• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Thoughts on the Trump presidency

nw1

Established Member
Joined
9 Aug 2013
Messages
9,430
True boiling frogs moment. I'm genuinely curious to know what it would take for the population to rouse from its slumber and reclaim the country, but cancelling the midterms would be a major test.

Cancelling the midterms would absolutely be the act of a dictator. And the Republicans would do well to dissociate themselves from such an act, as it would tarnish them long term.

To me it's obvious that the way forward for the GOP is to stab him in the back, figuratively speaking, now. He is doing them no favours whatsoever. It certainly appears that some of the Right, such as MTG, understand this.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

nlogax

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2011
Messages
6,035
Location
Mostly Glasgow-ish. Mostly.
It certainly appears that some of the Right, such as MTG, understand this.

MTG is only now 'brave' enough to say the right things because she's removed herself from politics. Those still in the GOP who aren't planning to retire by 2028 seem to be keener to stay on Trump's good side.
 

YorkshireBear

Established Member
Joined
23 Jul 2010
Messages
9,667
I wonder why we aren't bombing Iran on Trump's side.

Trump calls Nato allies 'cowards', saying it would be 'easy' for them to help open straitpublished at 14:00
14:00Breaking​


We've just heard from US President Donald Trump, who has called Nato allies "cowards" and said it would be "easy" for them to allow ships to safely pass through the Strait of Hormuz.

Here's his post on Truth Social in full:

"Without the U.S.A., NATO IS A PAPER TIGER! They didn’t want to join the fight to stop a Nuclear Powered Iran.

"Now that fight is Militarily WON, with very little danger for them, they complain about the high oil prices they are forced to pay, but don’t want to help open the Strait of Hormuz, a simple military maneuver that is the single reason for the high oil prices.

"So easy for them to do, with so little risk. COWARDS, and we will REMEMBER!"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/ce84073mr06t
 

styles

Established Member
Joined
7 Dec 2014
Messages
4,896
Location
Gwynedd
Looks scary on paper, a unified force of military might but not actually use it?
Maybe it's as simple as that yeah.

I was just genuinely confused by 'paper tiger; when I read it. Never heard that phrase used before!
 

The exile

Established Member
Joined
31 Mar 2010
Messages
9,427
Location
Somerset
Looks scary on paper, a unified force of military might but not actually use it?
The irony being that the fact that no one could now rely on the USA fulfilling its NATO commitments means that there is potentially very little difference whether the USA is “in” or not.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Maybe it's as simple as that yeah.

I was just genuinely confused by 'paper tiger; when I read it. Never heard that phrase used before!
I suspect the etymology may be “a tiger made of paper” (think Chinese dragon dances) rather than “on paper” but whichever it is, a paper tiger is effectively an empty threat.
 
Last edited:

Gloster

Veteran Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
13,005
Location
Up the creek
Maybe it's as simple as that yeah.

I was just genuinely confused by 'paper tiger; when I read it. Never heard that phrase used before!

It has been used in China for, probably, centuries and moved across to English two hundred years or so ago; it seems to have been a bit of a favourite of Mao Zedong. It simply means a threat that looks quite powerful or impressive, but is actually ineffectual.
 

DelW

Established Member
Joined
15 Jan 2015
Messages
6,005
Maybe it's as simple as that yeah.

I was just genuinely confused by 'paper tiger; when I read it. Never heard that phrase used before!
IIRC it was favoured by China back in the Mao era, describing the USA as a paper tiger.
(Edit, as Gloster said while I was typing :s )
 

The exile

Established Member
Joined
31 Mar 2010
Messages
9,427
Location
Somerset
I wonder why we aren't bombing Iran on Trump's side.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/ce84073mr06t
If it would be so easy for the remaining NATO members to reopen Hormuz, what does that say about the capability of US forces, who have signally failed to do so so far? That is no criticism of US forces, who probably know exactly what they’d be getting into, merely of their C-i-C.
 

Bayum

Established Member
Joined
21 Mar 2008
Messages
3,297
Location
Leeds
Maybe it's as simple as that yeah.

