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Things in living memory which seem very anachronistic now

Mcr Warrior

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How about the weird ATM prototype that was rolled out by Barclays Bank in Enfield High Street in June 1967 and allowed customers using cheques, apparently impregnated with a mildly radioactive substance (really!), to withdraw a fixed £10?!
 
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styles

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JCB is processed on the Discover network, rather than VISA/Mastercard, in the US. I believe in some other western countries like AU/NZ, they're processed by Amex.

The need for a specific 'brand' or card scheme for always-authorised payments is mostly on the decrease. Connectivity in many countries, even developing countries, is so good that you basically default to online authorisation. In fact if take a large proportion of payments by offline authorisation (and the risk of somebody not having the funds), you're likely to get pulled up by the card scheme for it. While the risk will mainly be to the merchant, the scheme won't want to be batting off complaints from issuers about offline authorisations which turn into surprise presentments. Transport is the main exception, where either you're on a plane without connectivity, or you're at a contactless reader at a ticket gateline or boarding a bus and online authorisations would slow things down significantly (plus the amounts involved are relatively tiny so the risk is low).

Handling offline authorisations is baked into most card schemes' systems now, so I can see the separate brandings dropping off as more and more of the systems are combined.
 

GusB

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Maestro became MasterCard Debit and most banks in Europe have changed to this now or are in the process of.

Switch became Maestro in the UK when Switch became more difficult to process in Europe on the Cirrus network (also owned by MasterCard).

Solo was a version of Switch for those who had bad credit or it was a more basic account and, like Visa Electron, requires the transaction to be authorised electronically at the till. Solo couldn't be used for fallback transactions using the old card roller (clunk-click) machines with the carbon imprinter.
I recall having a Solo card and, unlike Switch, authorisation was done at the point of sale. I'm not sure that it couldn't be used for fallback transactions, though; how many retailers would know that it wasn't to be used with the old manual card machines, though?

Most Switch and Laser cards were also cheque guarantee cards. Solo and Visa Electron weren't. Visa Electron has been supercceded also by a version of Visa Debit for those with lower credit scores.
My Switch card functioned as a cheque guarantee card up to £100, if I recall correctly. My Bank of Scotland credit card also guaranteed cheques from my current account. I think Barclaycard offered a similar facility.

I remember the various Royal Bank of Scotland Switch cards - gold cards guaranteed cheques up to £250, silver was £100 and the lowest tier was £50.

Visa Delta was also a thing; TSB issued these instead of Switch.
 

m0ffy

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I recall having a Solo card and, unlike Switch, authorisation was done at the point of sale. I'm not sure that it couldn't be used for fallback transactions, though; how many retailers would know that it wasn't to be used with the old manual card machines, though?

Solo, Visa Electron, and Maestro weren’t embossed, so they wouldn’t imprint when used with a Streamline.

I got caught out by the Netherlands’ reliance on Maestro at a supermarket in Hoek van Holland when I discovered none of my cards would work before boarding the ferry last year. I believe Mastercard has since integrated NL Maestro in to their network proper.

As an aside, when Switch and Solo became Maestro in the UK, the processing network remained Switch on the back end until their discontinuation.
 

cool110

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I got caught out by the Netherlands’ reliance on Maestro...
As an aside, when Switch and Solo became Maestro in the UK, the processing network remained Switch on the back end until their discontinuation.
That caused problems in the other direction with many ex-switch machines not accepting continental Maestro cards.
 

jfollows

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I worked in a card payment processor for a few years. In my first week I was given the history of Diner's Club cards, believed by many to be the first (depending on your definition I guess) credit cards (charge cards, strictly).

I've never seen one in real life though, and we didn't process their payments, even though they're still going.
At IBM, many years ago, we had them as corporate credit cards. We laughed because we could hardly ever use them, especially not for dining, although I think rail tickets were OK.
At least it was a real corporate card; in other words IBM paid the bill and you got in trouble if you misused it. Its replacement American Express required a credit check and the monthly bill got sent to you to pay, so I declined their offer and used one of my own cards instead. I think most “corporate” cards are like this today, other than the Government Procurement Card which comes up in the Daily Mail from time to time as examples of wasteful civil servants.
 

The exile

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I had a coffee in a shop in Greenwich today, take away. something like £3.70?. I bished my card on the usual contactless machine, stood back and waited for it to arrive. I was amazed to see in the middle of the counter an upright " tipping machine" with a screen and a big £4 shown in the middle of it. Only when I looked closer was there a much smaller option to alter the amount. Amazing. Not only £4 was seen to be a fair amount to tip when setting up , but even if you wanted to faff about with it to change the amount and swipe your card again, it would seem to be counterproductive. I would put a few coins in a bowl ( or box) for good service, but be put off having a "£4" in your face and having to fiddle with it to change the amount, as I'm sure a lot of other people would as well. So less tips given for the shop for over complicating things ?
Or indeed, how many people would assume that it was just rounding up the bill to £4.
 

dcbwhaley

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How about the weird ATM prototype that was rolled out by Barclays Bank in Enfield High Street in June 1967 and allowed customers using cheques, apparently impregnated with a mildly radioactive substance (really!), to withdraw a fixed £10?!
RBS had a scheme where they issued you with five miniature (credit card sized) Hollerith cards each of which gave you £5 from their ATM.
You got the cards back with your statement and cleared cheques at the end of the month. (Cleared cheques: another anachronism)
 

styles

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Just reminded me I have a cheque for £281 from HMRC to cash. Takeaway for tea maybe!
 

