Stagecoach West Scotland

[CMBS]

I was aware of X25 change and Cumbernauld depot closure but was unaware of impact on X19. I've already seen quite a few single deck "Borders Buses" X19s running around this week.
But only commenting to share an experience from this afternoon to highlight that there is areal impact on passengers.

Passenger boarded X19 (stagecoach vehicle, west coast driver) and was refused with his Glasgow Tripper ticket because it was loaded in the First app. Driver seemed unaware of what a Tripper ticket was, despite clear explanation from passenger and showing it for visual inspection. Glasgow Tripper tickets can be used on most of the main Glasgow bus operators' services (including Stagecoach and West Coast Motors) and I had to intervene and back the passenger up to make the point to the driver that his ticket was valid. Driver was unhelpful and unnecessarily rude. Not a great experience, and I have heard some other experiences anecdotally of problems with ticket acceptance.
None of the X19s have been trackable (at least that I have been able to get to show) so there is no easy way to know if a bus will turn up - particularly frustrating has always been problematic in terms of reliability and sticking to the timetable in my experience.

This has a real world impact on passengers and does nothing to attract people to public transport.

I believe WCM loan drivers from other depots every once in a while, I've had this issue before on local services in Argyll where drivers don't know where obvious local places are (recent example on the 486, driver thought Cairndow was a literal signpost and clearly didn't realise it was a whole village)

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

I was aware of X25 change and Cumbernauld depot closure but was unaware of impact on X19. I've already seen quite a few single deck "Borders Buses" X19s running around this week.
But only commenting to share an experience from this afternoon to highlight that there is areal impact on passengers.

Passenger boarded X19 (stagecoach vehicle, west coast driver) and was refused with his Glasgow Tripper ticket because it was loaded in the First app. Driver seemed unaware of what a Tripper ticket was, despite clear explanation from passenger and showing it for visual inspection. Glasgow Tripper tickets can be used on most of the main Glasgow bus operators' services (including Stagecoach and West Coast Motors) and I had to intervene and back the passenger up to make the point to the driver that his ticket was valid. Driver was unhelpful and unnecessarily rude. Not a great experience, and I have heard some other experiences anecdotally of problems with ticket acceptance.
None of the X19s have been trackable (at least that I have been able to get to show) so there is no easy way to know if a bus will turn up - particularly frustrating has always been problematic in terms of reliability and sticking to the timetable in my experience.

This has a real world impact on passengers and does nothing to attract people to public transport.

West Coast Motors

Strange situation. I thought the X19 was still a Stagecoach route. Is the X74 still all Stagecoach?

I remember a driver on a Lothian Bus service refused my plus bus ticket in a similar vain.

It still is a Stagecoach service you can buy all the West Scotland Dayriders on it, The tickets still say Stagecoach We've got you on the top of them

 

[markymark2000]

Is there any difference between the X19 subcontracting and the Peterborough 904 & Worthing 7 which are also subcontracted routes?

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Is there any difference between the X19 subcontracting and the Peterborough 904 & Worthing 7 which are also subcontracted routes?

I wouldn’t say there are any differences in how they are subcontracted. Though I would state the X19 is a fairly busy cross city service in a big city, while the other two appear to be more local and in the 904’s case rural services that are much more infrequent.

I just don’t see how the X19 works like this in the long term to be honest.

 

[Metal Mickey]

I wouldn’t say there are any differences in how they are subcontracted. Though I would state the X19 is a fairly busy cross city service in a big city, while the other two appear to be more local and in the 904’s case rural services that are much more infrequent.

I just don’t see how the X19 works like this in the long term to be honest.

In the long-term it will come under franchising.

 

[LT02 NVV]

I wouldn’t say there are any differences in how they are subcontracted. Though I would state the X19 is a fairly busy cross city service in a big city, while the other two appear to be more local and in the 904’s case rural services that are much more infrequent.

I just don’t see how the X19 works like this in the long term to be honest.

I predict that WCMs will take it over fully in future, and will buy the fleet of E400MMCs from Stagecoach to run it.

