Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway: progress updates

[Goldfish62]

The issue at Richmond seems to have been resolved thankfully.

Yes, I noticed that yesterday.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jan 2025 ==

Unfortunately 8 cancellations on the Windsors today and 6 on Shepperton. SWR still unable to reliably deliver the few 701 diagrams they are trying to run Happy new year.

Add the inability of SWR to roll-out an effective driver training programme to their catalogue of failures since 2017. Or maybe they've simply given up with just four months left of their contract.

 

[norbitonflyer]

The issue at Richmond seems to have been resolved thankfully.

Unfortunately 8 cancellations on the Windsors today and 6 on Shepperton. SWR still unable to reliably deliver the few 701 diagrams they are trying to run Happy new year.

All six diagrams running, but RTT is being mysterious about what is running one of the Shepperton diagrams. (2H15 at the time of typing)

EDIT - just seen it - it is 701036, so we have another full house

 

[PG]

Or maybe they've simply given up with just four months left of their contract.

Probably not though given that it'll be the same folk trying to get them into service in 6 months time.

 

[OneTrackMinded]

Or maybe they've simply given up with just four months left of their contract.

SWR management is separate from First Group management. So they’ll be staying after nationalisation. Remember, all that’s changing is the owner, for now

 

[43066]

Add the inability of SWR to roll-out an effective driver training programme to their catalogue of failures since 2017. Or maybe they've simply given up with just four months left of their contract.

A lot of that will have been down to the issues with the units initially, and problems with signing off the method of operation more recently. Now that those road blocks are out of the way there should be scope for things to ramp up.

 

[Goldfish62]

A lot of that will have been down to the issues with the units initially, and problems with signing off the method of operation more recently. Now that those road blocks are out of the way there should be scope for things to ramp up.

There's always some problem. A new one will be created to further prevent speedy introduction.

As I highlight in post #11610 Alston had already by late November made available more units for passenger service than SWR have got anywhere close to using so far, so it's not a train supply issue.

 

[43066]

There's always some problem. A new one will be created to further prevent speedy introduction

I was trying to be optimistic .

It has been a debacle from the start.

 

[Goldfish62]

SWR management is separate from First Group management. So they’ll be staying after nationalisation. Remember, all that’s changing is the owner, for now

They'll be set different remits and I'd be surprised if the MD and maybe other directors don't change.

All FirstGroup will be concerned with now is that SWR maximises its management fee at minimal cost for the next few months. I'm sure they'll be able to find ways of doing that contractually while "taking their hands off the tiller" .

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jan 2025 ==

I was trying to be optimistic .

It has been a debacle from the start.

I'm usually the one trying to be on the optimist on this thread.

 

[Invincible]

They'll be set different remits and I'd be surprised if the MD and maybe other directors don't change.

All FirstGroup will be concerned with now is that SWR maximises its management fee at minimal cost for the next few months. I'm sure they'll be able to find ways of doing that contractually while "taking their hands off the tiller" .

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jan 2025 ==


I'm usually the one trying to be on the optimist on this thread.

The current MD is on an interim basis, the DfT will board for a new MD, possible the acting MD may get the job?
On the BBC report he said he was going to get 10 more 701s in service.

 

[D365]

As I highlight in post #11610 Alston had already by late November made available more units for passenger service than SWR have got anywhere close to using so far, so it's not a train supply issue.

Said units have been handed over to SWR, but most of them still aren’t ’agreed’ for passenger service.

On the BBC report he said he was going to get 10 more 701s in service.

Does the report state how he will be achieving this?

 

[Goldfish62]

The current MD is on an interim basis, the DfT will board for a new MD, possible the acting MD may get the job?
On the BBC report he said he was going to get 10 more 701s in service.

Perhaps he will - depends if DOL (DfT Operator Ltd) want him and what FirstGroup may have planned for him. There's plenty of open access stuff to get working on.

