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Incident between Wigan Wallgate and Southport (29th August 2026)

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Halwynd

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Just to clarify, was it a Northern train that had only recently left from Southport, or a train on its way into Southport? The BBC report, linked to in post #19 by @Halwynd, suggests the latter.

I usually try to link to articles from the BBC because of their perceived accuracy and the lack of adverts and other nasties from local news websites. Once upon a time you used to be able to rely on the accuracy of the BBC, and at the time their article contained some new photographs. Nevertheless, lesson learned.

As others have said, the train was the 15:03 Southport - Manchester Oxford Road. There's a stream called Langley's Brook in the foreground of pictures of the train published in the Liverpool Echo. If the train had been coming from Wigan you wouldn't have been able to see it.
 
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RailUK Forums

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Presumably the BBC was reporting what BTP had told them? Also Northern were saying that Peak ticket restrictions would no longer apply. Surely there is no "Peak" on a Saturday?
 

IanMac

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Much of this thread has been taken up with:

- establishing that the train was not what the BBC (quoting BTP) said it was; and

- irrelevant information from Northern about peaktime fares.

In other words, correcting/improving information supplied by organisations that can and should do better - even on the Saturday afternoon of a Bank Holiday weekend.
 

Northerngirl

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The utter lack of information about this really not helping, especially with the airshow on.

There should be very clear updates on what's going on, other than a couple of twitter posts from northern about 'disruption' I have seen nothing. Imagine the outrage if Lewes was reported on like this.
 

Rail2002

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Considering it was a 769 involved in the incident doesn't this create a headache for Northern regarding whether it can be repaired or not? Are spare parts for 769s hard to come by or is there any way of getting them?

For example if it needs a new cab it will need to be sent away long term for this to be done and has Northern got enough resilience in the fleet cope with one 769 missing?
There doesn't appear to be any structural damage to the train. A supply of cab domes is kept for if they need replacing. Trains are designed to hit large objects and survive the impact.
 

Bow Fell

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The utter lack of information about this really not helping, especially with the airshow on,
there should be very clear updates on what's going on, other than a couple of twitter posts from northern about 'disruption' i have seen nothing. Imagine the outrage if lewes was reported on like this.

Took me 30 seconds, to look and find out.

Buses replace trains between Wigan Wallgate and Southport until the end of the day

Incident reported: Saturday 29 August 2026 at 16:04

If you would like to follow this incident on X, please use #Southport
 
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Rail Ranger

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The trouble is these days people tend to go to TOC websites first and not even think about the National Rail website.
 

Bow Fell

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I managed to find all the info on there with no issue as well, with all the details about alternative transport.
 

Halwynd

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The trouble is these days people tend to go to TOC websites first and not even think about the National Rail website.

I don't blame them to be honest, even though it covers the whole country, the National Rail website is full of adverts and autoplay videos - I really dislike it and avoid using it if I can.

Rail travel information is ridiculously fragmented though. Do passengers go to the TOC website, Journeycheck, Twitter, other social media sites, National Rail? The railway needs a one-stop bespoke facility rather than all this nonsense and hopefully GBR will recognise this.
 

Hophead

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I visit the National Rail Status and Disruptions page frequently enough that my browser will get me there pretty much as soon as I start typing. I find it simple to use and is a useful guide to likely delays.
 

deepthought

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I use an ad blocker and don't have all those annoying ads and if you want to support a favourite site you can allow ads for that site only.
I agree with you on the auto play videos but at least it warns you on the main service disruption page so you can get ready to stop them.
 

JBuchananGB

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This incident is still not a "Major Disruption" on the Northern web site. You can find it in "Other Updates" in the "Good Service" section after scrolling past eight routes which probably do have a good service!
 

cin88

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There's quite a few user worked crossings in that geographical area that get frequently misused, Martins Lane is probably second to one of the user worked crossings I used to control in that respect. It was only a matter of time before something tragic happened.

The RAIB are involved in this incident.
 

Halwynd

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I use an ad blocker and don't have all those annoying ads and if you want to support a favourite site you can allow ads for that site only.
I agree with you on the auto play videos but at least it warns you on the main service disruption page so you can get ready to stop them.

I use the Wipr adblocker; it normally works well but has no user control and seems to be a bit fussy with the National Rail website unfortunately.

This incident is still not a "Major Disruption" on the Northern web site. You can find it in "Other Updates" in the "Good Service" section after scrolling past eight routes which probably do have a good service!

