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Cowley line to reopen

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JamesT

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Zomboid said:
Chiltern (or that service group at least) makes sense because they have trains terminating at Oxford from the north end of the station, so they're the obvious pick to extend.

In some ways the MK trains make more sense than the Marylebone ones, but it's 6 and two threes, really.
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Initially both EWR and Marylebone are 2tph, but EWR would ramp up with the extensions to Bedford and then Cambridge. So if you want to keep all the EWR together say for interworking, then it's the Marylebone for the branch.
MK has the potential to import delays to/from the WCML, if you're keeping EWR to the bays then that can be alleviated.
If Oxford is congested, then any additional services being sent through it are going to be an issue, whether they're heading for MK or London. Oxford doesn't have any south facing bays, so there's not really any scope for Cowley to be a shuttle.
 
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zwk500

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Zomboid said:
Chiltern (or that service group at least) makes sense because they have trains terminating at Oxford from the north end of the station, so they're the obvious pick to extend.

In some ways the MK trains make more sense than the Marylebone ones, but it's 6 and two threes, really.
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In terms of potential traffic, and therefore economic benefit, if you have the option between London and MK it will not be 6 an two threes but rather 1,000 and five tens.

You would only extend the EWR services if there was a clear operational benefit to do so and the Londons were too high a risk, but given EWR and the Marylebone trains share track from Bicester, there is no particular operational advantage to one service group over the other through Oxford. The Marylebone service operates through higher constraints for longer on the Chiltern Line but EWR has to thread a needle at MKC or risk frequently turning at Bletchley. And the EWR services have more potential for future extension to Didcot give their role as regional connectivity not a London radial.
 
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C

CyrusWuff

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Ashley Hill said:
Indeed, GWR have a depot at Oxford! They already operate DOO services so as a new service could run as such. I say this even though I am anti DOO.
I can only think that Chiltern would run through to Cowley rather than terminate at Oxford.
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And WMT have a depot at Bletchley, yet operation of EWR Phase 1 was handed to Chiltern using trains sub-leased from WMT.

The only logical reason for that decision is that it was believed that an extension of DOO from Bicester Village to Milton Keynes Central would be easy, whereas having WMT operating EWR services would have meant Guard operation.
 
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Nicholas43

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Has anyone at Network Rail, or the City or County Councils, said whether the plan includes
(a) putting back the Up Relief between Hinksey North and Hinksey South? The trackbed is still there, but there is a lot of Stuff on it which looks very expensive to move;
(b) reversible signalling, on this putative Up Relief, between Hinksey North and Kennington Junction? This would, obviously, help trains from Cowley to arrive into platform 3 at Oxford (as trains from Didcot sometimes do now, crossing at Hinksey North);
(c) closing Spring Lane pedestrian and cyclist level crossing, and facing down local protest; or
(d) equipping Spring Lane crossing with barriers and lights?
 
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F

fishwomp

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Nicholas43 said:
Has Network Rail, or the City or County Councils, said whether the plan includes
(a) putting back the Up Relief between Hinksey North and Hinksey South? The trackbed is still there, but there is a lot of Stuff on it which looks very expensive to move;
(b) reversible signalling, on this putative Up Relief, between Hinksey North and Kennington Junction? This would, obviously, help trains from Cowley to arrive into platform 3 at Oxford (as trains from Didcot sometimes do now, crossing at Hinksey North);
(c) closing Spring Lane pedestrian and cyclist level crossing, and facing down local protest; or
(d) equipping Spring Lane crossing with barriers and lights?
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Per https://www.oxford.gov.uk/downloads/file/3823/littlemore-neighbourhood-plan-as-modified
TCC2 Cowley Branch Line
The proposed reopening of the Cowley Branch line to passenger traffic is strongly supported by Littlemore residents. This project, including the development of a new station in the Kassam/Science Park area, would bring greatly improved connectivity to Oxford City centre and onward connections, and create an opportunity for a multi-modal mobility hub. However, concerns about the potential impact in terms of traffic and parking mean that the implications of implementation will need to be carefully thought through. Improvements which enhance safety at the Spring Lane level crossing will be supported.
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POLICY TCC2
Reopening of the Cowley Branch Line to passenger traffic and the creation of a multi-modal, mobility hub near the proposed station will be strongly supported, subject to adequate provision for related infrastructure, facilities and onward travel, such as cycle parking, bus services and safe travel routes, especially at the Spring Lane crossing.
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nothing of any detail there..

400m south and 350m north are a foot tunnel and a road bridge respectively. By the time they've built a bridge and ramp to it, it might as well be diverted to the foot tunnel .. but IMHO it'll close, and a bridge plus ramp be put in. It's a shortcut to the school (Oxford Academy) there - so that already smells too dangerous to remain a crossing even with controlled foot gates.
 
M

Merle Haggard

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In the days of Rover Group car & component trains using the branch, 'Blackbird Leys' was associated with problems of damage to product.
Have things changed for the better?
 
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fishwomp

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Merle Haggard said:
In the days of Rover Group car & component trains using the branch, 'Blackbird Leys' was associated with problems of damage to product.
Have things changed for the better?
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Yes, they no longer make Rovers. Far less likely to break down..

But seriously, the trains are now fully enclosed, so no-one can lob things at them and damage the goods.
 
Z

Zomboid

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fishwomp said:
Yes, they no longer make Rovers. Far less likely to break down..

But seriously, the trains are now fully enclosed, so no-one can lob things at them and damage the goods.
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Not sure how much better Blackbird Leys is though. It's still not somewhere I'd voluntarily go wandering around alone after dark.
 
M

Merle Haggard

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fishwomp said:
Yes, they no longer make Rovers. Far less likely to break down..

But seriously, the trains are now fully enclosed, so no-one can lob things at them and damage the goods.
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We managed to persuade MAT (later STVA) to contribute to enclosure of Cartics. Sutton Park seems posh but another infamous section for 'bricking';.
As an aside, and curiously, I've seen DB Schenker automotive trains with product on open wagons. It wasn't just vandal damage but also contamination - from diesel locos' exhaust and hydraulic fluid, and electric locos' pan head / contact wire detritus - which damaged paint work.

But I was actually thinking of the more dangerous behaviour of those days which, if it still occurs, might affect passenger trains.
 
T

The Planner

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Ashley Hill said:
Stayed nearby once and got a Chinese takeaway from there, it didn’t seem too bad.
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Normally isn't that bad in most places people consider "iffy", I have had some great times in stereotypical flat roofed estate pubs where people would normally think "no chance!" :lol:
 
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JamesT

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Blackbird Leys really isn't that bad, even if it does end up on the list of most deprived areas of the UK.

But the focus of the branch reopening is going to be incoming, people going to the business and science parks next to the new stations.
 
C

cle

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It's the contrast with the rest of Oxford that I think sees this outsized reputation. It's certainly not dangerous. And this will be a huge asset to the area, both in terms of outbound travel opportunities, but also in terms of stimulating the local economy around Cowley/Littlemore.
 
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