Class 810 for East Midlands Railway Construction/Introduction Updates

[Nym]

Thanks, that would explain why I didn't see it, I was expecting some sort of static indicator like on the 222s. I'll keep a close eye out next time , see how far away I can spot it from! It does seem like a backward step though.

You mean technology being used for a problem that didn’t exist for a purpose that will only confuse people.
The only other logical space for a toilet status indicator is in the same area that it “always has been” namely on the body end.

Every single time someone has a tech idea they need to stop and think. Will the squishy meatbags actually think to look there / for this?

I’m going to stop this rant now, because so many things have done this over the years and it’s starting to smack of contrarianism rather than progress.

 

[Merle Haggard]

You mean technology being used for a problem that didn’t exist for a purpose that will only confuse people.
The only other logical space for a toilet status indicator is in the same area that it “always has been” namely on the body end.

Every single time someone has a tech idea they need to stop and think. Will the squishy meatbags actually think to look there / for this?

I’m going to stop this rant now, because so many things have done this over the years and it’s starting to smack of contrarianism rather than progress.

Bit like the ability to display arrival times further down the line on a big rolling screen (vide Cl 805) that, because no-one's worked out how to pass it real time information, it, for instance, shows an arrival time at Holyhead that's in the past when you're only between Llandudno Jct and Bangor.
Or the new (amber) platform displays (Rugby, Crewe) that show coach letters, position of first/cycles accommodation on the outline of a train with one end pointed. This may (or, on Avanti, very likely not) be the front of the train.

 

[hwl]

A diesel heater? I'm surprised they've gone to that complexity when a few coils and a bit of 25kV would be able to warm things up nicely (after all the passenger cabin is heated electrically). Is it so it can also be used for a cold start on diesel?

If memory serves I think they have two pre-heater systems:
1) Pre-heat while on electric power uses uses an electric heater element similar to a repurposed immersion heater element
2) Pre-heat away from electric power uses a Webasto type heater.

 

[800001]

Another unit commenced its mainline testing out of Merchant Park last night, presume it is 810013.

 

[Railperf]

Looks like only one diagram today 810 operated. DY701 in the hands of a 222 today.

 

[Kneedown]

A diesel heater? I'm surprised they've gone to that complexity when a few coils and a bit of 25kV would be able to warm things up nicely (after all the passenger cabin is heated electrically). Is it so it can also be used for a cold start on diesel?

To be honest, I'm not sure how it's powered. It's something we didn't delve into deeply on the course as we can't fix it, and can't get to it. I know it pumps coolant around the engine, heating it in the process. You can see a notable drop in engine temperature when it first kicks in, before the magic starts to happen. This is caused by the cool coolant being pumped before it warms up.

 

[720144]

222004 filling in on DY701 today instead of 810006.

 

[FrontSideBus]

Why not just start it and let it idle for 5-10 minutes?

 

[jontyasaurus]

Nothing technical I can add, but on my first journey up from London on Sunday, I was paying close attention to the switchover point, and it surprised me how close to Wigston junction the diesel engines rumbled in to life!

 

[liamf656]

222004 filling in on DY701 today instead of 810006.

Not anymore, it was out originally on it but it's been swapped onto a 5 car 222 diagram. DY701 is now a 5 car 222 from 1D61 onwards

 

[222001]

Realtime Trains | 1F32 1132 St Pancras International to Sheffield | 16/12/2025

Real-time train running information for 1F32 1132 departure from St Pancras International to Sheffield on 16/12/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Looks like 810006 was swapped onto the diagram at Derby on 1F32. However, the return working from Sheffield was cancelled due to a 'problem with the doors', and 810006 went empty back to Etches.

 

[800001]

Why not just start it and let it idle for 5-10 minutes?

Because starting the engine cold shortens the life of the engine (someone will be able to tell me correct figure).

Hitachi do not like the engines cold started, they should always be preheated before being started.

The only exception is in emergency's, eg, total loss of OHL power and you need the engines on to provide normal or hotel power.

Any cold start of engines need to be notified to the Hitachi maintenance controllers at the relevant TOC.

 

[MCR247]

Realtime Trains | 1F32 1132 St Pancras International to Sheffield | 16/12/2025

Real-time train running information for 1F32 1132 departure from St Pancras International to Sheffield on 16/12/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Looks like 810006 was swapped onto the diagram at Derby on 1F32. However, the return working from Sheffield was cancelled due to a 'problem with the doors', and 810006 went empty back to Etches.

Seems a bit pointless that.

 

[800001]

Seems a bit pointless that.

It wouldn't have been pointless if the door fault hadn't occurred.

 

[Wyrleybart]

Because starting the engine cold shortens the life of the engine (someone will be able to tell me correct figure).

Hitachi do not like the engines cold started, they should always be preheated before being started.

The only exception is in emergency's, eg, total loss of OHL power and you need the engines on to provide normal or hotel power.

Any cold start of engines need to be notified to the Hitachi maintenance controllers at the relevant TOC.

