First Greater Glasgow

[JumpinTrainz]

What’s with Glasgow getting all the cast offs and second hand buses lately? Isn’t Glasgow one of First’s busiest and biggest operations?

We’ve not had new buses since 2023 (airport buses excluded) and there’s been no new order announced heading into 2026. England are receiving Yutongs and Electroliners in masses. I thought the B9TLs would have been replaced by new buses rather than refurbished/converted ones. Have First HQ fallen out with Glasgow

 

[Volvodart]

What’s with Glasgow getting all the cast offs and second hand buses lately? Isn’t Glasgow one of First’s busiest and biggest operations?

We’ve not had new buses since 2023 (airport buses excluded) and there’s been no new order announced heading into 2026. England are receiving Yutongs and Electroliners in masses. I thought the B9TLs would have been replaced by new buses rather than refurbished/converted ones. Have First HQ fallen out with Glasgow

First West Yorkshire is similar regarding size and profits and it is a lot worse for new buses than Glasgow. We do not know what Glasgow wanted to get in the unsuccessful (and now re-activated) Scotzeb2 bid, so we shall find out when an announcement is made of the successful bidders.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

What’s with Glasgow getting all the cast offs and second hand buses lately? Isn’t Glasgow one of First’s busiest and biggest operations?

We’ve not had new buses since 2023 (airport buses excluded) and there’s been no new order announced heading into 2026. England are receiving Yutongs and Electroliners in masses. I thought the B9TLs would have been replaced by new buses rather than refurbished/converted ones. Have First HQ fallen out with Glasgow

When Glasgow was getting masses of new buses, what was happening in other areas? They got next to nothing! West of England got new vehicles in 2019/20, and aside for 20 odd Streetdecks for Weston super Mare, they had nothing until this year. As @Volvodart says, First West Yorkshire is a similar powerhouse operation and it received about 70 new vehicles during 2020-23 (of which some were for specific contracts like P&R).

Facts are that between 2018 and 2023, Glasgow got a disproportionately high number of new vehicles - very nearly half the fleet was replaced in about five years, even if a few have gone to be cascaded and a batch returned off lease.

Between 2023 and 2026, England has been busy awarding finance from ZEBRA bids so First has to provide a large amount of capital to then access that money and help the move to electrification by part funding the vehicles AND the infrastructure. Hence why you're seeing certain operations get new vehicles in England including Somerset, which last received new vehicles in 2009!

Again as @Volvodart says, if the Scottish scheme comes out and First has been successful in its bids, then you'll see more capital allocated to fulfilling those bids. These things are cyclical.

 

[Noddy1]

The problem relates to no funding for new vehicles from Scottish Government I am afraid despite their pontificating about Green Issues. Funding is about to be reintroduced in Scotland but I fear this will mean more Chinese buses for First in Scotland or perhaps at best new busesvfrom Wright especially as there are severe doubts about ADL keeping Falkirk and Larbert open.

 

[Scott mac]

Hopefully Glasgow get more of the adl ev400 best bus in the depot just now love having it on the 5

 

[Dfatcontroller]

The problem relates to no funding for new vehicles from Scottish Government I am afraid despite their pontificating about Green Issues. Funding is about to be reintroduced in Scotland but I fear this will mean more Chinese buses for First in Scotland or perhaps at best new busesvfrom Wright especially as there are severe doubts about ADL keeping Falkirk and Larbert open.

I'm sure it's no coincidence that ScotZEB2 has been reopened after ADL express concerns about closing Camelon/Larbert. I'm sure any bid involving vehicles not built in Scotland will be removed from the pile/unsuccessful.

 

[Noddy1]

Bo doubt the Scottish Government might put pressure on operators to buy ADL products given what is happening in Falkirk and Larbeet. Remember that First Group, McGills etc are private companies and will make purchasing decisions based on what they see as the best outcome for them.

 

[JumpinTrainz]

I can’t see anymore ADLs being ordered for Glasgow after the mess of the build quality on the current stock. I imagine anything new that comes our way will be Wright. I’d be happy to see Yutongs - they really are nice buses and have much better range.

 

[Scott mac]

I can’t see anymore ADLs being ordered for Glasgow after the mess of the build quality on the current stock. I imagine anything new that comes our way will be Wright. I’d be happy to see Yutongs - they really are nice buses and have much better range.

