tatitiliti
Member
And again tonight, some train fault causing most services to be cancelled (on one of the single track stretches between Littleport and Kings Lynn by the looks of it?)
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Experiences of service recovery (or lack of) on GTR Great Northern
- Thread starter Failed Unit
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An_Engineer
Member
- Joined
- 14 Feb 2018
- Messages
- 47
As a heads up to everyone, sadly a person was hit by a train in between Potter's Bar and Welwyn Garden City. Currently severe disruption on all lines going through the area, expected to last until 5pm/beginning of rush hour.
I'm guessing even after everything is fully cleared we will get a partial/disrupted Great Northern/GTR service for the rest of the day.
I'm guessing even after everything is fully cleared we will get a partial/disrupted Great Northern/GTR service for the rest of the day.
So tragic that in less than a week there have been three passengers hit by trains between New Southgate and Hatfield.
BBC News website has this today:
www.bbc.co.uk
Norfolk: Trains have never been worse say passengers
Travellers say the problems have made them late for work and miss hospital appointments
www.bbc.co.uk
Intercity_225
Member
Has it ever been what the customers 'rightly expect'?
The 0815 Letchworth to London Kings Cross skipped stops and did not gain back any time
Has it ever been what the customers 'rightly expect'?
No, though it has moved from 'extremely poor' before the December 2025 timetable change to 'totally unacceptable', and then, incredibly, worse still to 'complete disaster' over the last few months.
Of course they are now using 'hot weather' as an excuse, as if the service was perfectly fine before June
Look at this week for example - the 0946 Ely-KGX was cancelled *again* today, third time this week (and it is only Thursday!).
tatitiliti
Member
It has very little to do with hot weather and everything to do with 379 issues, timetable fallibility and general infrastructure issues.No, though it has moved from 'extremely poor' before the December 2025 timetable change to 'totally unacceptable', and then, incredibly, worse still to 'complete disaster' over the last few months.
Of course they are now using 'hot weather' as an excuse, as if the service was perfectly fine before June
Look at this week for example - the 0946 Ely-KGX was cancelled *again* today, third time this week (and it is only Thursday!).
tatitiliti
Member
When it was the Fenman in the 60s and cost £1 from Lynn to London, then I would say so!Has it ever been what the customers 'rightly expect'?
Magdalen Road
Member
As noted here previously, I track my season ticket travel (and also additional journeys, discounted travel, delay repay compensation etc.).
Here's 2025 (full) and 2026 (to date for comparison). 2026 delays have now exceeded the whole of 2025 and there's still 4 months to go.
It is the journey home that has a significant increase in delays, these being primarily cancelled trains, so 30+ mins delayed.
50% of my commutes in 2025 were delayed, 55% so far in 2026.
Here's 2025 (full) and 2026 (to date for comparison). 2026 delays have now exceeded the whole of 2025 and there's still 4 months to go.
It is the journey home that has a significant increase in delays, these being primarily cancelled trains, so 30+ mins delayed.
50% of my commutes in 2025 were delayed, 55% so far in 2026.
| 2026 (to end August) | 2025 | |
| Commuting hours of delays | 18.15 hours | 17.54 hours |
| Number of work commutes delayed | 38 | 56 |
| Number of home commutes delayed | 38 | 37 |
| Minutes delay to work trip | 311 | 533 |
| Minutes delay to home trip | 778 | 519 |
| Other journeys delayed (combined total) | 4 hours | 3.5 hours |
Ely to Kings Lynn fell over *yet again* tonight, apparently due to damage to the overhead wires - they don't seem to be offering much information about where or how, though they are saying for tomorrow morning's 'service' that 'Some trains also require repairs and a reduced number of train units will be available to run in the morning.', so the implication is that something (presumably a 379) has done something bad again. From RTT, trains seemed to get to/from Kings Lynn fine until about 1800 and then just stopped, nothing appeared to be stranded so not entirely sure what has happened.
This line must be a very good candidate for the 'things that go wrong most often' award.
As usual GN have decided to declare they have given up serving Cambridge to Ely as well, despite the fact there are no issues on this section. Though actually their warning that 'No Great Northern services will run between Cambridge and Kings Lynn until the end of the day' isn't entirely true, as 1T52 (the 1824 KGX-KLN) did run as far as Ely, which I was rather pleased about as I was on it trying to get home. It then sat at Ely for 1.5 hours before taking the path of 1T65 from there, though for some reason it only then got as far as Cambridge. 1T60 (the 2024 KGX-ELY) appears to have got to Ely as well, forming 1T67 back to KGX.
Even before the regularly-scheduled meltdown, the service wasn't exactly stellar, with 4 trains in a row from Ely towards London all cancelled (the 1151, 1251 and 1317 all didn't run, and the 1217 left 22 minutes late and only got as far as Cambridge). I was actually going for the 1151 so this cancellation was fairly irritating. I ended up on the WAML instead, with GA running a good service as usual.
This line must be a very good candidate for the 'things that go wrong most often' award.
