GTR will be sending me a court pack

After responding to GTR’s intention to prosecute letter, I have received their response saying they will proceed with the case and they will send me a court pack in due course. What will happen next? I have read that I would need to read it carefully and submit whatever documents will be required from me. Does that mean I will be going to court for a hearing. I know I need to get a lawyer asap and but I would like to know if there is a still a way to settle this out of court at this stage? Is there a way to not go through this face to face, because I am terrified. What are the possible outcomes and how can I get the least damaging outcome. Thank you.

Please read the sticky post: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/please-read-before-posting-in-disputes-prosecutions.77759/

We need a lot more detail to be able to help. It is unusual for GTR to insist on prosecuting a case so there must be some unusual aspect to yours, so please give every relevant detail.

vt59 said:

After responding to GTR’s intention to prosecute letter,

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Ref this part of your post in addition to the vital info @AlterEgo is asking you to set out for us

can you advise if

a) you know they received your response (ie how did you send your response, where did you send it and do you know for certain they received it (eg did you send it tracked postage)?

b) can you upload a copy of what you said in your response to them? Exclude anything that would identify your personally)

vt59 said:

I have received their response saying they will proceed with the case and they will send me a court pack in due course.

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It would help to see a copy of this letter - again remove anything that would identify you and any ref numbers etc

vt59 said:

What will happen next? I have read that I would need to read it carefully and submit whatever documents will be required from me. Does that mean I will be going to court for a hearing.

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Possibly but possibly not - when you receive anything if you uploaded it here for people to look over you can get advice on what to expect. Some court cases are dealt with by what is called SJPN (Single Justice Procedure Notice) - this can be dealt with by post for example and does not involve going to court. For example if you plead guilty on the paperwork (assuming you are guilty in that scenario - I would not suggest pleading guilty if you are in fact not guilty) the court then pass their sentence (which would be a fine - ie the punishment for the offence) and tell you what to pay in the post and how to pay it etc.

vt59 said:

I know I need to get a lawyer asap

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Possibly, but best that you get some advice from here first, before you engage a lawyer, so you can weigh up the costs of doing that vs the benefits of paying for a lawyer. There are some lawyers who specialise in rail ticket problems and evasion work that get mentioned on this forum, we can provide a list so you can get quotes if you want to engage one. From what we see this might be in the region of around £750

vt59 said:

and but I would like to know if there is a still a way to settle this out of court at this stage?

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Possibly - depends on what has happened

vt59 said:

Is there a way to not go through this face to face, because I am terrified.

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Possibly - there is also info on the forum on what to expect if you did have to go to court in person, so you can prepare for it.

vt59 said:

What are the possible outcomes and how can I get the least damaging outcome. Thank you.

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If it went to court the outcome is a fine on a set scale related to your income (which is the punishment from the court for this sort of offence), plus some costs etc (ie it would not result in a prison sentence), along with a criminal record that you would have to declare when asked for a period of time in most cases, until it is 'spent'

The least damaging outcome is an out of court settlement

So we definitely need more information from you about what has happened from the point you were caught without the correct ticket up to now to answer your questions more clearly - and any other questions you might have.

vt59 said:

What are the possible outcomes and how can I get the least damaging outcome.

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We cannot possibly help you without being told what happened and without seeing the content of the correspondence between you and GTR.

vt59 said:

After responding to GTR’s intention to prosecute letter, I have received their response saying they will proceed with the case and they will send me a court pack in due course. What will happen next? I have read that I would need to read it carefully and submit whatever documents will be required from me. Does that mean I will be going to court for a hearing. I know I need to get a lawyer asap and but I would like to know if there is a still a way to settle this out of court at this stage? Is there a way to not go through this face to face, because I am terrified. What are the possible outcomes and how can I get the least damaging outcome. Thank you.

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We need far more detail to help, such as:

If you were stopped to have your details taken, where and under what circumstances?
Have you done this behaviour before, and have you been caught for it?
How did you respond to the initial NIP? All paperwork from them and your response would be helpful.

Either we’re talking about tens of thousands worth of serial fraud, assault of a member of staff, or refund/DR fraud (where Fraud Act is more easily applicable). It’s almost unheard of for GTR not to settle out of court outside of these circumstances.

Normally, you could practically threaten to defecate on GTR’s doorstep in your response and they’d still settle out of court, so this is highly unusual…

tatitiliti said:

We need far more detail to help, such as:

If you were stopped to have your details taken, where and under what circumstances?
Have you done this behaviour before, and have you been caught for it?
How did you respond to the initial NIP? All paperwork from them and your response would be helpful.

Either we’re talking about tens of thousands worth of serial fraud, assault of a member of staff, or refund/DR fraud (where Fraud Act is more easily applicable). It’s almost unheard of for GTR not to settle out of court outside of these circumstances.

Normally, you could practically threaten to defecate on GTR’s doorstep in your response and they’d still settle out of court, so this is highly unusual…

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But we do see GTR issue court papers when 6 month period is coming to a close.
May or may not be pertinent so indeed need more info from op.

tatitiliti said:

Either we’re talking about tens of thousands worth of serial fraud, assault of a member of staff, or refund/DR fraud (where Fraud Act is more easily applicable). It’s almost unheard of for GTR not to settle out of court outside of these circumstances.

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Two other possibilities:
(1) OP's initial response was so combative that GTR don't consider a settlement appropriate
(2) OP's initial response has somehow got lost.

Except for the possibility of (1), I would be suggesting that OP resends their initial response, with a politely worded cover note asking whether it had been considered. But if OP has already been seen as unsuitable for settlement, then doubling down would make things worse.

As others have said, we're keen to help. But we need more information to do so.

Fawkes Cat said:

Two other possibilities:
(1) OP's initial response was so combative that GTR don't consider a settlement appropriate
(2) OP's initial response has somehow got lost.

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Very good points - especially if OP peddled some ridiculous lie in their response (as we so often see people want to do before advising them otherwise).

Though even with that we’ve seen GTR offer settlements, so (2) is a very real possibility.