 

[Spsf3232]

I wouldn’t say there are any differences in how they are subcontracted. Though I would state the X19 is a fairly busy cross city service in a big city, while the other two appear to be more local and in the 904’s case rural services that are much more infrequent.

I just don’t see how the X19 works like this in the long term to be honest.

Long term it works just the same as short term. Stagecoach vehicles, stagecoach operating license, west coast motors drivers. It will continue as a stagecoach service as long as they can make it pay.

There is no overheads for depots to pay so as long as they can make the service pay with the costs of bill from west coast motors then nothing will change and it will continue as is

 

[sannox]

I've seen a few WCM buses on the route, which must be very confusing for passengers.

 

[route101]

I have noticed the X74 has more Citylink livered coaches of late.

 

[Resuwen]

Long term it works just the same as short term. Stagecoach vehicles, stagecoach operating license, west coast motors drivers. It will continue as a stagecoach service as long as they can make it pay.

There is no overheads for depots to pay so as long as they can make the service pay with the costs of bill from west coast motors then nothing will change and it will continue as is

Is it on the Stagecoach op licence?

The Stagecoach vehicles on the route now carry Craig of Campbeltown legal lettering

 

[lastbus]

Is it on the Stagecoach op licence?

The Stagecoach vehicles on the route now carry Craig of Campbeltown legal lettering

They can carry that legal lettering as long as there’s something on bus stating it’s on hire to stagecoach

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

I have noticed the X74 has more Citylink livered coaches of late.

Only 1 interdeck with Citylink livery that operates it everyday 54275 YY65 VXS

 

[Resuwen]

They can carry that legal lettering as long as there’s something on bus stating it’s on hire to stagecoach

No on hire notice that I could see - but it was in full Stagecoach livery.

Likewise the WCM livieried vehicles on the route didn’t appear to display the Stagecoach name anywhere

 

[NorthClyde320]

Still a lot of complaints and general unhappiness about the X19 since the depot and crew changes particularly the total lack of tracking both on mobiles and roadside despite Stagecoach saying this would be resolved soon and punctuality of service, would it not make more sense to just put the timetable and tracking on the West Coast website and app with a note explaining it is a Stagecoach service provided by WCM? Would help in the short term at least.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Apr 2026 ==

I predict that WCMs will take it over fully in future, and will buy the fleet of E400MMCs from Stagecoach to run it.

I think WCM would probably source their own fleet for it perhaps larger capacity Evora's like Lothian's as deckers aren't really a WCM thing plus those deckers are prob past their best after 10 years constant motorway work.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Apr 2026 ==

Only 1 interdeck with Citylink livery that operates it everyday 54275 YY65 VXS

I think one of the Panorama's has been on it occasionally, 50451?

 

[markymark2000]

I predict that WCMs will take it over fully in future, and will buy the fleet of E400MMCs from Stagecoach to run it.

It'd make logical sense for it to just become a full WCM route. At this point it's just a WCM service branded as Stagecoach anyway.

I don't really understand what value Stagecoach see in keeping the X19 though. It surely can't be making them a lot of money if they are now paying a lot to WCM to operate the route. In the 2 other instances of Stagecoach subbing out a route, the Cambridgeshire 904 & Worthing 7, there is a strong Stagecoach network around the route and so there is some benefit for Stagecoach to have the route subbed rather than dropping it. There is also some wider benefit for them to not have a competitor in these area and subbing out the route protects against that.
The X19 though, they only have the distance express routes, and the 4. The X19 barely links up to the express routes, and I can't see many people wanting to connect between the 4 and X19. There is no benefit to them either to keep an competitor out of 'their area' as it's not their area really.

It doesn't fit 'perfectly' into WCMs area but certainly fits more with their area than it does Stagecoach and at least there are some half decent local connections between the X19 and 15/17.

 

[Robbie01]

I know its unlikely to happen but id love to see it. One of the Evoras are over from Arran and on the 585, and such a great journey on it imo, and would like to see more evoras to replace the ever aging e300s

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

10931 SN67 XAZ has appeared back and is in service at Ayr depot

 

[NorthClyde320]

How reliable are the Interdeck's performance on the X74 as a number of them seem to be out of service atm with Panorama 50451 on the X74 regularly and some 9700DD''s also making appearances on it too, 54288 has transferred to Glasgow recently and is on it too. Would the Panorama's be better suited to the X74 if there is any to spare or would another type be better suited to the route?

