Future expansion of the UK Motorway Network

[DiscoSteve]

when I was about 10 (nearly 50 years ago) I used draw might-be motorways maps on scraps of paper like that...

this is basically no better or worse from a fantasy perspective

 

[Cowley]

when I was about 10 (nearly 50 years ago) I used draw might-be motorways maps on scraps of paper like that...

this is basically no better or worse from a fantasy perspective

I used to do exactly the same!

 

[nlogax]

I used to do exactly the same!

Hah.. same. And the imaginary signs that would go with them.

 

[Cowley]

Hah.. same. And the imaginary signs that would go with them.

I think we were living in an era where there were huge new motorway projects being built and this was before we’d realised that more and more road building maybe wasn’t the answer.

To a young mind that was contemplating how long it took to get from Exeter to Nottingham in the back of a Mini before the M42 was completed and who was also able to see the dotted blue lines of future motorways on maps, as well as the new roads under construction, snaking off into the distance as you were turfed off onto a busy A road, it was quite an exciting time…

 

[nlogax]

I think we were living in an era where there were huge new motorway projects being built and this was before we’d realised that more and more road building maybe wasn’t the answer.

To a young mind that was contemplating how long it took to get from Exeter to Nottingham in the back of a Mini before the M42 was completed and who was also able to see the dotted blue lines of future motorways on maps,

Absolutely! As a kid there was a lot of joy to be found thumbing through the motorway maps in my granddad's AA Member's handbook, looking at yet-to-be-started chunks of the M3, M25 and A1M denoted as 'Projected'

as well as the new roads under construction, snaking off into the distance as you were turfed off onto a busy A road, it was quite an exciting time…

The cones and temporary 'End of Motorway' signage as you descended a slip road while the remaining stub of carriageway promised bright and better things in the future, maybe even a new bridge to carry the road across the forlorn roundabout or t-junction below. Ahh, good times.

 

[Mikey C]

when I was about 10 (nearly 50 years ago) I used draw might-be motorways maps on scraps of paper like that...

this is basically no better or worse from a fantasy perspective

I used to do the same. Drawing an area, then adding motorways and bypasses to it.

I have to say that I did a much better job with bm junctions than the real transport planners, they all had proper free flow junctions, not nasty stacked roundabouts

 

[nlogax]

I have to say that I did a much better job with bm junctions than the real transport planners, they all had proper free flow junctions, not nasty stacked roundabouts

One of the joys of road design during childhood. Pesky little things like budgets and planning permission never got in the way and everything free-flowed to everything else!

 

[Harpo]

On the serious side, getting the long threatened western extension of the M42 joined to the M6 would be good, although you have to suspect it would be a toll and leave the Brum section of the M6 as bad as it is today.

 

[JamesT]

On the serious side, getting the long threatened western extension of the M42 joined to the M6 would be good, although you have to suspect it would be a toll and leave the Brum section of the M6 as bad as it is today.

Do you have something that explains that a little further? Extending the M42 West would be going beyond the M5, rather than anything to do with the M6, wouldn't it?

 

[Harpo]

Do you have something that explains that a little further? Extending the M42 West would be going beyond the M5, rather than anything to do with the M6, wouldn't it?

Its a proposal with a very long history for a western loop from the M42/M5 junction to the west of Stourbridge and Wolves and then to the M54 and M6.

 

[Indigo Soup]

On the serious side, getting the long threatened western extension of the M42 joined to the M6 would be good, although you have to suspect it would be a toll and leave the Brum section of the M6 as bad as it is today.

The section from the M6 and M6 Toll to the M54 did resurface as a toll road in the 2000s, and the northern terminal of the M6 Toll has been laid out in a way that would allow for such a connection.

The Solihull-Strensham motorway would also have its uses; the M5 was widened instead.

 

[edwin_m]

Its a proposal with a very long history for a western loop from the M42/M5 junction to the west of Stourbridge and Wolves and then to the M54 and M6.

Is there a map? Looks like it might hit a relatively unspoiled bit of countryside.

 

[JamesT]

Is there a map? Looks like it might hit a relatively unspoiled bit of countryside.

https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/?title=Western_Orbital appears the the proposal in question?

The Western Orbital (or formally A Western Orbital Route for the West Midlands Conurbation) was a proposed motorway that would have passed to the west of Wolverhampton and the Black Country.

 

[Bald Rick]

Do you have something that explains that a little further? Extending the M42 West would be going beyond the M5, rather than anything to do with the M6, wouldn't it?

Is there a map? Looks like it might hit a relatively unspoiled bit of countryside.