Was only the e200ev they had problems with the e400ev were fine just their range isn't great

 

[JumpinTrainz]

Was only the e200ev they had problems with the e400ev were fine just their range isn't great

I’d say that was grounds not to order anymore…

 

[Scott mac]

I’d say that was grounds not to order anymore…

Well hopefully they order the new ev400 and yutongs for the singles

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

Well hopefully they order the new ev400 and yutongs for the singles

It'll be Wright stuff they order for Double Decks, they're getting more Repowers so it'll be to keep commonality within the fleet

 

[Scott mac]

It'll be Wright stuff they order for Double Decks, they're getting more Repowers so it'll be to keep commonality within the fleet

Dosnt mean anything mate especially with the plans to repower the e400mmc in my own personal opinion the new e400ev is a brilliant bus rapid and has a great range and if a good order is placed it will keep good Scottish workers in a job

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

Dosnt mean anything mate especially with the plans to repower the e400mmc in my own personal opinion the new e400ev is a brilliant bus rapid and has a great range and if a good order is placed it will keep good Scottish workers in a job

No plans to Repower any First Glasgow E400MMCs the trial for ADL isn't till next year before any of that's even considered, Means plenty, I'm in the know about these things

 

[LT02 NVV]

A bunch of Gemini have just been sent for scrap for no real reason. Don’t get why 37743 was withdrawn as it’s an 09 plate.

It’s not like 7-8 Streetdeck re-powers would be able to replace the amount of buses being taken out of use over the past few months.

 

[Scott mac]

No plans to Repower any First Glasgow E400MMCs the trial for ADL isn't till next year before any of that's even considered, Means plenty, I'm in the know about these things

A work for firstbeen spoke about all ready that if the trial works then first will want the Glasgow mmcs done

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Aug 2025 ==

A bunch of Gemini have just been sent for scrap for no real reason. Don’t get why 37743 was withdrawn as it’s an 09 plate.

It’s not like 7-8 Streetdeck re-powers would be able to replace the amount of buses being taken out of use over the past few months.

Believe a lot of the geminis are in a bad way now and to costly to repair a did hear someone mentioned their is more Repowers streetdecks on the way

 

[camro]

A bunch of Gemini have just been sent for scrap for no real reason. Don’t get why 37743 was withdrawn as it’s an 09 plate.

It’s not like 7-8 Streetdeck re-powers would be able to replace the amount of buses being taken out of use over the past few months.

I wouldn't say that being an 09 plate makes a Gemini any better than an 07. Reality is they're all considered old as service buses and have been kept on primarily due to Euro 6 retrofits.

In terms of replacements, it looks pretty dire just now but it really shouldn't be too long until Aberdeen can hand over the rest of their Geminis and Streetlites.

 

[LT02 NVV]

I wouldn't say that being an 09 plate makes a Gemini any better than an 07. Reality is they're all considered old as service buses and have been kept on primarily due to Euro 6 retrofits.

In terms of replacements, it looks pretty dire just now but it really shouldn't be too long until Aberdeen can hand over the rest of their Geminis and Streetlites.

In return they’ll probably get some E300s, because that’s happened a few times after some Streetlites came to Glasgow.

 

[aswilliamsuk]

In return they’ll probably get some E300s, because that’s happened a few times after some Streetlites came to Glasgow.

Once the new hydrogen plant at Aberdeen finally comes on stream, that should allow the 25 Hydrogen StreetDecks to re-enter service. That's what will replace the Geminis and StreetLites - and probably a few E300s too - for release back to Glasgow.

 

[Volvodart]

Once the new hydrogen plant at Aberdeen finally comes on stream, that should allow the 25 Hydrogen StreetDecks to re-enter service. That's what will replace the Geminis and StreetLites - and probably a few E300s too - for release back to Glasgow.

The new plant is not on stream until 2026, if it is on time. There should be a small number in use before then when another facility is upgraded or the depot fuelling is installed.

 

[JumpinTrainz]

Once the new hydrogen plant at Aberdeen finally comes on stream, that should allow the 25 Hydrogen StreetDecks to re-enter service. That's what will replace the Geminis and StreetLites - and probably a few E300s too - for release back to Glasgow.

