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Advice for writing in response to a Notice

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Dear Forum,

My 18 year old son has just received a notice of intended prosecution from Chiltern Railways for not having a valid railcard. He is very distressed and immeidately penned an email reply but I have asked him to delay sending it as I found this helpful forum and wanted to get some advice. The situation is that my son very occassionally travels to London from Beaconsfield as up until last month, he was still a student. When he was 16, I bought him a 16-17 year old railcard to use. It expired when he turned 18. He didn't realise he needed to buy a new railcard (the 16-25 year old railcard) and went to London a month after he turned 18 and accidentally bought a return fare with his old railcard. He was questioned by someone upon his return. He immediately bought the 16-25 railcard the next day and has used it every since - although he doesn't really go to London all that often.

His letter is as follows and any advice is gratefully received. Although the letter advises him to seek legal counsel, I encouraged him to write an honest letter as it was an honest mistake.

Dear Sir/Madam:

For the attention of Andrew Chesson, Head of Revenue Protection

Yesterday 19th July I received a "Notice of Intended Prosecution" relating to an incident that occurred on 17th March 2024 and I wanted to reply as soon as possible to the Notice.

First and foremost, I am very sorry that this has happened. I made a genuine and honest mistake on what was a rare trip up to London for the day. I did speak to the gentleman who stopped me on my return to Beaconsfield to explain what had happened. I have set out below the situation and really want to express my apologies for my mistake.

On Sunday 17th March 2024, I took a train journey from Beaconsfield railway station to London Marylebone station and back and purchased a return travelcard. I attach a copy of my bank statement to show the transaction where I paid £13.50 for the fare.

I had been using a 16-17 Railcard (bought by my mum) having used it for over a year as a 16 and 17 year old boy. The mistake I made was that I had very recently turned 18 ( in February 2024) and it simply did not occur to me that, on buying my ticket that day, having just turned 18, it was no longer valid and I needed to purchase a 16-25 Railcard. It was only on speaking with the gentleman from the revenue protection staff on the platform that I realised what had happened.

Immediately after this incident, I bought a 16-25 Railcard, and have been using that ever since (a copy of the pass is attached).

I have never been involved in an incident like this before, have never knowingly or deliberately tried to avoid paying the appropriate rail fare and have taken this as a lesson to always check the rules and remind myself to think before buying a ticket so that nothing like this happens again.

I am very sorry that this has happened and hope it is clear from the above that I made a genuine mistake and have not and would not ever do something like this intentionally having had a 16-17 Railcard and also now have a 16-25 Railcard and always bought a day travelcard when using the railway. Since leaving school just last month I have been more aware of the need to check expiry dates on things like railcards and making a note to renew things when needed.

Yours faithfully,

XXX
 
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Gloster

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It would help the experts if you could post the notice that he received in this thread. Please obscure his name, address and any other identifying details, such as reference numbers.

I am afraid that it being an honest mistake will not cut much ice with Chiltern Railways. However, contacting a solicitor is unlikely to be necessary at this stage, although it would be expensive.
 
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It would help the experts if you could post the notice that he received in this thread. Please obscure his name, address and any other identifying details, such as reference numbers.

I am afraid that it being an honest mistake will not cut much ice with Chiltern Railways. However, contacting a solicitor is unlikely to be necessary at this stage, although it would be expensive.
Thank you - attaching the notice.
 

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Hadders

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Welcome to the forum!

This sounds like an unfortunate incident and really should've been dealth with by issuing a Penalty Fare rather than taking details. Although Chiltern historically are one of the more 'difficult' train companies I expect them to offer your son an out of court settlement. This typically costs around £150 plus the outstanding fare although I suspect that given his age they might offer a lower amount.

I think you son's letter is absolutely fine but I'd say wait a day or so before sending it on case any other forum members have any other suggestions. The only other thing to be aware of is have any other tickets been purchased since the railcard expired? If so Chiltern will research his onine ticketing account and might want to ask about these occasions as well.

