Another HS1 query - Hastings to Greenwich

[hgt]

Dear all, I wondered if somebody could clarify the supliment arrangements on HS1 for me please....

In a couple of weeks I want to make a day trip (off peak) from Hastings to Greenwich (ideally via HS1 just for fun!). If I pop the details into South Eastern's journey planner it gives me a CDR fare of £22.10 from Hastings to Greenwich, routed via Ashford, then HS1 to Stratford, then DLR to Greenwich.

Is this fare really valid on HS1 services? As a ticket just from Hastings to Stratford International comes up as £30.30 for a DR. Basically I want to make sure I'm not going to get stung for a HS1 supliment if I try to use this ticket. Is this simply an oddity with the routing, or is the website trying to sell me a ticket that is not actually valid?!

Many thanks!

 

[north]

That ticket is routed "NOT LONDON". So, as far as I can make out, so long as you don't travel into a London Terminals station and travel out again you are OK.

If you did want to travel via a London Terminal there are seperate with HS1 (routed +ANY PERMITTED) for £31 and without HS1 for (routed +NOT VALID ON HS1) for £26
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I should add that if you get an itinerary with a ticket price (especially if from the TOC you are travelling on!) and you print this out they can’t argue with you – regardless of weather on not the given journey is actually valid.

 

[barrykas]

That ticket is routed "NOT LONDON". So, as far as I can make out, so long as you don't travel into a London Terminals station and travel out again you are OK.

That's all well and good, but if you do a Routeing Guide check, the only combination that allows HS1 involves travel via London Group (that you don't actually get as far as London is irrelevant)...And as the "Not London" ticket doesn't have the Maltese Cross on it, it wouldn't be valid on the DLR between Stratford and Greenwich either.

Cheers,

Bsrry

 

[yorkie]

Dear all, I wondered if somebody could clarify the supliment arrangements on HS1 for me please....

A supplement is basically an excess for tickets routed "Not HS1" to be valid via HS1. The principle is no different, excessing is time consuming, so issuing a straightforward supplement saves time.

In a couple of weeks I want to make a day trip (off peak) from Hastings to Greenwich (ideally via HS1 just for fun!). If I pop the details into South Eastern's journey planner it gives me a CDR fare of £22.10 from Hastings to Greenwich, routed via Ashford, then HS1 to Stratford, then DLR to Greenwich.

Our advice in these situations is to book it online, then you have formed a contract. Stick to the trains in your itinerary and bring a copy of the itinerary with you, as evidence of the contract. In the case of trains with reservations (not applicable here) I would suggest occupying the seat reservation too.

 

[A60K]

I basically agree with what Yorkie says, except that I would advise caution in this case where the itinerary gives you a route via the DLR.

If the ticket doesn't indicate validity on the DLR in one of the acceptable ways, then be prepared for a 'discussion' with the PSA on the DLR service. Potentially they could issue you with a penalty fare for not having a valid ticket.

If the National Rail website indicates an invalid route on National Rail services that's one thing, but if it indicates an invalid route on TfL or other operators' services then it leaves you in an awkward position.

If you did get a penalty fare on the DLR you would have to take it up with South Eastern, and that might be a frustrating and time-consuming experience.

 

[yorkie]

You can't be given a PF for being off route, and I'm sure the media would be interested to hear in anyone attempting to issue a PF or charge an extra fare when a passenger has evidence of such a contract.

If challenged, make sure you make a note of the name of the person and ask for details on how to make a complaint.

As for taking it up, I am not necessarily advising this but I'd refuse to pay the fare and then they would be the ones having to 'take it up. As for the threat of BTP, I hardly think they would challenge someone with evidence of a contract who is then conforming with what that contract stipulates. BTP are not particularly interested in such matters according to what I've heard.

 

[A60K]

Yorkie, again I agree with much of what you're saying. I don't dispute the principle that if you're given a travel itinerary when you book a ticket you are entitled to follow that route.

The problem I'm talking about is travelling on the DLR with a National Rail ticket that isn't valid on the DLR, despite what a National Rail website may (incorrectly) advise.

I don't believe that would come under being 'off route', and I think the PSA (Passenger Service Agent - Train Captain - not the BTP) on the DLR would treat it as no valid ticket being held. You could try to argue that the National Rail itinerary is a 'valid authority' to travel, but I don't know if that would satisfy the PSA.

By all means refuse to pay, but you could end up in a lengthy correspondence trying to get it sorted out. It basically comes down to how willing you are to have an argument that you're in the right because of what the South Eastern website sells you. If you're a combative and determined person then go for it!

 

[hgt]

Many thanks to everyone for your help. I guess I may as well book the ticket to Greenwich rather than Stratford international then, as that will save over £8. But then for the sake of a couple of quid on my Oyster card, I think I'd best play it safe and pay for the DLR between Stratford and Greenwich!

 

[yorkie]

Many thanks to everyone for your help. I guess I may as well book the ticket to Greenwich rather than Stratford international then, as that will save over £8. But then for the sake of a couple of quid on my Oyster card, I think I'd best play it safe and pay for the DLR between Stratford and Greenwich!

I think that's what I'd do. (Unless I was with a group of people all prepared to stand firm on the DLR).

If anyone challenges you in the course of your journey, remain calm, and polite but firm and assertive.

In reality I am sure you will have a problem, and probably won't even have to show the travel itinerary. But bring it (and a pen and paper to make notes if challenged) just in case!