Ridiculous isn't it? I've seen serious Southport line disruption treated by Northern as 'good service' many times before though.
 

gray1404

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There's quite a few user worked crossings in that geographical area that get frequently misused, Martins Lane is probably second to one of the user worked crossings I used to control in that respect. It was only a matter of time before something tragic happened.

The RAIB are involved in this incident.
Although I've travelled on that line many times as I live a few miles outside of Southport, I've no idea what the workings of the crossings are. I know when I've been on a service I've heard a siren going as the train goes through a crossing.

I've no idea what gates and signage are there for both pedestrians and road users. In my experience of other crossings on the network, the signage tends to be very predominant and meets the standards wherever you are in the country.

As for the workings of these crossings, are they "stop, look and listen (beware of trains)" self-managed crossings for those on foot? Where as do those in a vehicle need to phone the signaler for permission to cross? By the sounds of it it's expected, rightly so, that those using these crossing close the gates behind them so there is a physical barrier to stop the next person straying onto the crossing without them realising it as a live railway line?

Perhaps those with a bit more local knowledge then myself might be able to give some insight as to the workings of crossings in the area on the West Lancashire line?
 

marshlinker

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There's quite a few user worked crossings in that geographical area that get frequently misused, Martins Lane is probably second to one of the user worked crossings I used to control in that respect. It was only a matter of time before something tragic happened.

The RAIB are involved in this incident.
It must be quite marginal that that crossing can be classed as a user working crossing, according to the Ordanance Survey map that is a public road right up to the crossing, then a private road and public footpath to multiple premises.
Looking at the video of it on you tube reckon the RAIB will be commenting on the signage
 

cin88

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Although I've travelled on that line many times as I live a few miles outside of Southport, I've no idea what the workings of the crossings are. I know when I've been on a service I've heard a siren going as the train goes through a crossing.

I've no idea what gates and signage are there for both pedestrians and road users. In my experience of other crossings on the network, the signage tends to be very predominant and meets the standards wherever you are in the country.

As for the workings of these crossings, are they "stop, look and listen (beware of trains)" self-managed crossings for those on foot? Where as do those in a vehicle need to phone the signaler for permission to cross? By the sounds of it it's expected, rightly so, that those using these crossing close the gates behind them so there is a physical barrier to stop the next person straying onto the crossing without them realising it as a live railway line?

Perhaps those with a bit more local knowledge then myself might be able to give some insight as to the workings of crossings in the area on the West Lancashire line?

Its a red/green user worked crossing with an added klaxon to warn crossing users of an approaching train. Anyone in a large/low/slow moving vehicle or transporting animals on foot (livestock and horses) is supposed to use the phone for permission to cross. Anyone on foot or in your average car or van simply only has to wait for the light to be green before starting the crossing procedure. If the lights are failed for whatever reason then the crossing reverts to a standard user worked crossing with telephone and users are expected to contact the signaller or crossing keeper for permission to cross.

It must be quite marginal that that crossing can be classed as a user working crossing, according to the Ordanance Survey map that is a public road right up to the crossing, then a private road and public footpath to multiple premises.
Looking at the video of it on you tube reckon the RAIB will be commenting on the signage

The status of the road is of little relevance when it comes to crossings.

Astley on the Chat Moss has a similar road arrangement yet is still a "stop, look, listen" style user worked crossing with sometimes over 20 trains an hour going over it and is quite busy with road traffic, the only thing stopping a user opening the gates with a train approaching is an electric lock operated by the signaller.

In contrast, Chapel Lane in Parbold is an Obstacle Detection crossing with full barriers despite only getting one or two vehicles a day, before then it was a gated crossing with a Crossing Keeper on site.
 

gray1404

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Looking at the video above only, it appears to be clear if the gates are closed. They act as a barrier / deterrent.

The lady on the train who spoke to the Liverpool Echo described what she saw. Namely the supermarket delivery van approaching the crossing without stopping and she preempted the collision. This makes me wonder if the previous user of the crossing left the gates wide open. If so they have blood on their hands for their error!

If the gates were wide open a distracted or non alert road user could, in their error, drive straight onto the crossing without realising and without checking for trains.
 

