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Avanti West Coast & South Western Disruption (9th July)

MartinC

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Joined
29 Jul 2025
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68
Location
Hythe Hants
My wife and I have just yesterday completed an exhausting journey from Windermere to Southampton Central. 12.24 slightly late leaving Oxenholme.

First Class catering staff said "just completing breakfast, new team will start lunch after Preston". The first indication of trouble, with screen altering from "Euston" to "Train to Preston" at Lancaster followed by message from train manager that we would all have to detrain at Preston due to trespass on line.

After waiting on the platform for some minutes we were told to reboard the train, which would be reaching Euston by another route, the cause of the stoppage having been amended to include signal failure.

Another train was then terminated at the adjoining platform and the passengers transferred to our train. This ended up with a seriously overcrowded train which was then "declassified".

The position improved at Crewe where some passengers were persuaded to take alternative trains. Needless to say the "declassification' remained and there was no food service for the remainder of the journey, although all the service staff were in the kitchen area.

After crossing London in the middle of the rush hour, our next available train at Waterloo was the 18.05 to Southampton Central, but our "adventures" had not ended. The packed train moved a few yards on the journey and came to an abrupt halt, followed by a number of announcements "driver contact guard" etc. The driver appeared from the cab and waked down the train,when it was finally disclosed to the "public" it appeared that there was a medical emergency which had involved the activation of an alarm.

It was then decided to reverse the train into the platform involving obtaining another driver and conversations over the public address systems "would the country end driver de-key?& "would the country end driver please release the emergency brake"

A journey that was scheduled for seven and a half hours, in comfort with food and drink (we are both over 80), took nine and a half hours in overcrowded trains with one bottle of water supplied by the "breakfast team" To catch the train at Waterloo did not allow us sufficient time to make a purchase at Waterloo.

The whole whole booking was done through Avanti West Coast, as booking agents, and I am awaiting their comments.
 
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Watershed

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It certainly sounds like a poor experience. Sadly I can't say it is unheard of, though it is certainly unlucky to incur significant disruption on two separate services. The catering staff packing up long before Preston and then hiding during disruption is in line with my experiences and I find it really poor, especially considering the ridiculous sums Avanti charge for first class nowadays. They price it as a premium service but routinely deliver something sub-par! The shop might have remained open and might have given you something if you'd shown your first class ticket, but it really isn't ideal expecting anyone to walk multiple coaches there and back on a packed train.

In terms of what you are entitled to, this would firstly be Delay Repay compensation for the delay in arriving at Southampton. Delay Repay is claimed from the operator that first caused your journey to become delayed - this was Avanti. For any future journey that is 'merely' delayed, you will get a quicker response if you fill out the claim form online, but you are quite entitled to contact them manually instead if you prefer. As you were more than 2 hours late in arriving at Southampton you are entitled to compensation of 100% of the cost of your ticket (whether it was a single or a return).

Furthermore you are entitled to claim downgrade compensation for the declassification of the train from Preston. This is generally calculated by comparing your ticket to the equivalent standard class ticket and paying the difference. If you can tell us which ticket(s) you had, we can estimate how much is due for this. Again, the train company at fault (Avanti) are the ones you need to claim from for this. There isn't a claim form for downgrades so you were correct to contact them manually regarding this.

For future reference, you would only contact the retailer you bought your ticket from if you want to get a refund on your ticket as you are no longer travelling (e.g. if you abandon the journey due to disruption). In this case the retailer (Avanti) is the same as the company (Avanti) you're claiming Delay Repay and downgrade compensation from, but if you bought a ticket from the forum's ticket site or Trainline or SWR for example, then you would still need to contact the relevant train company for any issues to do with the journey itself.
 

MartinC

Member
Joined
29 Jul 2025
Messages
68
Location
Hythe Hants
It certainly sounds like a poor experience. Sadly I can't say it is unheard of, though it is certainly unlucky to incur significant disruption on two separate services. The catering staff packing up long before Preston and then hiding during disruption is in line with my experiences and I find it really poor, especially considering the ridiculous sums Avanti charge for first class nowadays. They price it as a premium service but routinely deliver something sub-par! The shop might have remained open and might have given you something if you'd shown your first class ticket, but it really isn't ideal expecting anyone to walk multiple coaches there and back on a packed train.