Good luck, and do let us know how you get on.
 

CyrusWuff

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It would help the experts if you could post the notice that he received in this thread. Please obscure his name, address and any other identifying details, such as reference numbers.

I am afraid that it being an honest mistake will not cut much ice with Chiltern Railways. However, contacting a solicitor is unlikely to be necessary at this stage, although it would be expensive.
+1 If it was just a one-off mistake, engaging a Solicitor would just be throwing money away.

However, the OP should expect Chiltern to request their Son's purchase history from the retailer the Travelcard was bought from and ask for the undiscounted Anytime fare (£39.20 for a Beaconsfield Travelcard) plus a contribution to their costs to keep it out of Court.

I'd suggest attaching a shot of both the expired 16-17 Saver (and prior one if appropriate) and current 16-25 Railcard when sending the email, as that reduces the need for additional correspondence.
 

SuspectUsual

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I had been using a 16-17 Railcard (bought by my mum) having used it for over a year as a 16 and 17 year old boy. The mistake I made was that I had very recently turned 18

Isn’t a 16-17 railcard valid for a year or until the 18th birthday, whichever comes first?

If so, you might be better served making it clearer that you’ve had two of them, or if you’ve only had one amend it to remove the word over
 
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Welcome to the forum!

This sounds like an unfortunate incident and really should've been dealth with by issuing a Penalty Fare rather than taking details. Although Chiltern historically are one of the more 'difficult' train companies I expect them to offer your son an out of court settlement. This typically costs around £150 plus the outstanding fare although I suspect that given his age they might offer a lower amount.

I think you son's letter is absolutely fine but I'd say wait a day or so before sending it on case any other forum members have any other suggestions. The only other thing to be aware of is have any other tickets been purchased since the railcard expired? If so Chiltern will research his onine ticketing account and might want to ask about these occasions as well.

Good luck, and do let us know how you get on.
Thank you very much and I shall see if any other forum members have additional suggestions. I appreciate how helpful this forum is!

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+1 If it was just a one-off mistake, engaging a Solicitor would just be throwing money away.

However, the OP should expect Chiltern to request their Son's purchase history from the retailer the Travelcard was bought from and ask for the undiscounted Anytime fare (£39.20 for a Beaconsfield Travelcard) plus a contribution to their costs to keep it out of Court.

I'd suggest attaching a shot of both the expired 16-17 Saver (and prior one if appropriate) and current 16-25 Railcard when sending the email, as that reduces the need for additional correspondence.
I will ask my son for his expired 16-17 Saver railcard as well and include that. Thank you.
 
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Isn’t a 16-17 railcard valid for a year or until the 18th birthday, whichever comes first?

If so, you might be better served making it clearer that you’ve had two of them, or if you’ve only had one amend it to remove the word over
Good spot - I believe he only has had one. This is an 18 year old writing the email so his language isn't the clearest! Thank you for your suggested amendment.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Thank you very much and I shall see if any other forum members have additional suggestions. I appreciate how helpful this forum is!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==


I will ask my son for his expired 16-17 Saver railcard as well and include that. Thank you.
Thank you very much and I shall see if any other forum members have additional suggestions. I appreciate how helpful this forum is!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==


I will ask my son for his expired 16-17 Saver railcard as well and include that. Thank you.
Welcome to the forum!

This sounds like an unfortunate incident and really should've been dealth with by issuing a Penalty Fare rather than taking details. Although Chiltern historically are one of the more 'difficult' train companies I expect them to offer your son an out of court settlement. This typically costs around £150 plus the outstanding fare although I suspect that given his age they might offer a lower amount.

I think you son's letter is absolutely fine but I'd say wait a day or so before sending it on case any other forum members have any other suggestions. The only other thing to be aware of is have any other tickets been purchased since the railcard expired? If so Chiltern will research his onine ticketing account and might want to ask about these occasions as well.

