I would expect it to reduce (but not necessarily remove) your chances of settling with them without court action. But I note you say this is the first time you have done this so that should not arise.

I suspect the cases you read in the news are probably ones that have gone to court, but from what we see on here if you co-operate with them and engage when they write to you think that you have a reasonable chance of settling without court action being taken against you.

 

[angelo995]

Well the regular advice on here is to wait for their letter to you and this can take some time (6 to 8 weeks maybe) - then make your apologies then and no point in doing this yet as they will not have an idea as to who is writing to them about what, as the report about you will not be set up on their systems. When it is it will generate the letter to you that you must reply to.

Assuming you gave accurate name and address and they took those details down correctly.

You can read the GWR fare evasion / prosecutions policy via a booklet you can download from their website. Probably worth you doing this whilst you wait to hear from them.

Bear in mind if you have done this before and purchased tickets on line they will probably check your online purchase history (from whoever you bought tickets from) and find out if they think there are other cases where you have evaded the fare. If that is the case I would expect it to reduce (but not necessarily remove) your chances of settling with them without court action. But I note you say this is the first time you have done this so that should not arise.

I suspect the cases you read in the news are probably ones that have gone to court, but from what we see on There if you co-operate with them and engage when they write to you think that you have a reasonable chance of settling without court action being taken against you.

Thanks a lot for your advice. Sorry by first time offense I meant that this is the first time I been caught. I have done it a few more times. I would say 3-4 more times (for the same amount of 20%) before (which they can check online if they choose to) but either the inspectors weren't there or they were lazy and didn't check me. But the majority of the time I have bought the right ticket which they can also see online. I think this will deffo affect my chances as idk if this would be classified as a persistent amount. What are your thoughts on this?

 

[MotCO]

When I read the OP's account, I got the impression that s/he was upset they were caught rather than showing contrition for their error. ( I apologise if this is unfair but it was my impression from what was written). The Train Oprating Company would be more interested in assurances that the OP now realises s/he made a serious mistake, realises that it is completely unacceptable and that they won't do it again. With regards to the last point, if they can buy a season ticket this would show their serious intent.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks a lot for your advice. Sorry by first time offense I meant that this is the first time I been caught. I have done it a few more times. I would say 3-4 more times before (which they can check online if they choose to) but either the inspectors weren't there or they were lazy and didn't check me. But the majority of the time I have bought the right ticket which they can also see online. I think this will deffo affect my chances as idk if this would be classified as a persistent amount. What are your thoughts on this?

OK - so it may have an impact - but my advice right off would be to be clear and honest - so being caught for the 1st time is not the same thing as it being a 1st offence, as you now say..... So do not risk saying that to them when you respond, as they will probably see you are lying and it would reduce the chances of a settlement.

But you probably do not need to mention it to them unless they ask you about it, in which case you can admit honestly.

But there are plenty of cases here where people have done things like this on more than one occasion and still reached a settlement - so you should still aim for that.

I guess there is an aspect in regards to how much money is involved ref the 20% fare evaded - eg is this say £5 per trip or £15. But not sure that is a deciding factor now you have been caught.

My hunch is the railway know full well that when they catch people three is a good chance they have committed the offence before - just the law of averages means that the chance of catching people the first time they evade their fare is reduced - so that is why they probably run checks on people's buying history.

If there is anything you can do now to reduce your fares (eg buy a season ticket or a railcard for example) then that is something you can say to them in due course to show that you have learned from your error and taken steps to do the right thing in future.

 

[angelo995]

Hi, Yes I will never do this ever again as this has been causing me to overthink. I know my actions have serious consequences and I am willing to be punished as they seem fit. I caved and sent them an email stating my errors and the serious mistake I made earlier but I do not think they will read it. I will have to see. As for why I don't buy a season pass is because I only have to travel there infrequently. Maybe 1-2x a week if not every other week.

