Adverts mixed into departure boards?

[Horizon22]

I don't think it's advertising when it solves (to a large extent) the issue of people aimlessly walking through the train with all their luggage looking for an unreserved seat.

The issue here is that the train has been cancelled and the message is still showing. This is more down to the ancient software that our industry uses for so many purposes such as rostering and scheduling.

Not really. The CIS will have logic in it to find either specific headcodes / trains run by a certain company / destinations to display a relevant message. This will be automatic after the logic has been programmed in and display once the timetable for the day has loaded for the relevant trains it impacts.

It can be taken off / removed, but frankly that's going to be the last thing on a station controller / info controller's mind during mass disruption.

Anyway, I am not sure this falls under "advertising" exactly. A more modern layout of CIS could actually incorporate some form of advertising in it if there was a specific section and not disproprtionate to the actual train running info, which might help the railway earn some revenue.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 31 Jul 2025 ==

I've had calls from a signaller before saying "Your control are asking what train you're driving, they seem to have lost a few units"

Eh it happens. Especially after mass disruption or a hold to traffic and trains are reformed from origins or worse, mid-route. All the stock diagrams are worthless at this point. Getting trains on the go is the primary aim, working out which stock is where comes after.

 

[ainsworth74]

The time shown in the image is 18:21. I think it's safe to say the 16:15 isn't running.

Oh yes it did!

Realtime Trains | 1536 Harrogate to Peterborough | 26/07/2025

Real-time train running information for 1536 departure from Harrogate to Peterborough on 26/07/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Arrived into Leeds from Harrogate at 1748 and departed Leeds at 1843 before terminating at Peterborough at 2050 a cool 194 minutes late.

 

[357]

Not really. The CIS will have logic in it to find either specific headcodes / trains run by a certain company / destinations to display a relevant message. This will be automatic after the logic has been programmed in and display once the timetable for the day has loaded for the relevant trains it impacts.

It can be taken off / removed, but frankly that's going to be the last thing on a station controller / info controller's mind during mass disruption.

That's basically what I said. The software doesn't have the ability to remove it on cancelled trains (or didn't the last time I asked about this exact issue)

Anyway, I am not sure this falls under "advertising" exactly.

I never said it did.

Eh it happens. Especially after mass disruption or a hold to traffic and trains are reformed from origins or worse, mid-route. All the stock diagrams are worthless at this point. Getting trains on the go is the primary aim, working out which stock is where comes after.

Yep. Interesting that at my old TOC all the units were fitted with GPS for the purposes of Eva+ but control seemingly didn't have access to this - it would have made locating a specific unit much easier after disruption.

Oh yes it did!

Realtime Trains | 1536 Harrogate to Peterborough | 26/07/2025

Real-time train running information for 1536 departure from Harrogate to Peterborough on 26/07/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Arrived into Leeds from Harrogate at 1748 and departed Leeds at 1843 before terminating at Peterborough at 2050 a cool 194 minutes late.

Christ. That beats my record for this month

I just assumed without checking that it was the age old issue of trains not being marked as cancelled correctly further up the chain.

 

[Russel]

Looking at the bigger picture, I don't think this is worth getting worked up over.

The rail industry in general has far bigger issues that need resolving.

 

[The exile]

Really the whole provision of information screens is one of those things that needs a bit of centralised thinking and design work

And regulatory requirement. I would suggest for a start that summary screens must display all departures scheduled for the next 20 minutes, plus all delayed services which should have already left at all times without scrolling. (Exceptions may be made for things like London departures from Clapham Junction or stations like Victoria or Liverpool Street where a split of boards by destination makes sense)

 

[357]

plus all delayed services which should have already left

I agree with your post but feel there should be a cut-off here, something relating to the next train along that route also being shown, or if there is no estimated arrival time (the dreaded "Delayed") etc.

 

[The exile]

I agree with your post but feel there should be a cut-off here, something relating to the next train along that route also being shown, or if there is no estimated arrival time (the dreaded "Delayed") etc.

Ok - but the cut-off needs to be such that it really only comes into play when there’s near complete meltdown. Difficult to lay down rules, but I suppose that what I’m thinking is that a station that is busy enough that the next 20 minutes only just fit on 1 screen probably should have 2 non-scrolling ones to allow for delays, whereas if your non-scrolling screen covers the next 4 hours, that’s probably enough even when there’s near complete are delays.

 

[43066]

So it's okay that information systems can be clogged up with "mere puffs"?

