Midlands Rail Hub 20m extra seats

[The Planner]

what's the next step, i.e. what is the next part of the money allocated going to do, ground survey for example? Or still in modelling of something phase?

Detailed design etc its still two years at least before a spade in the ground.

 

[Cross City]

I don't suppose this can support any further funding for the MML electrification and capacity improvements between Wigston South and Syston?

Seeing as the money is for the West Mids Combined Authority, no.

 

[172007]

Network Rail has now announved the compaines to form the "Midlands Rail Hub Alliance"

Source "https://www.networkrailmediacentre....rward-as-midlands-rail-hub-alliance-confirmed"

Major step forward as Midlands Rail Hub Alliance confirmed

The four partners which will design and develop the most transformative railway upgrade in the Midlands have been confirmed.

www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk

The new Midlands Rail Hub Alliance - confirmed to include VolkerRail, Laing O'Rourke, AtkinsRéalis and Siemens Mobility, working alongside Network Rail - will design and develop Midlands Rail Hub and support the build phase.

This will include connecting the Chiltern main line, which runs into Moor Street, with the Camp Hill lines which run towards the South West and East Midlands, via two new chords in Bordesley, near Birmingham city centre.

Alongside this, work is also being prioritised to progress smaller changes to the existing railway which will provide passengers and communities with quicker benefits, including new journey options and more trains.

This includes reopening platform 4 at Snow Hill station, so additional Chiltern Railways services can run directly between Birmingham's business district and London Marylebone, and redeveloping Kings Norton station and the lines through it so extra Cross City trains can be added and new Midlands Rail Hub-

 

[ChilliSauce]

No mention of Electrification.. .it seems.

Such as:
Birmingham to Derby and;
Birmingham to Leicester and;
Birmingham to Leamington Spa.

So all this is going to happen with Smokey old Diesel Units?!

Or seems no proposal to extend the Litchfield Trent Valley High level service onto Burton-On-Trent, and with electrification.

 

[1D54]

No mention of Electrification.. .it seems.

Such as:
Birmingham to Derby and;
Birmingham to Leicester and;
Birmingham to Leamington Spa.

Lines that have never been mentioned for electrification at any time not hardly a surprise.

 

[The Planner]

No mention of Electrification.. .it seems.

Such as:
Birmingham to Derby and;
Birmingham to Leicester and;
Birmingham to Leamington Spa.

So all this is going to happen with Smokey old Diesel Units?!

Or seems no proposal to extend the Litchfield Trent Valley High level service onto Burton-On-Trent, and with electrification.

Its about capacity into Birmingham. Not electrification.

 

[Bald Rick]

No mention of Electrification.. .it seems.

Such as:
Birmingham to Derby and;
Birmingham to Leicester and;
Birmingham to Leamington Spa.

So all this is going to happen with Smokey old Diesel Units?!

Or seems no proposal to extend the Litchfield Trent Valley High level service onto Burton-On-Trent, and with electrification.

None of the above has ever been in this project.

 

[Snow1964]

No mention of Electrification.. .it seems.

Such as:
Birmingham to Derby and;
Birmingham to Leicester and;
Birmingham to Leamington Spa.

These are part of the project.

The only electrification listed (see section 2.8 of attached) is full 4 tracking and electrification Kings Norton-Barnt Green.

https://governance.wmca.org.uk/documents/s23763/Strategic%20Rail%20Update%20and%20Future%20Timetable%20Changes.pdf

Section 2.8 does however mention station remodelling at Water Orton area, and although not currently proposed for electrification, the section to Water Orton runs alongside the new HS2 line where bridges are being rebuilt to provide clearance. So would be fairly cheap to add this later (but rather pointless whilst fleets using this section doesn't include BEMUs or bimodes)

 

[richardderby]

surely this should be called the WEST Midlands hub...

 

[SCDR_WMR]

surely this should be called the WEST Midlands hub...

But the effects of this being implemented impacts Derby and Leicester which are not in the West Midlands last time I checked.

 

[WAO]

There's a difference between the Midlands Rail Hub (MRH), which is what the present proposal is about and the Midlands Engine Rail (MER), which concerns wider Midland links and included £600M for electrification at 2019 prices.

Patience

WAO

https://www.marcheslep.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Midlands-Engine-Rail.pdf

https://www.midlandsconnect.uk/media/blxjckgj/website-accessibility-checked-mrh-report-on-track-for-delivery.pdf

 

[Wyrleybart]

These are part of the project.

The only electrification listed (see section 2.8 of attached) is full 4 tracking and electrification Kings Norton-Barnt Green.

https://governance.wmca.org.uk/documents/s23763/Strategic%20Rail%20Update%20and%20Future%20Timetable%20Changes.pdf

Section 2.8 does however mention station remodelling at Water Orton area, and although not currently proposed for electrification, the section to Water Orton runs alongside the new HS2 line where bridges are being rebuilt to provide clearance. So would be fairly cheap to add this later (but rather pointless whilst fleets using this section doesn't include BEMUs or bimodes)

The problem is that even though Water Orton sees twelve passenger trains an hour, not one of them has AC capability - four voyagers and eight 170s an hour. Both tractions are approx 25 years old, so maybe BEMUs could eventually replace 170s on the XC network, especially if there were a handy 25kV electric charging cable above the platforms at Leicester, Derby and Nottingham.