Even still the ex-Manchester B9TLs will be 17 years old by this point, the E300s will be 13/14 and the Streetlites will be 12 - not to mention they are awful.

I hope some new electrics are en route for Glasgow soon.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Aside from the Streetlites i can't really see anything transferring from Aberdeen to Glasgow as there simply wouldn't be any logical reason for it.

Even still the ex-Manchester B9TLs will be 17 years old by this point, the E300s will be 13/14 and the Streetlites will be 12 - not to mention they are awful.

I hope some new electrics are en route for Glasgow soon.

The Manchester B9TLs are generally in pretty good condition, the two Glasgow ones (37531/39) have also had a fair bit spent on them to sort out longstanding issues that they had when they came north. However as you say the B9TL Geminis will be pushing 17-18 years old by the time the Hydrogens arrive, so its unlikely that they'd see further use considering the type is very much at the top of the list for withdrawals now.

As for the E300s, they're showing their age. While mechanically the Aberdeen and Glasgow E300s are much the same and very hit or miss depending on the specific bus, the condition of the chassis is night and day between them, the Glasgow ones are in very poor condition underneath compared to the native Aberdeen examples which are still very tidy.

 

[JumpinTrainz]

Aside from the Streetlites i can't really see anything transferring from Aberdeen to Glasgow as there simply wouldn't be any logical reason for it.

The Manchester B9TLs are generally in pretty good condition, the two Glasgow ones (37531/39) have also had a fair bit spent on them to sort out longstanding issues that they had when they came north. However as you say the B9TL Geminis will be pushing 17-18 years old by the time the Hydrogens arrive, so its unlikely that they'd see further use considering the type is very much at the top of the list for withdrawals now.

As for the E300s, they're showing their age. While mechanically the Aberdeen and Glasgow E300s are much the same and very hit or miss depending on the specific bus, the condition of the chassis is night and day between them, the Glasgow ones are in very poor condition underneath compared to the native Aberdeen examples which are still very tidy.

I was on an E300 on the 2 only a few weeks ago and they are deplorable internally. They still decimate the 2 despite electric buses being ordered for the route a couple of years back.

As a refurbishment clearly isn’t on the cards for the E300s - it would be nice to see some new stock come in and replace them particularly on the core routes. The E300s would be great trainer buses - they’re still fairly modern and ADL like most of the Glasgow fleet.

 

[Joerf21]

I was on an E300 on the 2 only a few weeks ago and they are deplorable internally. They still decimate the 2 despite electric buses being ordered for the route a couple of years back.

As a refurbishment clearly isn’t on the cards for the E300s - it would be nice to see some new stock come in and replace them particularly on the core routes. The E300s would be great trainer buses - they’re still fairly modern and ADL like most of the Glasgow fleet.

A think the worst E300 will probibly be on the ones, as they are the oldest E300s, plus they get hammered on the expressway every day

 

[JumpinTrainz]

A think the worst E300 will probibly be on the ones, as they are the oldest E300s, plus they get hammered on the expressway every day

Now that the 1 is curtailed to Dumbarton there’s really nothing stopping them running electrics on the route from Scotstoun, eventually. Unless they plan on electrifying Dumbarton.

 

[Joerf21]

I heard scotstoun depot is geting wright street decks to replace the E300 on the 2, is this been confirmed

 

[Metal Mickey]

I heard scotstoun depot is geting wright street decks to replace the E300 on the 2, is this been confirmed

They are allocated on the 38 the vast majority of the time. It makes sense to base them at Caledonia as they already have them for the 500 and it helps with driver and engineer familiarity.

 

[Joerf21]

They are allocated on the 38 the vast majority of the time. It makes sense to base them at Caledonia as they already have them for the 500 and it helps with driver and engineer familiarity.

Yip i know that, but heard their will b a next batch for the 2 for replacing E300s

 

[route101]

I heard scotstoun depot is geting wright street decks to replace the E300 on the 2, is this been confirmed

Good news if true. Deckers replacing singles.

 

[Haribolover06]

I heard scotstoun depot is geting wright street decks to replace the E300 on the 2, is this been confirmed

diesels or repowers?