As usual GN have decided to declare they have given up serving Cambridge to Ely as well, despite the fact there are no issues on this section. Though actually their warning that 'No Great Northern services will run between Cambridge and Kings Lynn until the end of the day' isn't entirely true, as 1T52 (the 1824 KGX-KLN) did run as far as Ely, which I was rather pleased about as I was on it trying to get home. It then sat at Ely for 1.5 hours before taking the path of 1T65 from there, though for some reason it only then got as far as Cambridge. 1T60 (the 2024 KGX-ELY) appears to have got to Ely as well, forming 1T67 back to KGX.
Even before the regularly-scheduled meltdown, the service wasn't exactly stellar, with 4 trains in a row from Ely towards London all cancelled (the 1151, 1251 and 1317 all didn't run, and the 1217 left 22 minutes late and only got as far as Cambridge). I was actually going for the 1151 so this cancellation was fairly irritating. I ended up on the WAML instead, with GA running a good service as usual.
Pretty much what the "internal" (available to GA staff, including those who operate Cambridge/Ely) info says. There' is no information or indication of where or how the damage occurred.
RailwayRookie
Member
But what about the passengers divine right to know every intricate detail, they must be told!!
If the information says no trains Cambridge to Kings Lynn, why does it matter to them where in that section the damage is?
While it is true that they dont know how or where the damage is occuring, 5Z00 is plying the line as we speak checking the state of things. Which one would argue is better than running a full service and pitentially damaging more trains.
Its unfortunate it has happened on a Bank Holiday though as it made sourcing replacement busses impossible.
tatitiliti
Member
I mean, given we’re paying the salaries of railway staff through compulsory fares and tax, I think an explanation from said staff as to why our contracted journey is not being fulfilled despite on a line where there are no issues is justified really.
Magdalen Road
Member
All trains from Ely to Kings Cross cancelled this morning, the first scheduled to run is 0747 (first should have been 0521).
No taxis or buses available.
Having got the 0553 to Cambridge (London Liverpool Street), in on P1 and went for the 0621 Brighton to St Pancras P7. It's departure time came and went, the train did not.
30 seconds before the 0625 Kings Cross semi-fast departed, finally an announcement"we're waiting for a relief driver". Cue swift exit by many passengers and thankfully, across to P8 for the KGX.
Looking at RTT the 0621 Brighton eventually departed 12 mins late.
At the point passengers were transferring from P1 to P7 why did no one say, by the way, the Brighton driver isn't here so you might want to get the Kings Cross instead?
Edit: there is also a level crossing failure south of Royston, so more delays as trains are having to go through very slowly.
No taxis or buses available.
Having got the 0553 to Cambridge (London Liverpool Street), in on P1 and went for the 0621 Brighton to St Pancras P7. It's departure time came and went, the train did not.
30 seconds before the 0625 Kings Cross semi-fast departed, finally an announcement"we're waiting for a relief driver". Cue swift exit by many passengers and thankfully, across to P8 for the KGX.
Looking at RTT the 0621 Brighton eventually departed 12 mins late.
At the point passengers were transferring from P1 to P7 why did no one say, by the way, the Brighton driver isn't here so you might want to get the Kings Cross instead?
Edit: there is also a level crossing failure south of Royston, so more delays as trains are having to go through very slowly.
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Failed Unit
Established Member
I don’t understand why they are not running to Ely. Unless it is typical GTR style of not telling passengers the whole truth. (Ok it isn’t GTR any more it is nationalised. However it has as yet not changed the “you are on your own” philosophy when disruption happens.
Indeed - there may not be platform space to run 2tph, but why can't they at least run those that terminate/start at Ely? But they're not - the 0946 is cancelled (yet again!) as are the 1051 snd 1151.
The simple fact is that they just don't care, or are deeply incompetent, or both. This whole thread ought to be ample evidence of that.
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I think those of us who have had to put up with this 'service' for the last few months deserve a medal, never mind accurate information.
In this case, I feel we at least are owed an explanation as to why the previous, very disruptive set of repairs have apparently failed, requiring another closure and another round of 'pantograph repairs', and why they are going to get it right this time so it doesn't happen yet again.
Here's the latest ORR stats for Ely. Let's be blunt - if your cancellation figure is almost 20% and your punctuality is even worse than the infamous Norwich-Liverpool services are managing, we need to be asking serious questions as to what is going on and how things are going to be turned around.
(chart from ORR showing performance metrics for Ely with appallingly bad figures for GTR)
Magdalen Road
Member
There are no fast Kings Cross to Cambridge or Ely after 1424 until 2000. Six hours.
There is only the Birmingham and Norwich trains running between Cambridge and Ely.
How am I going get home? Fight my way onto a Norwich service against hundreds of other passengers?
There is only the Birmingham and Norwich trains running between Cambridge and Ely.
How am I going get home? Fight my way onto a Norwich service against hundreds of other passengers?
Just to help things along, the random unit generator has thrown out a diagram today on the Norwich-Stansted that is 3 carriages rather than 4 (due to operate the 1730 off Cambridge to Ely, that'll be lovely). And XC have at least three diagrams on the Birminghams that are 2 carriages instead of 3 (the 1000, 1100 and 1400 off Cambridge).