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

How reliable are the Interdeck's performance on the X74 as a number of them seem to be out of service atm with Panorama 50451 on the X74 regularly and some 9700DD''s also making appearances on it too, 54288 has transferred to Glasgow recently and is on it too. Would the Panorama's be better suited to the X74 if there is any to spare or would another type be better suited to the route?

The elderly and the less able would probably find it easier on a Panorama or a 9700DD

 

[Scotrail88]

With the X19 now based at WCM, have advertising on the vehicles stopped and metro newspapers be removed?

Looks to be a few vehicles running with no adverts or old ones that have been up for ages

 

[route101]

The elderly and the less able would probably find it easier on a Panorama or a 9700DD

More seats on them too, I think.

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

More seats on them too, I think.

79 on a Panorama I think, 81 on a 9700DD

 

[LT02 NVV]

I predict that WCMs will take it over fully in future, and will buy the fleet of E400MMCs from Stagecoach to run it.

It seems like I’m right with how things seem to be going. Of course, the Stagecoach buses are still on loan, but I’ve seen plenty of WCM Buses on the X19 than ever.

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

It seems like I’m right with how things seem to be going. Of course, the Stagecoach buses are still on loan, but I’ve seen plenty of WCM Buses on the X19 than ever.

Still a Stagecoach service though no matter how you look at it

 

[LT02 NVV]

Still a Stagecoach service though no matter how you look at it

Even if Stagecoach in the West of Scotland seem to be struggling more than ever.

Also, I’d say the X74 is more of a Citylink route by now, like it would make more sense to rebrand it as such because of how common Citylink coaches seem to be on it now.

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

Even if Stagecoach in the West of Scotland seem to be struggling more than ever.

Also, I’d say the X74 is more of a Citylink route by now, like it would make more sense to rebrand it as such because of how common Citylink coaches seem to be on it now.

It's not though it's still a Stagecoach service operated by Stagecoach vehicles

 

[Spsf3232]

Even if Stagecoach in the West of Scotland seem to be struggling more than ever.

Also, I’d say the X74 is more of a Citylink route by now, like it would make more sense to rebrand it as such because of how common Citylink coaches seem to be on it now.

Your taking 2+2 and getting 6!

Both are still very much a stagecoach service and will remain that way. Yes it's operated by WCM but that's as far as it goes.

Vehicles may be loaned by WCM or from the Citylink fleet but it's still a stagecoach service. The colour of the bus is irrelevant

 

[NorthClyde320]

Being picky the only issue I see is that any WCM bus operating on the X19 should have an 'On hire to Stagecoach' sign displayed so people can see it's still a Stagecoach service due to the different rules regarding the ticket acceptance rules with the X19 and WCM own services.

Going forward the big test will be if the forthcoming changes to McGill's 23 service have any effect on the X19, if Stagecoach decide to abandon the QEUH to City section could the City to Easterhouse section become fully WCM operated? Just my thoughts.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Going forward the big test will be if the forthcoming changes to McGill's 23 service have any effect on the X19, if Stagecoach decide to abandon the QEUH to City section could the City to Easterhouse section become fully WCM operated? Just my thoughts.

I doubt the X19 will last to be honest. Could First take on what’s left as basically a sped up 19/41? Keeping its X19 number.

 

[Clydeflyer]

Is Stagecoach locked in to running the X19 as a result of anything from the SPT/FastLink days? I thought there was a grant involved from SPT for the X19 to be extended via the FastLink to QEUH but that feels like 10+ years ago?

Just trying to figure out why Stagecoach still want to be seen to be running the X19 at all - albeit via a subcontract - and can only think it is because of some commitment they can't get out of without some penalty.

Or is it just killing time until McGills switch to running via the FastLink roads to avoid SPT having to explain why all that money was spent yet there is no buses using it.