Goe back a generation ago to the MTU 4000s in the HST power cars. They always had to be warm starts or else MTU deducted hour from from the lives of the engines.

 

[AndrewJM70]

Finally got on an 810 today - Set 010 operating the 2232 St Pancras to Leicester. It was well worth the wait! What a step change from the 222. I can't fault it. I couldn't honestly tell when we switched from electric to diesel power. The (first class) seats were great, the lighting was slightly brighter than the 222s but nowhere near as bright as the HSTs and the air con noise didn't bother me. It was a sheer pleasure after years of waiting. Roll on more sets!

 

[720144]

810006 is booked on DY702
222003 booked for DY701.

 

[Railperf]

810006 is booked on DY702
222003 booked for DY701.

All 222's today. Although an 810 could be inserted into a diagram as was attempted yesterday - subject to availability.

 

[D365]

All 222's today. Although an 810 could be inserted into a diagram as was attempted yesterday - subject to availability.

Explains why 010 caught me by surprise!

 

[Merle Haggard]

Because starting the engine cold shortens the life of the engine (someone will be able to tell me correct figure).

Hitachi do not like the engines cold started, they should always be preheated before being started.

The only exception is in emergency's, eg, total loss of OHL power and you need the engines on to provide normal or hotel power.

Any cold start of engines need to be notified to the Hitachi maintenance controllers at the relevant TOC.

Does the same apply to cooling down? If the engine is switched off when hot the coolant no longer circulates so there will be hot spots and uneven contraction. Always seemed to me thoughtless that the Valenta-engined HST power cars were shut down at St Pancras immediately the wheels stopped tiurning.

 

[liamf656]

810006 is booked on DY702
222003 booked for DY701.

It's probably best to hang fire until sunrise before relying on Realtimetrains as last minute swaps keep happening to the allocations. 810006 isn't out and I believe it wasn't even planned to be

 

[800001]

Does the same apply to cooling down? If the engine is switched off when hot the coolant no longer circulates so there will be hot spots and uneven contraction. Always seemed to me thoughtless that the Valenta-engined HST power cars were shut down at St Pancras immediately the wheels stopped tiurning.

Regards engine switch off etc, I have no idea.

 

[Merle Haggard]

Regards engine switch off etc, I have no idea.

Thanks.
Just remember there were ominous 'clicks' when the power cars were cooling down

 

[800001]

It's probably best to hang fire until sunrise before relying on Realtimetrains as last minute swaps keep happening to the allocations. 810006 isn't out and I believe it wasn't even planned to be

There must of been a plan to run 810006, otherwise it wouldn't have initially been allocated.
Obviously an issue cropped up which meant that a 222 is now operating instead.

 

[liamf656]

There must of been a plan to run 810006, otherwise it wouldn't have initially been allocated.
Obviously an issue cropped up which meant that a 222 is now operating instead.

I suppose so. I were told at 7pm last night they didn't want it back out, but they must have tried like you say haha

 

[Railperf]

I suppose so. I were told at 7pm last night they didn't want it back out, but they must have tried like you say haha

The driver door issue cropped up again. didn't it happen before on the same or another unit? I guess it needs properly sorting out before they let the sets out again. Wasn't one stuck at Leicester for 20 mins or so a few days ago with the same fault?

 

[Paul472426]

Seems a bit pointless that.

Was very pointless, it delayed a train full of passengers at Derby, as 006 was late to the platform and with all the end change procedures it was an age before the doors opened, and it left 20 mins late. Would have made more sense to have done the change at the start of the next journey at Sheffield, when any door issue might be discovered prior to departing and the original 222 could have run the service

 

[Kneedown]

Does the same apply to cooling down? If the engine is switched off when hot the coolant no longer circulates so there will be hot spots and uneven contraction.

Engine shut down cycle whether manual or automatic, incorporates a ~4min cool down cycle before final shutdown.
In an emergency the engines can be shut down immediately.

 

[720144]

It's probably best to hang fire until sunrise before relying on Realtimetrains as last minute swaps keep happening to the allocations. 810006 isn't out and I believe it wasn't even planned to be

It was swapped again in the last minute. Don’t know what’s happening with 810012 which only came into service last Friday & hasn’t been out ever since.

 

[Railperf]

Was very pointless, it delayed a train full of passengers at Derby, as 006 was late to the platform and with all the end change procedures it was an age before the doors opened, and it left 20 mins late. Would have made more sense to have done the change at the start of the next journey at Sheffield, when any door issue might be discovered prior to departing and the original 222 could have run the service

That's the point of a 'soft' launch. If a problem occurrs - the issue can be identified and the trains taken out of service and fixed. Luckily EMR have the two 7-car 222's to hand for the moment - which can cover any service. The problem with this last incident was that there wasn't seemingly a spare 222 or enough train crew to restart the diagram at Sheffield or Derby. So in addition to the delay, it caused a cancellation - which woud have triggered delay repay payments.
Hopefully the door issues can be resolved in time before the spare 222's go off-lease!
That's twice now that an 810 was terminated at Sheffield with the return leg cancelled. Making the next 5-car 222 rather cosy!