No, but that isn’t what’s happening. I was responding to the other example you gave re. “delicious food”.

The example on the information board isn’t advertising at all, in my view. It’s useful information for passengers who might be unaware they can reserve seats.

 

[Falcon1200]

I've had calls from a signaller before saying "Your control are asking what train you're driving, they seem to have lost a few units

All the stock diagrams are worthless at this point. Getting trains on the go is the primary aim, working out which stock is where comes after.

Indeed. During major disruption it is far more important to keep track of where your Traincrew are than your sets. A lesson learnt the hard way....

 

[800001]

Which is a shame really! Plus even when someone does grasp the nettle we seem to end up with some bits upgraded but not others

Ha I can believe that! I'm sure it wasn't all that long ago that LNER were using post-it notes and index cards to keep tabs on their HSTs and Mk4s. One strong gust of wind from an errant desk fan and chaos could result

It continued with the 8Xx fleet, and only disappeared within the last year.

It did provide a very good instant over view of what the fleets were working.

 

[Andyh82]

More information that shouldn't be on departure summary boards and could easily be replaced with a static sign.

The departure boards at Leeds have loads of room, there is often about an hours worth of departures showing

 

[skyhigh]

The departure boards at Leeds have loads of room, there is often about an hours worth of departures showing

I'm pretty sure they only show the next hour - there's usually blank space at the beginning/end of the day when fewer services are running.

Recently the comment has been something along the lines of "please place smaller bags in the overhead racks" anyway.

 

[norbitonflyer]

I don't think it's advertising when it solves (to a large extent) the issue of people aimlessly walking through the train with all their luggage looking for an unreserved seat.

The issue here is that the train has been cancelled and the message is still showing. This is more down to the ancient software that our industry uses for so many purposes such as rostering and scheduling.

I've seen this before, with short platform or connection information still showing on a train which has been cancelled. You cannot alight from the first four carraiges of a cancelled train!

 

[dvboy]

The issue I have with this is I could be waiting for, say, a 18:35 train and it isn’t on the board 15 minutes before departure point.

There are eight lines of unnecessary text here, so eight more trains that could be shown, and that’s before you start going through the cancelled trains that are well past their departure time.

 

[Frontera2]

That's basically what I said. The software doesn't have the ability to remove it on cancelled trains (or didn't the last time I asked about this exact issue)

The Worldline system can do this, it just needs to be configured / requested by the TOC

 

[Taunton]

Same situation with screen space being wasted by "See It Say It ...", and similar stuff. If organisations other than those managing the departure information want to put their messages around they can put up their own screens.

The DLR has platform departure screens showing the next three trains, which would be useful were the software not able to replace lines 2 and 3 with all sorts of irrelevancies, bland safety messages, See It Say It, etc, all from parts of the organisation who have discovered that the departure boards can be penetrated, and think their messages are more important than anything telling passengers which train is going to their destination.

 

[Andyh82]

The issue I have with this is I could be waiting for, say, a 18:35 train and it isn’t on the board 15 minutes before departure point.

There are eight lines of unnecessary text here, so eight more trains that could be shown, and that’s before you start going through the cancelled trains that are well past their departure time.

As has been pointed out the departure boards at Leeds generally show an hours worth of services even with extra lines of text

The example shown was obviously during major disruption when everything went haywire

 

[Bikeman78]

Same situation with screen space being wasted by "See It Say It ...", and similar stuff. If organisations other than those managing the departure information want to put their messages around they can put up their own screens.

The DLR has platform departure screens showing the next three trains, which would be useful were the software not able to replace lines 2 and 3 with all sorts of irrelevancies, bland safety messages, See It Say It, etc, all from parts of the organisation who have discovered that the departure boards can be penetrated, and think their messages are more important than anything telling passengers which train is going to their destination.

I strongly suspect that the people who mandate these things do not travel by train. If they did, they would discover how annoying it is and come up with a better solution. Departure screens should be for departures only. By all means install other screens for other messages or have paper posters.

 

[Dr Hoo]

I strongly suspect that the people who mandate these things do not travel by train. If they did, they would discover how annoying it is and come up with a better solution. Departure screens should be for departures only. By all means install other screens for other messages or have paper posters.

The counter argument is that it associates additional information that is only relevant to those particular trains with those services. A separate screen (or poster) is not obviously ‘connected’ with specific services.

I agree that the original picture was atypical, at a time when loads of services were cancelled but still displayed. What does a ‘normal’ screenful look like?