Pathetic Motorways has a good selection of maps for the Western Orbital.

Pathetic Motorways

Examines and pokes fun at some of the lesser known British motorways. Includes photos and videos

pathetic.org.uk

 

[gingerheid]

The last time I went down the new stretch of the A14 I wondered if we almost got an M14. The Ellington - Fen Ditton stretch is identical to a smart motorway, but opened after the point at which Smart Motorway became a bad word?

 

[ABB125]

The last time I went down the new stretch of the A14 I wondered if we almost got an M14. The Ellington - Fen Ditton stretch is identical to a smart motorway, but opened after the point at which Smart Motorway became a bad word?

The new bit of the A14 was designed as a smart motorway*. However, I seem to remember reading something about there not being enough parliamentary time available to deal with the legislation required to make it a motorway. So they simply didn't - hence we're stuck with it being an A road. (Though of course it's possible that this was a convenient excuse to avoid using the word "motorway", which for some reason terrifies anyone at National Highways.)
The Lower Thames Crossing is a far more stupid example of "not a motorway-ism": a high capacity road, linking two motorways, designed to take long distance and international traffic, which will have traffic class restrictions on it from the day it opens. Sounds like it should be a motorway, right? Wrong! It's being designed as an A road...

*As usual, I should mention that "motorway" is merely a legal distinction from other roads; it is completely separate from the standard of the road (eg: number of lanes). The fact that, conventionally, motorways is Britain have had a hard shoulder and usually 3 lanes each way (but sometimes 2 or 4) is irrelevant. A road with 4 lanes each way and a hard shoulder can be an unclassified road**. A single carriageway road can be a motorway.
**Well, technically not, as I think the design standards decree that a non-motorway road cannot have more than 3 lanes. But that's simply an arbitrary statement and is besides the point...

 

[MotCO]

The new bit of the A14 was designed as a smart motorway*. However, I seem to remember reading something about there not being enough parliamentary time available to deal with the legislation required to make it a motorway. So they simply didn't - hence we're stuck with it being an A road. (Though of course it's possible that this was a convenient excuse to avoid using the word "motorway", which for some reason terrifies anyone at National Highways.)
The Lower Thames Crossing is a far more stupid example of "not a motorway-ism": a high capacity road, linking two motorways, designed to take long distance and international traffic, which will have traffic class restrictions on it from the day it opens. Sounds like it should be a motorway, right? Wrong! It's being designed as an A road...

*As usual, I should mention that "motorway" is merely a legal distinction from other roads; it is completely separate from the standard of the road (eg: number of lanes). The fact that, conventionally, motorways is Britain have had a hard shoulder and usually 3 lanes each way (but sometimes 2 or 4) is irrelevant. A road with 4 lanes each way and a hard shoulder can be an unclassified road**. A single carriageway road can be a motorway.
**Well, technically not, as I think the design standards decree that a non-motorway road cannot have more than 3 lanes. But that's simply an arbitrary statement and is besides the point...

But motorways do restrict the type of traffic which can use them. Hence the Dartford Crossing is an A road so everyone can use it (except horse and carts?).

 

[DarloRich]

The A19 doesn't need to be a motorway. it wasn't a motorway when the steel works, chemical works and mines were going full tilt so it isn't needed now. It copes very well with the traffic levels at present.

What does need fixing in the north east is the A66 and the A1 north of Newcastle. Both need to be dualled throughout.

 

[sannox]

A66 is one that really should be fully upgraded and bypassed. Motorway would be nice, but even decent dual carriageway is fine.

 

[GDKEnts]

The A19 doesn't need to be a motorway. it wasn't a motorway when the steel works, chemical works and mines were going full tilt so it isn't needed now. It copes very well with the traffic levels at present.

What does need fixing in the north east is the A66 and the A1 north of Newcastle. Both need to be dualled throughout.

The main issue with the A19 is the standard of the driving.
Fully agree with the A66 and A1. Most of the junctions in my experience need to be upgraded to grade separated junctions.

 

[WibbleWobble]

The last time I went down the new stretch of the A14 I wondered if we almost got an M14. The Ellington - Fen Ditton stretch is identical to a smart motorway, but opened after the point at which Smart Motorway became a bad word?

M14 no, probably an extension to the M11 instead.

A66 is one that really should be fully upgraded and bypassed. Motorway would be nice, but even decent dual carriageway is fine.

M6 to A1 is supposed to have started, but has been delayed by Reeve's spending review. Should be a yes/no update in the spring.

 

[Snex]

The A19 doesn't need to be a motorway. it wasn't a motorway when the steel works, chemical works and mines were going full tilt so it isn't needed now. It copes very well with the traffic levels at present.