GN do seem to have managed to get 1T24 to Ely, albeit 15 minutes late. So the 1251 from Ely may actually run, first GN service since the 0747 and the second they've managed to run all day.
tatitiliti
Member
These people are just unbelievable…
bramling
Veteran Member
The whole TSGN operation really is appalling. Last week they put out a promo video on Facebook extolling the virtues of travelling by Thameslink over the bank holiday weekend - good luck getting a train on a lot of the GN route over much of the weekend due to engineering work.
Meanwhile there’s another video about upgrades to Elstree & Borehamwood station - which might as well read “sorry your train service is so awful, but look we’ve wasted a load of money making your booking hall look like a primary school playgroup with bookshelves and a new interactive screen”
What is depressing is there doesn’t seem to be any sign whatsoever of any improvement since renationalisation, which suggests one or both of two things - either the leadership is essentially unchanged, and/or the operation was already so heavily being dictated to by the DFT.
Failed Unit
Established Member
I was very surprised by two things I say this morning.
The 0738 Welwyn Garden City - London Kings Cross (Ex Royston) was heavily delayed by a level crossing incident. They ran it non-stop from Welwyn Garden City and even more surprisingly they put it on the fast. As a knock on of this the 0800 Welwyn Garden City - Sevenoaks was delayed because the driver was on the ex-Royston. (Which really doesn’t give much margin for error). Again they ran it non-stop and put it on the fast at Marshmoor. I don’t know why they didn’t stop at Hatfield considering it was up the rear of another service that did.
This is the first time I have known services that are running fast actually not follow a Moorgate service and just get later. Maybe it was because the Kings Lynn trains were missing. But it was nice to see an attempt to recover the service for a change.
The 0738 Welwyn Garden City - London Kings Cross (Ex Royston) was heavily delayed by a level crossing incident. They ran it non-stop from Welwyn Garden City and even more surprisingly they put it on the fast. As a knock on of this the 0800 Welwyn Garden City - Sevenoaks was delayed because the driver was on the ex-Royston. (Which really doesn’t give much margin for error). Again they ran it non-stop and put it on the fast at Marshmoor. I don’t know why they didn’t stop at Hatfield considering it was up the rear of another service that did.
This is the first time I have known services that are running fast actually not follow a Moorgate service and just get later. Maybe it was because the Kings Lynn trains were missing. But it was nice to see an attempt to recover the service for a change.
bramling
Veteran Member
It does happen - they ran a late Letchworth-KX service non-stop all the way a couple of weeks ago. Snag was, they then managed to hold it outside KX for several minutes on both the incoming and outgoing journeys, both completely avoidably, so there still ended up being a delay to the next service, which of course then managed to clash with something in the Hitchin area.
tatitiliti
Member
If this were in London (or now urban Greater Manchester as well), it either wouldn’t have happened or would’ve been fixed instantly.
bramling
Veteran Member
I wouldn’t lay too much on that one. TFL has plenty of its own issues - how often nowadays do we see “delays due to train cancellations”, and that’s before one considers long-standing issues like Central and Jubilee fleets, Piccadilly autumn issues, DLR fleet replacement, Fit For The Future Stations, etc.
In the end they did manage to run a handful of Ely terminators in the early afternoon. But everything pretty much stopped again once the evening rushhour began - looks like they've run a whole one train to Ely and back since 1700. Terribly helpful that they managed to run trains in the quiet mid-afternoon, but almost nothing in the morning or evening peaks...
I have absolutely no idea why they don't have an off-the-shelf plan for when Ely to Kings Lynn falls over, given it does so multiple times every week. Or if they do, why they don't implement it. They seem to think it is fine to abandon Ely to Cambridge because GA and XC serve this section too, without putting any thought into the facts that it is hard to fit so many people into 5-7 carriages an hour (when there are usually at least 21), and that the GA and XC services thin out considerably as the evening progresses, and that without GN Waterbeach is pretty much left without any service, and that without GN the service at Cambridge North is just 1tph for most of the day in the Ely direction as the XCs don't stop at CMB.
I also dread to think how much this is costing the taxpayer in terms of taxis - both Cambridge and Ely appeared to be dispatching queues of people via taxi for stations towards Kings Lynn, which has become an increasingly common sight over the last year or so.
Magdalen Road
Member
No London trains from Ely until the 0747 again; that service is running late too. They are managing to start at Kings Lynn though.
I was lucky to get the only afternoon north bound service from KGX yesterday. Good job, as the KGX-PBO-ELY alternative (avoiding reduced trains at CBG) was affected by signal/points failure at Manea.
I was lucky to get the only afternoon north bound service from KGX yesterday. Good job, as the KGX-PBO-ELY alternative (avoiding reduced trains at CBG) was affected by signal/points failure at Manea.
Well, they managed to run two trains from KLN and then the service fell over again. GN say 'Services had resumed earlier today following overnight testing. However, recent checks have shown that more testing and inspections are needed before trains can safely run through the area again.' Hurray!
tatitiliti
Member
In their defence, they ran zero yesterday, so they’re making solid progress day by day - maybe we’ll get 4 tomorrow?