 

[dosxuk]

The counter argument is that it associates additional information that is only relevant to those particular trains with those services. A separate screen (or poster) is not obviously ‘connected’ with specific services.

But a general message attached to every departure operated by a specific TOC, regardless of destination, is also not relevant to those particular trains.

A separate screen advertising "visit lner.co.uk to reserve seats up until 5 minutes before departure" would just as easily get this message across. And with a bit of design, be more likely to be read and acknowledged by users than a note attached to a departure listing.

I do wonder what people thinking this is fine would say it instead it was Trainline sponsoring a TOC and attaching "buy tickets for this service up to 15 minutes before departure on trainline.co.uk" to all their departures?

 

[Bikeman78]

The counter argument is that it associates additional information that is only relevant to those particular trains with those services. A separate screen (or poster) is not obviously ‘connected’ with specific services.

I agree that the original picture was atypical, at a time when loads of services were cancelled but still displayed. What does a ‘normal’ screenful look like?

I don't really have a problem with the LNER scenario that prompted this thread. Provided that it's on a big screen with plenty of room to show lots of departures. My comments were aimed at the scenario Taunton describes where totally non service related things are displayed on small departure screens and thus inhibit the ability to display departure information.

 

[ainsworth74]

Another example today this time from Kings Cross:



We have an info screen showing seven departures with the ability to display twelve lines of information. Four of those twelve lines (so a third of our available screen real estate) is taken up with a message for the 1722 and and 1735 LNER services to: "Place small and medium sized bags overhead or under seats". Why? What possible purpose does this message serve in this location? If the 1730 was running presumably we'd have six lines of the screen take up with this announcement? Information screens like this should be for information related to actually travelling. The line advising why the 1730 was cancelled is fine, no issue with that. But four lines to tell us the same thing about two specific trains? If it's that vital that seems like exactly the sort of information that should be on a poster or a separate screen that scrolls through various messages with useful/important information but not time sensitive information.

 

[duffield]

Another example today this time from Kings Cross:

View attachment 186039

We have an info screen showing seven departures with the ability to display twelve lines of information. Four of those twelve lines (so a third of our available screen real estate) is taken up with a message for the 1722 and and 1735 LNER services to: "Place small and medium sized bags overhead or under seats". Why? What possible purpose does this message serve in this location? If the 1730 was running presumably we'd have six lines of the screen take up with this announcement? Information screens like this should be for information related to actually travelling. The line advising why the 1730 was cancelled is fine, no issue with that. But four lines to tell us the same thing about two specific trains? If it's that vital that seems like exactly the sort of information that should be on a poster or a separate screen that scrolls through various messages with useful/important information but not time sensitive information.

In general, given the minimal price of larger flat screens capable of showing more readable lines of information, the screens should be upgraded before they even consider displaying peripheral messages like this. It would also be a considerable improvement if some of the screens which currently display two alternating pages could be enlarged to display one constant page with the same information.

 

[zwk500]

Another example today this time from Kings Cross:

View attachment 186039

We have an info screen showing seven departures with the ability to display twelve lines of information. Four of those twelve lines (so a third of our available screen real estate) is taken up with a message for the 1722 and and 1735 LNER services to: "Place small and medium sized bags overhead or under seats". Why? What possible purpose does this message serve in this location? If the 1730 was running presumably we'd have six lines of the screen take up with this announcement? Information screens like this should be for information related to actually travelling. The line advising why the 1730 was cancelled is fine, no issue with that. But four lines to tell us the same thing about two specific trains? If it's that vital that seems like exactly the sort of information that should be on a poster or a separate screen that scrolls through various messages with useful/important information but not time sensitive information.

The screen is showing trains 40 minutes into the future and not yet arrived. I don't think there is any greater value in including trains more than an hour away that aren't in platforms than in emphasising suitable luggage placement.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The screen is showing trains 40 minutes into the future and not yet arrived. I don't think there is any greater value in including trains more than an hour away that aren't in platforms than in emphasising suitable luggage placement.

Luggage placement information should not be on summary screens. It can be on the platform screens if this actually makes any practical difference, though I doubt it does.

Because many services are hourly, unless there are too many trains to fit on a single line each, screens should show at least an hour's worth of trains so the next train to each destination will always be visible.

 

[ainsworth74]

The screen is showing trains 40 minutes into the future and not yet arrived. I don't think there is any greater value in including trains more than an hour away that aren't in platforms than in emphasising suitable luggage placement.

