My railcard expired last year on the 7th of December. I have sinced bought my tickets at the full price as I haven’t renewed the railcard. However, my last 7 tickets were bought with a railcard and when it was checked today by the ticket officer, she requested to see it and took down my details and said that it will be investigated stating that I will be charged for all the tickets that I have been buying since the expiry. I would like to put it that I have been sent a warning letter once about not having a ticket. This happened today and I want to know the possible outcome. Will I be charged a penalty fare? Am I going to jail? Can this be settled out of court?
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Expired Railcard
- Thread starter Madinah
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
You won't go to jail. You will be given the opportunity to settle out of court by paying a penalty.
A penalty fare can only be issued on the train at the time the infringement of the ticketing rules occurred.
The train operator will send you a letter asking for your representations.
If you search for posts made by @Hadders you will find examples of the type of response the forum members consider to be best advice.
They will research your booking history. In all probability they will offer you an out of court settlement comprising the full fares for the journeys you didnt have a valid ticket for (they do not usually take into account fares already paid) plus an admin fee of C£120 - £200. The full fares can be quite a large sum of money as they are based on the full one way single fare.
You can look up the fares on www.brfares.com. If you advise of the journeys you took a forum member should be able to advise you the fare you will be required to pay.
Cases normally only go to court if (a) you do not engage with the Train Operating Company (b) it involves Transport for London (c) a serious crime was also committed for example assault, foul or abusive language, fraud. (NB fraud has a very specific meaning and on the basis of what you have said your case is not a case of fraud. )
The train operator will send you a letter asking for your representations.
If you search for posts made by @Hadders you will find examples of the type of response the forum members consider to be best advice.
They will research your booking history. In all probability they will offer you an out of court settlement comprising the full fares for the journeys you didnt have a valid ticket for (they do not usually take into account fares already paid) plus an admin fee of C£120 - £200. The full fares can be quite a large sum of money as they are based on the full one way single fare.
You can look up the fares on www.brfares.com. If you advise of the journeys you took a forum member should be able to advise you the fare you will be required to pay.
Cases normally only go to court if (a) you do not engage with the Train Operating Company (b) it involves Transport for London (c) a serious crime was also committed for example assault, foul or abusive language, fraud. (NB fraud has a very specific meaning and on the basis of what you have said your case is not a case of fraud. )
Thanks so much for this. Will this include all the journeys from when the railcard expired regardless of the train company?
Yes the Train Operating Company who "caught" you, acts on behalf of all of them in dealing with you.
Some Train Operating Companies are more lenient than others. On the Train Operating Companies website there is usually a document that outlines how they deal with ticketing and railcard issues such as this.
What of the tickets that were bought in full? Is there a way they can detect if it was bought with a railcard?
Yes, they know which tickets were discounted.
Will I still be charged for them?
If you were entitled to the discount then no, you won’t be charged for the discounted ones. Full price ones you’ll have paid the correct price for anyway.
I want to get this, I have some tickets I bought that I paid in full. Will they be charged again together with the ones that were discounted?
No, because you paid the full price for them, so there’s no question of them being incorrect in any way is there?
Alright. Thank you
mmkk
New Member
What information did they take from you at the station?
Did they tell you they would be issuing a penalty and did they let you on the train?
My name, phone number and address. I also paid the full fare and they let me on the train
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Also, what about the warning letter? Will it have any impact on the decision to prosecute immediately?
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Also, what about the warning letter? Will it have any impact on the decision to prosecute immediately?
Last edited:
Welcome to the forum!
We need to know more details to be able to advise peoperly.
For starters, which train company are you dealing with?
Can you upload a redacted copy of the letter you've been sent?
What were the circumstances that led to the previous warning? When was this? WHich train company?
Train companies do research online ticket purchasing history and if you are offered a settlement then they will normally expect payment for the journeys you've made with invalid tickets (i.e. the railcard discounted tickets you purchased when your railcard was expired). They won't expect payment for tickets purchased without a railcard discount applied unless there's something else indicating invalid use. For example, two short distance tickets purchased at either end of a long distance journey to get through the barriers but leaving a large gap in the middle without a ticket.
If you've had a warning before then natrually it will be much harder to obtain an out of court settlement. I'm not saying it will be impossible but you will need to be prepared for the possibility that the train company might decide to prosecute.
We need to know more details to be able to advise peoperly.
For starters, which train company are you dealing with?
Can you upload a redacted copy of the letter you've been sent?
What were the circumstances that led to the previous warning? When was this? WHich train company?
Train companies do research online ticket purchasing history and if you are offered a settlement then they will normally expect payment for the journeys you've made with invalid tickets (i.e. the railcard discounted tickets you purchased when your railcard was expired). They won't expect payment for tickets purchased without a railcard discount applied unless there's something else indicating invalid use. For example, two short distance tickets purchased at either end of a long distance journey to get through the barriers but leaving a large gap in the middle without a ticket.
If you've had a warning before then natrually it will be much harder to obtain an out of court settlement. I'm not saying it will be impossible but you will need to be prepared for the possibility that the train company might decide to prosecute.
I am dealing with cross country and I received a warning letter about 2-3 months ago for not having a ticket on board and it was still with cross country. I haven’t gotten any letter yet as the incident happened just yesterday. My other question now is, if they decided they want to prosecute, can I plead for an out of court settlement.
It’s difficult to say. Was the warning letter simply for having no ticket at all? I’m not sure we have come across a case where someone has received a warning letter than then committed further transgressions shortly afterwards.
Yes. It was for having no ticket.
Hi guys. Do you have any idea how long it takes to receive a letter from the train company? It’s been well over a month and I haven’t heard from them. What do you think should be the next course of action if I don’t hear from them for another month.
It can take up to six months from the date of the incident(s). There is unfortunately nothing you can do to speed up the processing, provided you gave the correct address. So even if you hear nothing in a further month from now, you still just have to wait for them to contact you. It's possible they are analysing your travel arrangements and that can take a while to do, particularly if data is sitting with other entities.
Alright. Thank you for the response.
- Status