43096

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Looking at the video above only, it appears to be clear if the gates are closed. They act as a barrier / deterrent. The lady on the train who spoke to the Liverpool Echo described what she saw. Namely the supermarket delivery van approaching the crossing without stopping and she preempted the collision. This makes me wonder if the previous user of the crossing left the gates wide open. If so they have blood on their hands for their error! If the gates were wide open a distracted or non alert road user could, in their error, drive straight onto the crossing without realising and without checking for trains.
More critically, was the red light showing? Regardless of the position of the gates, if the crossing light is red, you stop.
 

dk1

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Looking at the video above only, it appears to be clear if the gates are closed. They act as a barrier / deterrent. The lady on the train who spoke to the Liverpool Echo described what she saw. Namely the supermarket delivery van approaching the crossing without stopping and she preempted the collision. This makes me wonder if the previous user of the crossing left the gates wide open. If so they have blood on their hands for their error! If the gates were wide open a distracted or non alert road user could, in their error, drive straight onto the crossing without realising and without checking for trains.
CCTV is provided at the crossing so may be able to see who failed to close them.
 

Rail2002

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Looking at the video above only, it appears to be clear if the gates are closed. They act as a barrier / deterrent. The lady on the train who spoke to the Liverpool Echo described what she saw. Namely the supermarket delivery van approaching the crossing without stopping and she preempted the collision. This makes me wonder if the previous user of the crossing left the gates wide open. If so they have blood on their hands for their error! If the gates were wide open a distracted or non alert road user could, in their error, drive straight onto the crossing without realising and without checking for trains.
It's up to the road user to observe the signals. I strongly suspect but am not certain that the van was going in the south bound direction, as the woman in the Echo seemed confident that the van driver would have seen the train.

However, I can see how a member of the public could mistake the gate being open for a "safe to cross" signal.

It's a tragic loss of life.

There is signage in the area to advise road users how to cross safely and warn of the dangers. It's clear from the video posted upthread that trains can pass through at high speed.

I suppose the facts need to be established before we can conclude what happened. The RAIB will be going over it all with a fine tooth comb.
 

david l

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1Z99 22.00 Southport-Springs Branch booked for tonight.
769450 has been at Southport, being the train booked behind 2O79 and will presumably be used to assist in the removal of 769434 as normally only a 769 can rescue a 769, train is booked nearly 4 hours before reaching SP, arrived 02.18 31/8.

Mon 31/8
Confirmed at SP and partially visible from passing trains, with 'front' door missing.
 
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Bevan Price

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Its a red/green user worked crossing with an added klaxon to warn crossing users of an approaching train. Anyone in a large/low/slow moving vehicle or transporting animals on foot (livestock and horses) is supposed to use the phone for permission to cross. Anyone on foot or in your average car or van simply only has to wait for the light to be green before starting the crossing procedure. If the lights are failed for whatever reason then the crossing reverts to a standard user worked crossing with telephone and users are expected to contact the signaller or crossing keeper for permission to cross.



The status of the road is of little relevance when it comes to crossings. Astley on the Chat Moss has a similar road arrangement yet is still a "stop, look, listen" style user worked crossing with sometimes over 20 trains an hour going over it and is quite busy with road traffic, the only thing stopping a user opening the gates with a train approaching is an electric lock operated by the signaller. In contrast, Chapel Lane in Parbold is an Obstacle Detection crossing with full barriers despite only getting one or two vehicles a day, before then it was a gated crossing with a Crossing Keeper on site.
I have taken photos at Astley several times, and whilst users are supposed to close the gates after crossing. However, perhaps 5-10% are too lazy to close the gates, and the signalman has to come out of the box to close the gates. At the incident site, there are no staff to close the gates.
 

cin88

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I have taken photos at Astley several times, and whilst users are supposed to close the gates after crossing. However, perhaps 5-10% are too lazy to close the gates, and the signalman has to come out of the box to close the gates. At the incident site, there are no staff to close the gates.

Yes I am fully aware of how both Astley and Martins Lane operate given that I've worked in both areas, albeit only geographically in Martins Lane's case as I was based in a box on the other railway line in the area which happens to have two crossings with similar arrangements, one of which is one of the most misused crossings in the north west.

I can tell you its a lot more than 10% that don't shut those gates at Astley, just getting people that do close them to do so correctly is a particular source of irritation for the signallers :D The relief staff loathe the place.

As for the stricken unit's current destination of Springs Branch, I'm fairly certain that the 769s are actually based there. Northern went to a lot of effort setting up a maintenance depot there for what were then their class 319s.
 