GordonT

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Writing out a cheque to yourself to get hold of some cash. "Crossing" a cheque - can't remember why this was required without researching it.
 

The exile

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RBS had a scheme where they issued you with five miniature (credit card sized) Hollerith cards each of which gave you £5 from their ATM.
IIRC the money (5 x £1) came in a sort of rigid plastic case. Remarkably, my Dad, who has never exactly been an early adopter of modern technology (think that’s polite enough!) used that service very early. I should imagine it was very quickly superseded by something more flexible and less wasteful.
 

GusB

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Solo, Visa Electron, and Maestro weren’t embossed, so they wouldn’t imprint when used with a Streamline.
Perhaps it was dependent on the bank that issued the card. My Solo card was embossed, and I'm fairly certain that most of the cards that I handled when working in retail were too.
 

Mcr Warrior

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Tried to find pineapple fritters at chippies recently - no luck.
A local outlet specialising in Thai cuisine offers banana fritters served with maple syrup and condensed milk, but apart from something which is listed as "Coconut Bingchu", whatever that is, almost nothing else that might remotely be described as a 'Dessert'. Anyhoo, think we are maybe drifting off topic as regards "Things in living memory which seem very anachronistic now".
 

The exile

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Writing out a cheque to yourself to get hold of some cash. "Crossing" a cheque - can't remember why this was required without researching it.
A normal cheque could be encashed by the payee. What’s more, the payee could endorse it and make someone else the payee. “Crossing” the cheque with A/C payee written in the crossing meant it had to be paid into the payee’s account. Eventually, cheques came pre-crossed.
 

The exile

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Writing out a cheque to yourself to get hold of some cash.
Don’t know whether it was all banks - but the cheque book came with a calendar at the back and the teller would cancel the day on which you cashed a cheque - thus restricting you to once a day. Presumably the idea that a cheque book would last more than 12 months was unthinkable!
While on the subject of cheques, I remember noticing as a nerdy 11 year old that, whereas 1970s cheque books came preprinted with 197_ in the date area, this understandably then changed to 19__ for new ones issued in 1979-ish - but 198_ never appeared, 19__ remaining standard. By the time we reached 2000 I was out of the country and had rather more important things on my mind!
 
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styles

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A normal cheque could be encashed by the payee. What’s more, the payee could endorse it and make someone else the payee. “Crossing” the cheque with A/C payee written in the crossing meant it had to be paid into the payee’s account. Eventually, cheques came pre-crossed.
Which is at least the same principle as postal orders, which can be crossed (payable only to the named recipient), or uncrossed (as close to cash as you can get without being cash probably). Has to get a postal order for Companies House last year. That was a novelty.
 

Tester

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RBS had a scheme where they issued you with five miniature (credit card sized) Hollerith cards each of which gave you £5 from their ATM.
You got the cards back with your statement and cleared cheques at the end of the month. (Cleared cheques: another anachronism)
By 1972, when I opened my first bank account, magnetic stripe cards were in common use, but before then I can recall two bank's versions.

My mum banked with Natwest, and had a reusable plastic card with slots in, which would give £10 at a cash machine with a pin. The card was returned to her by post.

A family friend banked with Barclays, and had paper vouchers with punched holes. These worked similarly to Natwest, but were one shot.
 

Steddenm

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Solo, Visa Electron, and Maestro weren’t embossed, so they wouldn’t imprint when used with a Streamline.

I got caught out by the Netherlands’ reliance on Maestro at a supermarket in Hoek van Holland when I discovered none of my cards would work before boarding the ferry last year. I believe Mastercard has since integrated NL Maestro in to their network proper.

As an aside, when Switch and Solo became Maestro in the UK, the processing network remained Switch on the back end until their discontinuation.
Solo and Maestro cards were embossed but Solo had "electronic use only" printed on the front of the card. Visa Electron cards weren't embossed.

When using the fallback there were different vouchers for different card systems. Visa and MasterCard were on one, Switch on another and Amex had their own as well. This was down to the different merchant numbers for the card systems.

Even though today most EFT terminals accept most cards (I say most, American Express I'm looking at you) when they ask for authorisation online they look at the PAN of the card and work out the card scheme (usually first six digits of the card number) to know which organisation to ask for authorisation. The Merchant Number (or MID/MN) in the background will then auto populate to gain the correct authorisation. Refunds however are usually done offline and are processed in batch when the PDQ polls overnight.

1980s-access-mastercard-credit-card-receipt-for-brittany-ferries-2K2YNKB.jpg
This is a Eurocard, MasterCard, Interbank and Access imprinter voucher. Visa's were virtually the same.

vintage-american-express-card-receipt-2K2YNK5.jpg
This is the American Express version of the voucher which has a different layout to the MasterCard one.