I was just genuinely confused by 'paper tiger; when I read it. Never heard that phrase used before!
Well, it’s a ridiculous phrase only Donald or someone on LSD (looking at you, Lewis Carroll and the Jabberwocky) could come up with. [Apparently, it is an idiom!] Clearly the war on drugs hasn’t yet reached the presidential office.
 
Last edited:

DarloRich

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Oct 2010
Messages
32,923
Location
Fenny Stratford
"Without the U.S.A., NATO IS A PAPER TIGER! "

What does that even mean?
Is that supposed to be incisive international relations commentary from Trump? OF COURSE without the USA NATO is a paper tiger. Thats the point: You mess with us the big fella over there with the big stick will smash your head in!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Well, it’s a ridiculous phrase only Donald or someone on LSD (LC and the Jabberwocky) could come up with. Clearly the war on drugs hasn’t yet reached the presidential office.
it is a fairly common phrase. I didn't realise LSD was available if I ever used the phrase mind? Do I have to apply? Is there a form to fill in? ;)
 

Bayum

Established Member
Joined
21 Mar 2008
Messages
3,297
Location
Leeds
I’m relatively well read (30+ books a year) and I’ve taught primary and secondary GCSE English literature and language and not come across it. Everyday is a school day!
 

YorkshireBear

Established Member
Joined
23 Jul 2010
Messages
9,667
I am really poorly read and Dyslexic and I had heard it. I must have got lucky and it been referenced in something I read once. Certainly don't remember reading it often.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

If it would be so easy for the remaining NATO members to reopen Hormuz, what does that say about the capability of US forces, who have signally failed to do so so far? That is no criticism of US forces, who probably know exactly what they’d be getting into, merely of their C-i-C.
Indeed, and a few days ago he said they don't need us they have already won. Which he repeats in this post.
If they have won, why are we needed?
 

Railwaycat

Member
Joined
15 Jul 2023
Messages
277
Location
Derbyshire
I’m relatively well read (30+ books a year) and I’ve taught primary and secondary GCSE English literature and language and not come across it. Everyday is a school day!

You're clearly being serious, but I find it hard to believe that you and others haven't heard it before (younger people yes). I'm 72, and as far back as I can remember it's been used (in the media as well) - in a similar vein to "all mouth and no trousers"....don't tell me you haven't heard that one!
 

Acey

Member
Joined
16 Nov 2018
Messages
429
The phrase was use in a song,by,I think American singer Sue Thompson

Words and Music by John D Loudermilk
Quit beatin' your chest and actin' like you're gonna bite a big hole out
Of me
Quit messin' and testin' cuz this ain't at all impressin' to me
Paper tiger, paper tiger, you paper tigers are all alike
Your roar is much worse than your bite.
Quit spyin' and sighin' and lyin' and tryin' to be so mean
Cuz you ain't scarin' nobody, baby, you're just makin' a scene
Paper tiger, paper tiger, you're just a'flutterin' in the tree
Ain't shakin' no one but the leaves
Oh how you try to be so brave
Thinkin' that I'll run back to ya and be afraid
And so you try to come on strong
Thinkin' that I will go along, but you're wrong
Paper tiger, paper tiger, you paper tigers are all alike
Your roar is much worse than your bite.
Your roar is much worse than your bite.
Spoken fade: C'mere, kitty. Here, kitty, kitty, kittyah ha ha ha ha

Though I'd heard it from way back
 

roblondon

Member
Joined
4 Mar 2011
Messages
11
"Paper tiger" was an expression popularised (if not invented) by Mao.

Obviously that was quite some time ago and the phrase may be less used these days which may explain some of you being unaware of it (which initially surprised me as you're an erudite bunch). In other words, you're young.
 

nw1

Established Member
Joined
9 Aug 2013
Messages
9,430
Trump is presumably the actual paper tiger.