Good luck, and do let us know how you get on.
Also - in terms of purchase history - as he only traveled to London maybe twice before that (once in December 2023 and once possibly in October 2023 - I'm still checking this), do you think level of detail is something he should just include in his reply?

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A very minor point of grammar. In British English, "Dear Sir or Madam" is followed by a comma, not a colon. (See e.g. https://www.sussex.ac.uk/informatics/punctuation/essaysandletters/letters)
Thank you!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

I have asked my son to revised his letter based on everyone's advice so far. He also has added a final couple of sentences to the end but I am not sure if this would be helpful. He wants to ask for the possibility of paying a fine.


Dear Sir/Madam,

For the attention of Andrew Chesson, Head of Revenue Protection.

Yesterday 19th July I received a "Notice of Intended Prosecution" relating to an incident that occurred on 17th March 2024 and I wanted to reply as soon as possible to the Notice. The Customer Reference number is xxxxxxxxx.

First and foremost, I am very sorry that this has happened. I made a genuine and honest mistake on what was a rare trip up to London for the day. I did speak to the gentleman who stopped me on my return to Beaconsfield to explain what had happened. I have set out below the situation and really want to express my apologies for my mistake.

On Sunday 17th March 2024, I took a train journey from Beaconsfield railway station to London Marylebone station and back and purchased a return travelcard. I attach a copy of my bank statement to show the transaction where I paid £13.50 for the fare.

I had been using a 16-17 Railcard (bought by my mum) having used it since I was about 16.5 years old. I attach my old railcard for your reference. The mistake I made on the 17th March was that I had very recently turned 18 (on 19th February) and it simply did not occur to me that, on buying my ticket that day, having just turned 18, my old railcard was no longer valid and I needed to purchase a 16-25 Railcard. It was only on speaking with the gentleman from the revenue protection staff on the platform that I realised what had happened.

Immediately after this incident, I bought a 16-25 Railcard, and have been using that ever since (a copy of the pass is attached).

I have never been involved in an incident like this before, have never knowingly or deliberately tried to avoid paying the appropriate rail fare and have taken this as a lesson to always check the rules and remind myself to think before buying a ticket so that nothing like this happens again.

I am very sorry that this has happened and hope it is clear from the above that I made a genuine mistake and have not and would not ever do something like this intentionally having had a 16-17 Railcard and also now have a 16-25 Railcard and have always bought a day travelcard when using the railway. Since leaving school just last month I have been more aware of the need to check expiry dates on things like railcards and making a note to renew things when needed.

Would it be possible for me to pay a fine for my mistake? I don't have a lot of money but I am trying to earn some this summer now that I have finished school and I can ask to borrow from my parents. Thank you for considering my situation and I hope to hear from you soon.

Yours faithfully,
 
Last edited:

Hadders

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This is an 18 year old writing the email so his language isn't the clearest!
We see many appallingly written draft replies on here. This reply very well written, well done to your son!

One thing I would add is I assume he's in the 6th form (or whatever it's called these days), maybe just finished A levels. If I'm correct I'd mention that he's in the 6th form, I normally don't recommend telling a sob story but I don't think it'll harm in this case. I think it's good that your son is taking responsibility for this and if he makes it clear that he's in the 6th form then it might just lessen the admin fee.
 
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We see many appallingly written draft replies on here. This reply very well written, well done to your son!

One thing I would add is I assume he's in the 6th form (or whatever it's called these days), maybe just finished A levels. If I'm correct I'd mention that he's in the 6th form, I normally don't recommend telling a sob story but I don't think it'll harm in this case. I think it's good that your son is taking responsibility for this and if he makes it clear that he's in the 6th form then it might just lessen the admin fee.
Thank you. I think he has worked hard on the letter and wants to make sure it makes sense as I think he writing it whilst very stressed. Yes, my son has just finished his A Levels and is waiting for his results. So he left the sixth form only this month. So I will ask him to include that detail as well. Thank you for suggesting it.
 