When I read the OP's account, I got the impression that s/he was upset they were caught rather than showing contrition for their error. ( I apologise if this is unfair but it was my impression from what was written). The Train Oprating Company would be more interested in assurances that the OP now realises s/he made a serious mistake, realises that it is completely unacceptable and that they won't do it again. With regards to the last point, if they can buy a season ticket this would show their serious intent.

 

[skyhigh]

Sorry by first time offense I meant that this is the first time I been caught. I have done it a few more times.

If you want the best advice, you need to be honest on here. Saying 'this is my first offence' when you know full well you've done the same thing before changes the situation. However, you don't need to tell that to GWR unless they ask.

I would say 3-4 more times (for the same amount of 20%) before (which they can check online if they choose to) but either the inspectors weren't there or they were lazy and didn't check me.

So the fact they weren't checking or were 'lazy' makes it okay in your opinion?

When I read the OP's account, I got the impression that s/he was upset they were caught rather than showing contrition for their error. ( I apologise if this is unfair but it was my impression from what was written).

I get the same impression. Saying things like:

I just don’t wanna have to do court as it will be a hassle.

Makes it sound like "I don't have a problem with going to court but I don't want to waste my time".

If/when GWR write to you, you need to reply in a way that comes across you are actually sorry for your actions.

 

[angelo995]

OK - so it may have an impact - but my advice right off would be to be clear and honest - so being caught for the 1st time is not the same thing as it being a 1st offence, as you now say..... So do not risk saying that to them when you respond, as they will probably see you are lying and it would reduce the chances of a settlement.

But you probably do not need to mention it to them unless they ask you about it, in which case you can admit honestly.

But there are plenty of cases here where people have done things like this on more than one occasion and still reached a settlement - so you should still aim for that.

I guess there is an aspect in regards to how much money is involved ref the 20% fare evaded - eg is this say £5 per trip or £15. But not sure that is a deciding factor now you have been caught.

My hunch is the railway know full well that when they catch people three is a good chance they have committed the offence before - just the law of averages means that the chance of catching people the first time they evade their fare is reduced - so that is why they probably run checks on people's buying history.

If there is anything you can do now to reduce your fares (eg buy a season ticket or a railcard for example) then that is something you can say to them in due course to show that you have learned from your error and taken steps to do the right thing in future.

Thank you for clarifying. Yep when I got questioned I answered them with simple yes or no to avoid any complications. I also did state I understand what I did was wrong and willing to pay fines if need be. So the full ticket price was £12 but I paid for a shorter journey of £9.30. I would buy a season ticket but I do not because I travel there infrequently and I do have a railcard but it does not work for any journey there before 10. Maybe because it is not off-peak. I got my railcard specifically for that but now it feels like a waste cuz I never use it for that.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 May 2022 ==

If you want the best advice, you need to be honest on here. Saying 'this is my first offence' when you know full well you've done the same thing before changes the situation. However, you don't need to tell that to GWR unless they ask.

So the fact they weren't checking or were 'lazy' makes it okay in your opinion?

I get the same impression. Saying things like:

Makes it sound like "I don't have a problem with going to court but I don't want to waste my time".

If/when GWR write to you, you need to reply in a way that comes across you are actually sorry for your actions.

Hi yes. Thank you. I have been clarified on the first offence meaning. Nope that is not okay but I was just sharing it to show how I have not been caught the previous 3 or 4 times. Thank you. I wrote an email to the GWR prosecution to express my sorriness. I do not know if they would read it or not or if it shows that I am truly trying to repent for my mistake and I will never think of doing anything this stupid again.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you for clarifying. Yep when I got questioned I answered them with simple yes or no to avoid any complications. I also did state I understand what I did was wrong and willing to pay fines if need be. So the full ticket price was £12 but I paid for a shorter journey of £9.30. I would buy a season ticket but I do not because I travel there infrequently and I do have a railcard but it does not work for any journey there before 10. Maybe because it is not off-peak. I got my railcard specifically for that but now it feels like a waste cuz I never use it for that.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 May 2022 ==


Hi yes. Thank you. I have been clarified on the first offence meaning. Nope that is not okay but I was just sharing it to show how I have not been caught the previous 3 or 4 times. Thank you. I wrote an email to the GWR prosecution to express my sorriness. I do not know if they would read it or not or if it shows that I am truly trying to repent for my mistake and I will never think of doing anything this stupid again.