The subtext of his message is: "HELP! HELP! NATO, please help me!!!!"
 

gg1

Established Member
Joined
2 Jun 2011
Messages
2,493
Location
Birmingham
I’m relatively well read (30+ books a year) and I’ve taught primary and secondary GCSE English literature and language and not come across it. Everyday is a school day!
It tends to get used in the military sense more than anything. I'm not a huge reader, but when I do read it's invariably history rather than fiction, I probably picked it up from there. I've definitely seen it used wider than the cold war context alluded to in the reference to Mao earlier, I recall reading somewhere the phrase being used to describe the Austro-Hungarian Empire.
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
33,689
Location
Scotland
IIRC it was favoured by China back in the Mao era, describing the USA as a paper tiger.
It was also, quite famously, used by one Osama Bin Laden to describe how the USA retreated from Somalia after the "Blackhawk Down" incident (aka The Battle of Mogadishu) during the UN stabilisation mission.

It's that which emboldened him to escalate his campaign of terrorist attacks against the USA as he perceived that they would be reluctant to respond.
 

Bayum

Established Member
Joined
21 Mar 2008
Messages
3,297
Location
Leeds
You're clearly being serious, but I find it hard to believe that you and others haven't heard it before (younger people yes). I'm 72, and as far back as I can remember it's been used (in the media as well) - in a similar vein to "all mouth and no trousers"....don't tell me you haven't heard that one!
I’ve only just turned 36 in fairness.

If it is generally used in a military context, that will be why. Science and non-fiction are more my thing.
 

Sorcerer

Established Member
Joined
20 May 2022
Messages
2,100
Location
Liverpool
One of the biggest wind-ups here for me personally is that if the switch was flipped and the EU nations asked the US to help them with a war they started, the Americans would be demanding some kind of compensation or payments that will take generations to pay back. Already any support to Ukraine is now through buying military gear from the US and then sending it there, and that's an example of a defensive war! In principle I do strongly support the NATO alliance but this particular administration really has me questioning the whole "special relationship" nonsense.
 

Strathclyder

Established Member
Joined
12 Jun 2013
Messages
3,829
Location
Clydebank
Many face injuries caused by people palming themselves have just occurred after hearing this:

Makes a bad headache worse even thinking about what he said.

It's honestly bewildering to me that any world leader that doesn't have him by the short-and-curlies doesn't just get up, walk out and take their entire delegation with them when this is the kind of BS they have to put up with when sitting across from this petulant sack of depraved idiocracy in a ill-fitting suit. First it was with the Irish PM in reference to Churchill eariler this week on St. Patrick's Day, then this Pearl Harbour crap in front of Japan's PM. Never mind face-palming, the multiple-times removed cringe is borderline crippling.

Yes, there are likely a dozen legitimate or at least pragmatic reasons for not doing that, but it still leaves a foul taste in the mouth of anyone who's researched these historical subjects, the effects they had and continue to have in the present day and in turn know precisely why such mindless ignorance may not go over well. But of course, it's asking way too much of The Orange Cadaver and the disintegrating sewer that is his brain.

He seems to have missed the memo about NATO being a defensive alliance. Hey's he's missed nearly all the memos. Maybe he's forgotten how to read.
It routinely staggers me that he can, or that was ever able to, read at all.

"Paper tiger" was an expression popularised (if not invented) by Mao.

Obviously that was quite some time ago and the phrase may be less used these days which may explain some of you being unaware of it (which initially surprised me as you're an erudite bunch). In other words, you're young.
Am 2 weeks (as of today) away from turning 30 and I've been aware of this phrase for quite a few years now. Perhaps it's my interests in history - military or in general - that explain why, as it's primarily used in miltary/political circles and has been in English for centuries as @Gloster notes.

For those outside those spheres, it's basically another way of saying 'all mouth and no trousers' or 'all bark and no bite'. Or, in the context of who it is we're specifically discussing here, 'Trump Always Chickens Out' or TACO.
 
Last edited:

Gloster

Veteran Member
Joined
4 Sep 2020
Messages
13,005
Location
Up the creek
As I said in #4,088 it has been around in English for a couple of centuries and longer in China, but I suspect that it seeped into the consciousness of those who were aware of the news when Mao was around; he died in 1976 and it may have faded a bit in the years since. It is not only a military term, but the military and politics are the most likely uses; it has also been used for a number of books about newspapers.
 

Top