What does need fixing in the north east is the A66 and the A1 north of Newcastle. Both need to be dualled throughout.

To be fair the A19 does need some improvements and doesn't cope well, at all, in some parts, especially in the Teesside area on the flyover and at Moor Farm to the North East of Newcastle.

There's a lot of roads in the North East which are higher priority than the A1 imo which would be nice but it doesn't need to be dualled North of Alnwick, it just isn't busy ie:

• The mess at the A1/A1231/A194(M) junction at the South of Gateshead.
• Durham East / West Bypass.
• Darlington Northern Bypass.
• Gateshead Town Centre and Newcastle Bridges including the High Level Rail Bridge
• Junction improvements all over the place on numerous roads; A19/A690, A194(M)/A184, A19/A174, A19/A1056, A19/A179 - just to pick a few

Just to pick out a few.

Related to the OP, I'd be surprised if there's another Motorway ever built in the future personally.

 

[DarloRich]

Darlington Northern Bypass.

should be sorted out with the garden village development - if it ever happens!

 

[Bald Rick]

Well, technically not, as I think the design standards decree that a non-motorway road cannot have more than 3 lanes

The A27 Havant bypass and A282 QEII bridge say hello!

 

[Snex]

should be sorted out with the garden village development - if it ever happens!

Aye, believe there's a lot of local opposition blocking that right now. Definitely needed though, mind all of those I listed have had on and off plans. Believe Durham's was similar and was about opening land to the North of the City but that's gone quiet lately aswell.

 

[ABB125]

The A27 Havant bypass and A282 QEII bridge say hello!

There are obviously exceptions like this, and it's entirely possible that I've misremembered what it says!
Pretty sure it also says motorways shouldn't have more than 4 lanes. M25 western section says hello in that case (6 lanes past Heathrow, 5 as far as the M3), plus some of the M8. I seem to remember reading somewhere that this is the reason why the M8/M74/M77 junction in Glasgow was built "properly", rather than cheaping out and just adding loads of lanes to the same carriageway (like the M2 in Belfast, although that's not quite the same, or the aforementioned M25 past Heathrow...)

It often seems to be the case that National Highways (and predecessors) are happy to use these derogations from standard when it suits them, yet are also quite happy to insist on meeting the standards when they perhaps don't want to do a project...

 

[DarloRich]

Aye, believe there's a lot of local opposition blocking that right now.

just a bit!

I still maintain that the A66 should be a dual carriage way from A1M to M6 - unsure how practical that would be on the Penrith > Workington section

 

[MotCO]

The new bit of the A14 was designed as a smart motorway*. However, I seem to remember reading something about there not being enough parliamentary time available to deal with the legislation required to make it a motorway. So they simply didn't - hence we're stuck with it being an A road. (Though of course it's possible that this was a convenient excuse to avoid using the word "motorway", which for some reason terrifies anyone at National Highways.)
The Lower Thames Crossing is a far more stupid example of "not a motorway-ism": a high capacity road, linking two motorways, designed to take long distance and international traffic, which will have traffic class restrictions on it from the day it opens. Sounds like it should be a motorway, right? Wrong! It's being designed as an A road...

*As usual, I should mention that "motorway" is merely a legal distinction from other roads; it is completely separate from the standard of the road (eg: number of lanes). The fact that, conventionally, motorways is Britain have had a hard shoulder and usually 3 lanes each way (but sometimes 2 or 4) is irrelevant. A road with 4 lanes each way and a hard shoulder can be an unclassified road**. A single carriageway road can be a motorway.
**Well, technically not, as I think the design standards decree that a non-motorway road cannot have more than 3 lanes. But that's simply an arbitrary statement and is besides the point...

Thinking more about this. Does it make a difference whether or not there is a parallel ARoad to take the excluded traffic to the same destination? The new A14 cannot be replicated by the old A14 since it was severed in Huntingdon (but there are old roads you could go down).
However, is there an A1 equivalent for non-motorway traffic when the A1 turns into the A1(M), if not, how do learners or mopeds travel north or south without taking a circuitous route?

 

[DarloRich]

To be fair the A19 does need some improvements and doesn't cope well, at all, in some parts, especially in the Teesside area on the flyover and at Moor Farm to the North East of Newcastle.

it does but those areas are not easy to fix - look at all the work needed to fix Silverlink! The Tees Flyover isn't going to change

 

[Mikey C]

The A27 Havant bypass and A282 QEII bridge say hello!

The A2 between Dartford and the M2 is effectively a D4M motorway, but with green signs!