Statto

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Locals saying the gates on that crossing are regularly left open by users

An investigation is continuing into how a delivery vehicle and a train collided on a crossing, killing a van driver.
The incident happened off Martin Lane and Whitehouse Lane in Burscough, West Lancashire, on Saturday at about 15:00 GMT, when a train from Southport to Manchester collided with what is understood to be a supermarket delivery vehicle.
People living in the area have told the BBC that it was not uncommon for the gate on the crossing to be left open at times by people using it.
The claims have been put to Network Rail, which, while not able to comment on the claims, said it was involved in an investigation alongside British Transport Police and the Rail Accident Investigation Board.
The train was travelling towards Burscough town centre when the collision happened. A woman who was on board the train described seeing the van travelling along Martin Lane before it collided with the Northern train.
The crossing where the crash took place is not a full level crossing, but one operated by people as and when they use it.
It has lights and makes warning noises when the gate is not shut.
Image shows workmen and police officers at the crossing, which is made up of two gates that, when shut, block access to the line.

Image caption,
People familiar with the crossing said the gates were sometimes left open
One man familiar with the area told the BBC that the gate was regularly left open.
He said from his experience the crossing was mainly used by locals and farmers, but that he was seeing more delivery drivers using it lately.
He added: "We really hope that there will be some sort of automated gate there that can only be opened by the public… the gate is always left open and we know that because we are often down there. I have flagged it to Network Rail."
The man said there had been a CCTV camera on the crossing for a number of years.
The crossing is classed as a "user-worked crossing with miniature stop lights" and has a risk rating of B4, which Network Rail categorises as having a "high individual risk" and a "very high collective risk".
A woman at a nearby business said "people who use it are aware… to open and close it", but said there were "so few people who used it".
But the man told us that there had been a notable increase in the number of delivery drivers in the area in recent years, and that the hedge running along Martin Lane was high and might not offer a clear view of trains coming down the track at all times.
Image shows a train door sheered off its hinges in the driver's cab of the train

Image caption,
The train collided with the van on the crossing at Martin Lane in Burscough
Sophie Cassidy, 26, who was on the train with her two small children when the collision happened, said she had seen the vehicle approaching.
She and other passengers on the train were lifted down to safety by police, fire and paramedic crews about two hours after the crash.
She said: "I can't put into words how lucky we are to be alive. I'm still trying to wrap my mind around it all."
More than 24 hours after the collision, the line remains closed and the train remains on the tracks while investigations are carried out.
A Network Rail spokesman said: "Following an incident at a level crossing in Burscough, the line between Wigan and Southport remains closed.
"Alongside Northern, we are supporting both the British Transport Police and the Rail Accident Investigation Branch with their investigations."
A British Transport Police (BTP) spokesman said: "Enquiries are ongoing to establish the full circumstances of what happened."


 

david l

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Yes I am fully aware of how both Astley and Martins Lane operate given that I've worked in both areas, albeit only geographically in Martins Lane's case as I was based in a box on the other railway line in the area which happens to have two crossings with similar arrangements, one of which is one of the most misused crossings in the north west.

I can tell you its a lot more than 10% that don't shut those gates at Astley, just getting people that do close them to do so correctly is a particular source of irritation for the signallers :D The relief staff loathe the place.

As for the stricken unit's current destination of Springs Branch, I'm fairly certain that the 769s are actually based there. Northern went to a lot of effort setting up a maintenance depot there for what were then their class 319s.
The maintenance base is Allerton. Overnight stabling of 3 769's units, fuelling and cleaning (and I understand resolving very minor faults) takes place at SP, with units rotated in/out of AN over the 6 diagrams as there are 2 ECS movements at night from Wigan NW to AN, and 2 ECS movements in a morning to Manchester Vic (from AN). 1 769 is also stabled overnight at NH, and 2 (serviceable) at AN.
 

gray1404

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I think the driver of the supermarket delivery van failed to realise it was a railway crossing (I'm assuming the gates were left open as it's impossible to mistake otherwise) and proceeded without seeing the train or realising they were about to go over train track. Either that or they thought because the gates were open it was safe to proceed and didn't see the approaching train.
 

RiponHall

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I think the driver of the supermarket delivery van failed to realise it was a railway crossing (I'm assuming the gates were left open as it's impossible to mistake otherwise) and proceeded without seeing the train or realising they were about to go over train track. Either that or they thought because the gates were open it was safe to proceed and didn't see the approaching train.
Before coming to a conclusion like that, I would want to know that the delivery driver had never made a delivery to that site before. One of the crossings that I was responsible suffered from frequent misuse - with delivery and other 'professional' drivers being the most frequent culprits. Eventually, after several very near misses, the crossing was upgraded to be a AOCL. It was after that when one of these drivers got caught out by a train that he could not outrun. That driver had used the crossing almost daily...
 
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