Luggage placement information should not be on summary screens. It can be on the platform screens if this actually makes any practical difference, though I doubt it does.

Because many services are hourly, unless there are too many trains to fit on a single line each, screens should show at least an hour's worth of trains so the next train to each destination will always be visible.

Exactly, Kings Cross last night was a little odd due to the massive disruption early in the day (at the point I took that photo there was only one train in the main train shed). Usually all those trains listed would be being prepared for boarding rather than showing "Not yet arrived". Indeed later on, as predicated, I got another photo (below) with half the screen taken up showing the same message for three trains.



I'm sorry but this is crackers. The time on the board is 1745 and it's now only showing only five departures through to the 1803 because six lines of text are taken up with an irrelevant duplicated message. If it's so important that this message be conveyed put up a second screen and have that information displayed there. Screens are not that expensive. Now yes, those trains aren't boarding yet due to disruption but I'm sorry if people can't see why having half the board taken up with an irrelevant message is a problem for clear, accurate and timely communication then I think we really are lost.

Departure boards should be concerned with information related to departures. I.e. the time, status and (if it happens) the reason for a delay/cancellation.

 

[zwk500]

Exactly, Kings Cross last night was a little odd due to the massive disruption early in the day (at the point I took that photo there was only one train in the main train shed). Usually all those trains listed would be being prepared for boarding rather than showing "Not yet arrived". Indeed later on, as predicated, I got another photo (below) with half the screen taken up showing the same message for three trains. Why? What is the point of this message? If it is so important spend a bit more to have a screen dedicated to showing various messages like this but leave summary screens free to show actually useful information.

View attachment 186085

I'm sorry but this is crackers. The time on the board is 1745 and it's now only showing only five departures through to the 1803 because six lines of text are taken up with an irrelevant duplicated message. If it's so important that this message be conveyed put up a second screen and have that information displayed there. Screens are not that expensive. Now yes, those trains aren't boarding yet due to disruption but I'm sorry if people can't see why having half the board taken up with an irrelevant message is a problem for clear, accurate and timely communication then I think we really are lost.

Otherwise departure boards should be concerned with information related to departures. I.e. the time, status and (if it happens) the reason for a delay/cancellation.

On this one I completely agree with you. If trains are being advertised with 'Platform TBC' then the priority should be getting as many trains as possible on the screen. Also, only showing 15 minute's worth of trains is extremely poor.

 

[Djgr]

Exactly, Kings Cross last night was a little odd due to the massive disruption early in the day (at the point I took that photo there was only one train in the main train shed). Usually all those trains listed would be being prepared for boarding rather than showing "Not yet arrived". Indeed later on, as predicated, I got another photo (below) with half the screen taken up showing the same message for three trains.

View attachment 186085

I'm sorry but this is crackers. The time on the board is 1745 and it's now only showing only five departures through to the 1803 because six lines of text are taken up with an irrelevant duplicated message. If it's so important that this message be conveyed put up a second screen and have that information displayed there. Screens are not that expensive. Now yes, those trains aren't boarding yet due to disruption but I'm sorry if people can't see why having half the board taken up with an irrelevant message is a problem for clear, accurate and timely communication then I think we really are lost.

Departure boards should be concerned with information related to departures. I.e. the time, status and (if it happens) the reason for a delay/cancellation.

At least they are not flogging "delicious" food

 

[Bikeman78]

Another example today this time from Kings Cross:

View attachment 186039

We have an info screen showing seven departures with the ability to display twelve lines of information. Four of those twelve lines (so a third of our available screen real estate) is taken up with a message for the 1722 and and 1735 LNER services to: "Place small and medium sized bags overhead or under seats". Why? What possible purpose does this message serve in this location? If the 1730 was running presumably we'd have six lines of the screen take up with this announcement? Information screens like this should be for information related to actually travelling. The line advising why the 1730 was cancelled is fine, no issue with that. But four lines to tell us the same thing about two specific trains? If it's that vital that seems like exactly the sort of information that should be on a poster or a separate screen that scrolls through various messages with useful/important information but not time sensitive information.

It's strange that they don't show the same message at different stations. What do they show at Doncaster or Peterborough?

 

[QueensCurve]

It's not an advert. It's pointing out that you can do last minute reservations on LNER if you have a flexible ticket, which is a useful feature and not usual on the railway.

Does that mean a seat can become reserved while you are sitting in it a la Crosscountry?