Hadders

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It does read as though he's put some effort into it and I'm confident he'll get a favourable outcome from Chiltern.
 

WesternLancer

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Good spot - I believe he only has had one. This is an 18 year old writing the email so his language isn't the clearest! Thank you for your suggested amendment.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==




Also - in terms of purchase history - as he only traveled to London maybe twice before that (once in December 2023 and once possibly in October 2023 - I'm still checking this), do you think level of detail is something he should just include in his reply?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==


Thank you!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

I have asked my son to revised his letter based on everyone's advice so far. He also has added a final couple of sentences to the end but I am not sure if this would be helpful. He wants to ask for the possibility of paying a fine.


Dear Sir/Madam,

For the attention of Andrew Chesson, Head of Revenue Protection.

Yesterday 19th July I received a "Notice of Intended Prosecution" relating to an incident that occurred on 17th March 2024 and I wanted to reply as soon as possible to the Notice. The Customer Reference number is xxxxxxxxx.

First and foremost, I am very sorry that this has happened. I made a genuine and honest mistake on what was a rare trip up to London for the day. I did speak to the gentleman who stopped me on my return to Beaconsfield to explain what had happened. I have set out below the situation and really want to express my apologies for my mistake.

On Sunday 17th March 2024, I took a train journey from Beaconsfield railway station to London Marylebone station and back and purchased a return travelcard. I attach a copy of my bank statement to show the transaction where I paid £13.50 for the fare.

I had been using a 16-17 Railcard (bought by my mum) having used it since I was about 16.5 years old. I attach my old railcard for your reference. The mistake I made on the 17th March was that I had very recently turned 18 (on 19th February) and it simply did not occur to me that, on buying my ticket that day, having just turned 18, my old railcard was no longer valid and I needed to purchase a 16-25 Railcard. It was only on speaking with the gentleman from the revenue protection staff on the platform that I realised what had happened.

Immediately after this incident, I bought a 16-25 Railcard, and have been using that ever since (a copy of the pass is attached).

I have never been involved in an incident like this before, have never knowingly or deliberately tried to avoid paying the appropriate rail fare and have taken this as a lesson to always check the rules and remind myself to think before buying a ticket so that nothing like this happens again.

I am very sorry that this has happened and hope it is clear from the above that I made a genuine mistake and have not and would not ever do something like this intentionally having had a 16-17 Railcard and also now have a 16-25 Railcard and have always bought a day travelcard when using the railway. Since leaving school just last month I have been more aware of the need to check expiry dates on things like railcards and making a note to renew things when needed.

Would it be possible for me to pay a fine for my mistake? I don't have a lot of money but I am trying to earn some this summer now that I have finished school and I can ask to borrow from my parents. Thank you for considering my situation and I hope to hear from you soon.

Yours faithfully,
I don’t think he should end it by asking to pay a fine.

Perhaps better to use a phrase like eg ‘pay in respect of any fare owed and your costs in looking into this’

The usual advice is to request settling the matter without court action which would be another option for ending the letter.

Hope this helps a bit if you wish to consider it.
 
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I don’t think he should end it by asking to pay a fine.

Perhaps better to use a phrase like eg ‘pay in respect of any fare owed and your costs in looking into this’

The usual advice is to request settling the matter without court action which would be another option for ending the letter.

Hope this helps a bit if you wish to consider it.
Thank you - I'll think about this. I guess it's a balance of allowing my son to use his own words, but also wanting to make sure he is clear and speaking in a language that the reviewer will understand and engage with positively.
 

WesternLancer

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Thank you - I'll think about this. I guess it's a balance of allowing my son to use his own words, but also wanting to make sure he is clear and speaking in a language that the reviewer will understand and engage with positively.
Yes.
See what others think but it’s potentially quite an important distinction. The railway issues Penalty Fares on the spot (these seem like fines of course) but does not issue them later, or it seeks to recoup fares not paid plus costs (at a punitive fare level ) in out of court settlements or it prosecutes and lets the court fine people.