In terms of what you are entitled to, this would firstly be Delay Repay compensation for the delay in arriving at Southampton. Delay Repay is claimed from the operator that first caused your journey to become delayed - this was Avanti. For any future journey that is 'merely' delayed, you will get a quicker response if you fill out the claim form online, but you are quite entitled to contact them manually instead if you prefer. As you were more than 2 hours late in arriving at Southampton you are entitled to compensation of 100% of the cost of your ticket (whether it was a single or a return).

Furthermore you are entitled to claim downgrade compensation for the declassification of the train from Preston. This is generally calculated by comparing your ticket to the equivalent standard class ticket and paying the difference. If you can tell us which ticket(s) you had, we can estimate how much is due for this. Again, the train company at fault (Avanti) are the ones you need to claim from for this. There isn't a claim form for downgrades so you were correct to contact them manually regarding this.

For future reference, you would only contact the retailer you bought your ticket from if you want to get a refund on your ticket as you are no longer travelling (e.g. if you abandon the journey due to disruption). In this case the retailer (Avanti) is the same as the company (Avanti) you're claiming Delay Repay and downgrade compensation from, but if you bought a ticket from the forum's ticket site or Trainline or SWR for example, then you would still need to contact the relevant train company for any issues to do with the journey itself.
Thank you very much for your comments. I attach scan of tickets.
I have already lodged a claim but have not made specific reference to downgrade compensation. The most "amusing " part is that the outward journey I had a pre-boarding text from Avanti as i have a Disabled Railcard so they knew a lot about me but when the chips were down it counted for nothing. Duty of care?
 

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yorkie

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I have already lodged a claim but have not made specific reference to downgrade compensation.
Downgrade compensation would - under relevant circumstances - be in addition to Delay Repay compensation, albeit with the caveat that you can't claim more than the full value of the tickets. Given the length of delay will be sufficient to get the full value back, it's effectively a moot point.
The most "amusing " part is that the outward journey I had a pre-boarding text from Avanti as i have a Disabled Railcard so they knew a lot about me but when the chips were down it counted for nothing. Duty of care?
I'm not quite sure what this means, but Avanti wouldn't be privvy to the details of what any Disabled Railcard holder's disability was.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

The whole whole booking was done through Avanti West Coast, as booking agents, and I am awaiting their comments.
Definitely not an issue for the booking agent, but for the relevant train company whose train caused the delay; in this case it seems to be Avanti either way, though.
 

PeachLillabo

Member
Joined
8 Nov 2015
Messages
14
Downgrade compensation would - under relevant circumstances - be in addition to Delay Repay compensation, albeit with the caveat that you can't claim more than the full value of the tickets. Given the length of delay will be sufficient to get the full value back, it's effectively a moot point.

I had a similar scenario to this which I discussed in thread here a few months ago and it was agreed that "not claiming more than the full value of the tickets" applied just to the amount of delay repay received, so that you are entitled to receive compensation for lack of 1st class facilities in addition to the full delay repay amount regardless of whether this would combine to be more than the price paid.
 

MartinC

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29 Jul 2025
Messages
68
Location
Hythe Hants
Thank you PeachLillabo. Just what I was thinking. There was a clear breach of contract and the consequential legal damages are not restricted to the price of the contract.
 

Watershed

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Thank you PeachLillabo. Just what I was thinking. There was a clear breach of contract and the consequential legal damages are not restricted to the price of the contract.
Indeed in this case it's simply a claim for multiple sets of liquidated damages: one for Delay Repay, and another for the downgrade/declassification.

If the industry wanted to limit the total liquidated damages to the amount paid it could do so in the NRCoT, and that probably wouldn't be an unfair term (in the Consumer Rights Act sense).

But it doesn't at the moment; it only has such a provision for multiple Delay Repay claims, e.g. where there are delays on both the outward and inbound journeys on a return ticket, or someone makes multiple daily journeys on a season ticket, ranger or rover etc.
 

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