Thanks for your reply explaining the situation. Understand your explanation ref season ticket etc.

I suspect that as you have already written to them you will need to say the same sort of things when you get the letter from them (unless it is clear they have already taken it into consideration for example, when they write to you).

It's probably at that point that you might need more advice from people on here.

 

[Master29]

When I read the OP's account, I got the impression that s/he was upset they were caught rather than showing contrition for their error. ( I apologise if this is unfair but it was my impression from what was written). The Train Oprating Company would be more interested in assurances that the OP now realises s/he made a serious mistake, realises that it is completely unacceptable and that they won't do it again. With regards to the last point, if they can buy a season ticket this would show their serious intent.

If you want the best advice, you need to be honest on here. Saying 'this is my first offence' when you know full well you've done the same thing before changes the situation. However, you don't need to tell that to GWR unless they ask.

So the fact they weren't checking or were 'lazy' makes it okay in your opinion?

I get the same impression. Saying things like:

Makes it sound like "I don't have a problem with going to court but I don't want to waste my time".

If/when GWR write to you, you need to reply in a way that comes across you are actually sorry for your actions.

I don't think either of these are helpful to the OP who has quite reasonably explained his clear intent and stupidity but is more than willing to accept what is coming to him. He doesn't want to go to court (who would) and said he would be more than happy to settle out of court. None of this is up to any of us as it clearly depends on GWR if they wish to press on with their claim.

 

[angelo995]

Thanks for your reply explaining the situation. Understand your explanation ref season ticket etc.

I suspect that as you have already written to them you will need to say the same sort of things when you get the letter from them (unless it is clear they have already taken it into consideration for example, when they write to you).

It's probably at that point that you might need more advice from people on here.

Thank you. I will get back to this forum in the future when I get the letter. For everyone, thank you for listening and ensuring skepticism rather than agreeing with me and if you guys have anything to add I will read. I hope I can get past this in the future and never be in this situation or anything like this ever again.

 

[RPI]

Thank you for clarifying. Yep when I got questioned I answered them with simple yes or no to avoid any complications. I also did state I understand what I did was wrong and willing to pay fines if need be. So the full ticket price was £12 but I paid for a shorter journey of £9.30. I would buy a season ticket but I do not because I travel there infrequently and I do have a railcard but it does not work for any journey there before 10. Maybe because it is not off-peak. I got my railcard specifically for that but now it feels like a waste cuz I never use it for that.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 May 2022 ==

My bold above, if you travel 8 times a month or more in peak time you may wish to consider a flexi-season.

 

[angelo995]

I don't think either of these are helpful to the OP who has quite reasonably explained his clear intent and stupidity but is more than willing to accept what is coming to him. He doesn't want to go to court (who would) and said he would be more than happy to settle out of court. None of this is up to any of us as it clearly depends on GWR if they wish to press on with their claim.

yep of course. I made such a big mistake and I just wished I paid that extra money in hindsight but I know I can't do anything about it. I wrote the email hoping they would read it but of course idk if it will do anything. But I thought better to try than not

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 May 2022 ==

My bold above, if you travel 8 times a month or more in peak time you may wish to consider a flexi-season.

Hi. So it really depends. My work will start to make me go more often in the future but for now it is likely anywhere between 3-8 times a month. But thank you for this advice. I will look into it in the future

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 May 2022 ==

Also to add. Has anyone ever been in a similar situation like this? If so, how long did you have to wait for the letter. I really wished it could be asap so I could deal with it cause the guilt and anticipation have been making me less focused in general. What would happen if I don't get a letter for a long time? Should I contact them after a while as I do not want this want to escalate to something further by for example the letter never appeared cuz it got lost somewhere during delivery and I get blamed for not responding

 

[swt_passenger]

Hey guys on my way to work I made a stupid mistake to pay for like 80% of fare price by getting journey shorter than intended. When I saw the revenue officer I bought the ticket on the spot.