2012-05-20-images-KnuclebusterImprinter.png

And this is the style of the imprinter. A lot of retailers still have imprinters but they are more obsolete these days as most cards no longer have the numbers embossed on them. Most retailers will use their PDQ in offline mode until a connection can be re-established. There is also a telephone authorisation line for most card systems which the auth code can be obtained manually when systems go down.
 
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Killingworth

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As we seem to have become a banking thread at present, when I got my first current account account numbers were still new. Cheque books weren't yet printed with account names and cost 2d stamp duty a cheque, 5/- for a book of 30. Bank staff were expected to recognise every signature before posting the cheques to the correct accounts.
 

styles

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Advantages of and rules around the post-dating of cheques.
We're these ever actually formal rules?

When I was a student in the 2010s, landlords sometimes asked for predated cheques, but when I spoke to my bank about this they said they don't care about the date being in the future and will cash them regardless.

Edit: indeed, it seems the date has no effect and the bill is payable 'on demand';

Bills of Exchange Act 1882:

S13(2) A bill is not invalid by reason only that it is ante-dated or post-dated.'
 

m0ffy

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That caused problems in the other direction with many ex-switch machines not accepting continental Maestro cards.

Who knows why Mastercard thought it was a good idea to give distinct schemes in neighbouring territories the same name.

Solo and Maestro cards were embossed but Solo had "electronic use only" printed on the front of the card. Visa Electron cards weren't embossed.

When using the fallback there were different vouchers for different card systems. Visa and MasterCard were on one, Switch on another and Amex had their own as well. This was down to the different merchant numbers for the card systems.

Even though today most EFT terminals accept most cards (I say most, American Express I'm looking at you) when they ask for authorisation online they look at the PAN of the card and work out the card scheme (usually first six digits of the card number) to know which organisation to ask for authorisation. The Merchant Number (or MID/MN) in the background will then auto populate to gain the correct authorisation. Refunds however are usually done offline and are processed in batch when the PDQ polls overnight.

View attachment 185530
This is a Eurocard, MasterCard, Interbank and Access imprinter voucher. Visa's were virtually the same.

View attachment 185531
This is the American Express version of the voucher which has a different layout to the MasterCard one.

View attachment 185532

And this is the style of the imprinter. A lot of retailers still have imprinters but they are more obsolete these days as most cards no longer have the numbers embossed on them. Most retailers will use their PDQ in offline mode until a connection can be re-established. There is also a telephone authorisation line for most card systems which the auth code can be obtained manually when systems go down.

Very interesting insight, thanks!
 

jfollows

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We're these ever actually formal rules?

When I was a student in the 2010s, landlords sometimes asked for predated cheques, but when I spoke to my bank about this they said they don't care about the date being in the future and will cash them regardless.

Edit: indeed, it seems the date has no effect and the bill is payable 'on demand';

Bills of Exchange Act 1882:
Yes, I think it was just to act as a reminder to the recipient on when to pay the cheque in.
 

styles

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Yes, I think it was just to act as a reminder to the recipient on when to pay the cheque in.
I think some banks did honour it (and some banks didn't even allow them), but it was very much a case that you'd have no recourse as the cheque writer if the other person cashed it early, which I imagine some dodgy landlords do.
 

Killingworth

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We're these ever actually formal rules?

When I was a student in the 2010s, landlords sometimes asked for predated cheques, but when I spoke to my bank about this they said they don't care about the date being in the future and will cash them regardless.

Edit: indeed, it seems the date has no effect and the bill is payable 'on demand';

Bills of Exchange Act 1882:
The date mattered. Many post dated cheques were issued, not just advance rent. Birthday or Chistmas present cheques were routinely post dated to mark the day for the recipient and to ensure the writer would still have funds when presented. If presented early they would be returned "Post dated". They'd also be returned if over 6 months old "Out of date"

Many a business or private customer relied on this to avoid their cheques being returned marked "Return to drawer" a bounced cheque. That would go against credit ratings. Post dated or out of date wouldn't. Another deliberate ruse to gain time was to write the cheque with words and figures differing, that would be returned "Words and figuŕes differ" Or making an alteration without intialling the alterations returned "Alteration requires drawers confirmatiion".

Many a struggling business running out of funds would use all these ruses to keep cheques from being presented for as long as possible. The cheques in the post! Then a replacement cheque would be delayed another way when the first was defective. And there were more ways to play the system.

Credit controllers usually knew what was going on but couldn't legally prove it.

Checking all those cheques is what kept bank staff busy, and is partly why there aren't bank branches and staff any more.
 
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SargeNpton

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As an aside to the credit card matters above...

The Barclaycard authorisation telephone number was one digit different to that of the Red Star parcels office at Northampton station. Retailers phoned the freephone number at BT, with its operator then forwarding the call to Barclaycard.

Several times in the late 70s I answered the Red Star phone to someone asking for a credit card authorisation - in the days when the shop-floor limit was about £30.
 

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