 

[172007]

Preperation work for Birmingham Snow Hills platform 4 has commenced Monsay with clearance of the tram stop etc.

Snow Hill platform 4 including new crossovers so platform 1 can be accessed from the Jewellery Quarter need to be done for the rail hub project as Chiltern need to relocate to Snow Hill as the Midland Rail Hub project starts.

Source for this is from the workers on site and Snow Hill station staff.

 

[Russel]

Preperation work for Birmingham Snow Hills platform 4 has commenced Monsay with clearance of the tram stop etc.

Snow Hill platform 4 including new crossovers so platform 1 can be accessed from the Jewellery Quarter need to be done for the rail hub project as Chiltern need to relocate to Snow Hill as the Midland Rail Hub project starts.

Source for this is from the workers on site and Snow Hill station staff.

It'll be almost sad to see the old tram stop go, after watching nature slowly reclaim it over the last 10 years!

 

[cle]

So the Snow Hill works will enable both Chiltern services, for example, to terminate there - leaving the Moor St bays for construction (additional line/platform reinstatement?)

And they still doing both platforms (p5/6) or just the p5 (which doesn't look like much work) - and would this same tranche of work include any of the chords work? How about the new platforms on the east side?

 

[barbette165]

Is platform 3 (and will platform 4) be accessible for trains from Moor Street? This would allow the Chiltern terminators to use the P3/P4 island, so that all trains to Solihull and Dorridge would be grouped together.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Is platform 3 (and will platform 4) be accessible for trains from Moor Street? This would allow the Chiltern terminators to use the P3/P4 island, so that all trains to Solihull and Dorridge would be grouped together.

No. That would require so much work to the surrounding area to allow a tunnel. I would imagine there would be issues with foundations given how much development has happened too

 

[barbette165]

No. That would require so much work to the surrounding area to allow a tunnel. I would imagine there would be issues with foundations given how much development has happened too

Sorry, I wasn’t clear. I was referring to Platforms 3 and 4 at Snow Hill. My question was if the crossover already exists south of the Snow Hill platforms to allow a train from Platform 2 at Moor Street to go straight into platforms 3 or 4 at Snow Hill.

 

[Sprinter107]

Platform 3 is available for trains from Moor Street, and does happen from time to time, and yes, platform 4 will also be available for trains coming up from Moor Street.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Sorry, I wasn’t clear. I was referring to Platforms 3 and 4 at Snow Hill. My question was if the crossover already exists south of the Snow Hill platforms to allow a train from Platform 2 at Moor Street to go straight into platforms 3 or 4 at Snow Hill.

Ah yes, apologies.

 

[172007]

All platforms including 4 will be accessible from both Moor Street and Jewellery Quarter. This will also mean a train coming from the Jewellery Quarter can access the sidings by reversing in platform 1 rather than the current method of using Moor Street, Up Down Goods outside Moor Street or as happens with non gangway trains going to Tyseley Carriage Sidings.

There has been plans to make A and B ends of Snow Hills platforms with mid platform signals (same as New Street) but i am not aware of the final decision.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Given permissive working has often been used on 2/3 I can understand why, but I don't really think it's necessary

 

[trundlewagon]

All it needs really is to be made fully permissive, rather than the current rigmarole that has to take place.

 

[The Planner]

All platforms including 4 will be accessible from both Moor Street and Jewellery Quarter. This will also mean a train coming from the Jewellery Quarter can access the sidings by reversing in platform 1 rather than the current method of using Moor Street, Up Down Goods outside Moor Street or as happens with non gangway trains going to Tyseley Carriage Sidings.

There has been plans to make A and B ends of Snow Hills platforms with mid platform signals (same as New Street) but i am not aware of the final decision.

No mid platform signals I am aware of.

 

[Sprinter107]

It is possible to shunt to the sidings at Snow Hill, via the north end of the station. You don't have to go via Moor Street.

 

[172007]

It is possible to shunt to the sidings at Snow Hill, via the north end of the station. You don't have to go via Moor Street.

Rarely done. Operationaly its too disruptive and not pratical as most trains dont have a walk through and there is no walking route to go between vehicles

 

[Sprinter107]

I did it a fortnight ago. And in less than 4 minutes. No more disruptive than taking up a platform at Moor Street. In fact id say less disruptive. In the time it takes to get the train down to Moor Street and back upto Snow Hill, I was already in the sidings. Much quicker.

 

[VItraveller]

It'll be almost sad to see the old tram stop go, after watching nature slowly reclaim it over the last 10 years!”

almost as if cancelling the third entrance to Snowhill which would’ve connected directly to the tram network because of an endangered pigeon species was a bad idea.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

almost as if cancelling the third entrance to Snowhill which would’ve connected directly to the tram network because of an endangered pigeon species was a bad idea.

I remember the old plans to move the main entrance to a pedestrianised Livery Street by The Old Contemptables!

Very much pie in the sky, part of a re-imagined Snow Hill area.

 

[Russel]

almost as if cancelling the third entrance to Snowhill which would’ve connected directly to the tram network because of an endangered pigeon species was a bad idea.

Come again?