In this part of the letter it’s not so much about your son using his own words it’s more about using forum knowledge to help him get the terminology correct ref what the railway does. Of course this is in my opinion.
 

SuspectUsual

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Its a tiny, tiny point in the wider context of a really well written letter, but I'd be tempted to remove the "and ask to borrow money from my parents" phrase - its preceded by "earn some money" which is proactive and brilliant, and to me that's enough in itself. Mentioning borrowing from the bank of mum and dad waters that down a bit in my eyes
 
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Yes.
See what others think but it’s potentially quite an important distinction. The railway issues Penalty Fares on the spot (these seem like fines of course) but does not issue them later, or it seeks to recoup fares not paid plus costs (at a punitive fare level ) in out of court settlements or it prosecutes and lets the court fine people.

In this part of the letter it’s not so much about your son using his own words it’s more about using forum knowledge to help him get the terminology correct ref what the railway does. Of course this is in my opinion.
Good point. We definitely would want to is settled out of court. Thank you.

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Its a tiny, tiny point in the wider context of a really well written letter, but I'd be tempted to remove the "and ask to borrow money from my parents" phrase - its preceded by "earn some money" which is proactive and brilliant, and to me that's enough in itself. Mentioning borrowing from the bank of mum and dad waters that down a bit in my eyes
Okay I will relay that to him as I thought the same but he wanted to get the “forum’s view” on this. Thank you.

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Thank you for everyone's help and input. My son has now emailed the letter to Chiltern Railways. I will let you know the outcome of this so that it may be helpful to others in the future.
 
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WesternLancer

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Good point. We definitely would want to is settled out of court. Thank you.

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Okay I will relay that to him as I thought the same but he wanted to get the “forum’s view” on this. Thank you.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Thank you for everyone's help and input. My son has now emailed the letter to Chiltern Railways. I will let you know the outcome of this so that it may be helpful to others in the future.
Well done for getting it sent - of all the railway companies seen on here I think it's fair to say Chiltern take the toughest line - not sure if they have changed their arrangements to doing it in house but previously they have used a contractor called TIL for dealing with much of their fares irregularity work and we regularly saw people needing to write more than once to ask for settlements as TIL would often bat them back 1st time to say 'no' - so be prepared for this and head back here if more advice needed. Ultimately most of those cases did seem to get settlements but it took more work.

Take steps to ensure the e-mail got received (eg did it generate an auto reply for example) - if in doubt also post a hard copy via Royal Mail 'signed for' service and keep proof of delivery
 
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Well done for getting it sent - of all the railway companies seen on here I think it's fair to say Chiltern take the toughest line - not sure if they have changed their arrangements to doing it in house but previously they have used a contractor called TIL for dealing with much of their fares irregularity work and we regularly saw people needing to write more than once to ask for settlements as TIL would often bat them back 1st time to say 'no' - so be prepared for this and head back here if more advice needed. Ultimately most of those cases did seem to get settlements but it took more work.

Take steps to ensure the e-mail got received (eg did it generate an auto reply for example) - if in doubt also post a hard copy via Royal Mail 'signed for' service and keep proof of delivery
Thank you - that's good advice to also send via Royal Mail. I'll ask my son if he got confirmation. And will keep everyone posted on what happens next.

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Thank you - that's good advice to also send via Royal Mail. I'll ask my son if he got confirmation. And will keep everyone posted on what happens next.
And as a follow up, my son did receive an email confirmation of receipt of his letter and it said not to contact them any further until he hears back. So now we enter the waiting game.
 
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WesternLancer

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Thank you - that's good advice to also send via Royal Mail. I'll ask my son if he got confirmation. And will keep everyone posted on what happens next.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==


And as a follow up, my son did receive an email confirmation of receipt of his letter and it said not to contact them any further until he hears back. So now we enter the waiting game.
That's good - at least you know it's safely received and in the system.
 
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