Does this mean you bought another correct ticket for the whole journey, or a ticket just for the shortfall? They will know when this later ticket was bought, and as I understand things they would effectively ignore its existence…

 

[angelo995]

Does this mean you bought another correct ticket for the whole journey, or a ticket just for the shortfall? They will know when this later ticket was bought, and as I understand things they would effectively ignore its existence…

Hi, just for the shortfall. They know I bought the shortfall on the spot already and was part of the interrogation. I have no excuse here tbh and don’t see any point of making any stories to lie. I will just have to wait for the letter and do required actions. I think I will just have to rely on luck on how generous the prosecution officer is feeling on the day. If I could I would pay as much as they require instantly to settle and never do anything this idiotic again.

 

[swt_passenger]

Hi, just for the shortfall. They know I bought the shortfall on the spot already and was part of the interrogation. I have no excuse here tbh and don’t see any point of making any stories to lie. I will just have to wait for the letter and do required actions. I think I will just have to rely on luck on how generous the prosecution officer is feeling on the day. If I could I would pay as much as they require instantly to settle and never do anything this idiotic again.

Ok, thanks for confirming.

 

[WesternLancer]

Has anyone ever been in a similar situation like this? If so, how long did you have to wait for the letter. I really wished it could be asap so I could deal with it cause the guilt and anticipation have been making me less focused in general. What would happen if I don't get a letter for a long time? Should I contact them after a while as I do not want this want to escalate to something further by for example the letter never appeared cuz it got lost somewhere during delivery and I get blamed for not responding

You will see in other threads that they have 6 months to contact you (as otherwise limit on court action kicks in, so they want to avoid that should they need to do it) - but other cases seem to be 4 to 6 weeks maybe - in recent threads it has been mentioned that GWR has had a bit of a backlog recently so delays things. I reckon you are going to have to wait a few weeks unfortunately. But obv make sure to be 100% legit with tickets (including avoiding any mistakes, eg always buy correct ticket before you get on any train, not buy en route etc).

 

[angelo995]

You will see in other threads that they have 6 months to contact you (as otherwise limit on court action kicks in, so they want to avoid that should they need to do it) - but other cases seem to be 4 to 6 weeks maybe - in recent threads it has been mentioned that GWR has had a bit of a backlog recently so delays things. I reckon you are going to have to wait a few weeks unfortunately. But obv make sure to be 100% legit with tickets (including avoiding any mistakes, eg always buy correct ticket before you get on any train, not buy en route etc).

Thank you. You have been very helpful with all your advices. I will never do this again

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you. You have been very helpful with all your advices. I will never do this again

Yeah - realise that - I guess I meant don't do it by mistake (eg unintentional wrong ticket bought, use railcard when it's not valid in error etc) - whilst you are on their radar as it were.

 

[MotCO]

I don't think either of these are helpful to the OP who has quite reasonably explained his clear intent and stupidity but is more than willing to accept what is coming to him. He doesn't want to go to court (who would) and said he would be more than happy to settle out of court. None of this is up to any of us as it clearly depends on GWR if they wish to press on with their claim.

My comment was meant to be helpful. If what the OP wrote on this forum is similar to what he emailed to GWR, then my view (also echoed by @skyhigh) was that it did not strike the right tone. Advising the OP to show contrition may produce a better outcome.

 

[angelo995]

My comment was meant to be helpful. If what the OP wrote on this forum is similar to what he emailed to GWR, then my view (also echoed by @skyhigh) was that it did not strike the right tone. Advising the OP to show contrition may produce a better outcome.

Hi,
I have tried my best to show real accountability for my actions in the email. Hope I get a chance via letter too