Which BBC report was this? If the one from the launch, yes, we know - another 10 units taking a ridiculous six months to introduce. The best part of a year to introduce 15 units, with another 75 to follow. Another 5 years at the current pace. Best start overhauling the 455s and the remaining 458/5s.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jan 2025 ==

Said units have been handed over to SWR, but most of them still aren’t ’agreed’ for passenger service.

So Alstom have said they're available for passenger service, but SWR disagree? is there no end to this farce?

 

[nctd2306]

701042 has made it to Reading on a test run today, nice to see some progress hopefully being made on the Reading line.

 

[D365]

So Alstom have said they're available for passenger service, but SWR disagree? is there no end to this farce?

Alstom isn’t dealing directly with the driver reps - that’s the short answer.

 

[Goldfish62]

Alstom isn’t dealing directly with the driver reps - that’s the short answer.

So the trains that Alstom have made available to SWR but aren't being used differ from the ones that are already being driven by SWR drivers?

 

[DelW]

Tomorrow (9th January) marks one year since the much hyped "entry into passenger service" celebrations at Waterloo (post 7351 et seq, p246 of this thread). So six units in a year (if I've kept up?), and only 84 to go ....

 

[Azuma800]

All six diagrams running, but RTT is being mysterious about what is running one of the Shepperton diagrams. (2H15 at the time of typing)

EDIT - just seen it - it is 701036, so we have another full house

What are all of the 701 numbers for the six diagrams?

 

[swtrains]

Today's testing (701042) goes to Reading:

5T91 - Clapham Yard - Waterloo - normal.
5T92 - Waterloo - Reading
5T93 - Reading - Waterloo
5T94 - Waterloo - Clapham Yard - normal.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17195/2025-01-08/detailed#allox_id=0

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17192/2025-01-08/detailed#allox_id=0

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17189/2025-01-08/detailed#allox_id=0

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17187/2025-01-08/detailed#allox_id=0

 

[Peter Sarf]

Tomorrow (9th January) marks one year since the much hyped "entry into passenger service" celebrations at Waterloo (post 7351 et seq, p246 of this thread). So six units in a year (if I've kept up?), and only 84 to go ....

You mean only 14 more years to go ?.

TBF last I checked there were ten available so only eight more years to go.

Rollout is bound to speed up but from such a slow and low start.......

 

[Goldfish62]

Today's testing (701042) goes to Reading:

5T91 - Clapham Yard - Waterloo - normal.
5T92 - Waterloo - Reading
5T93 - Reading - Waterloo
5T94 - Waterloo - Clapham Yard - normal.

First time on the Reading line for absolutely ages.

 

[JCO1406]

Any ideas when we could see more diagrams added?

 

[Andy1673]

Any ideas when we could see more diagrams added?

If nothing changed two more will be in February

 

[norbitonflyer]

What are all of the 701 numbers for the six diagrams?

701017/ 031/ 036/ 037/ 039/ 043

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Jan 2025 ==

So six units in a year (if I've kept up?), and only 84 to go ....

Seven - but 701028 hasn't been seen in passenger use since February, when it ran on three days only.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Jan 2025 ==


== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Jan 2025 ==


(EDIT - Thursday) First anniversary of the first run, and a Full House again this morning

 

[swtrains]

Today's testing (701042) goes to Farnham:

5T91 - Clapham Yard - Waterloo - normal.
5T92 - Waterloo - Aldershot - goes via Richmond.
5T93 - Aldershot - Farnham - goes to Farnham P2, then depot, reverses back to Farnham P1.
5T94 - Farnham - Waterloo - goes via Richmond.
5T95 - Waterloo - Clapham Yard - normal.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17194/2025-01-09/detailed#allox_id=0

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17191/2025-01-09/detailed#allox_id=0

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17188/2025-01-09/detailed#allox_id=0

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17186/2025-01-09/detailed#allox_id=0

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:Q17184/2025-01-09/detailed#allox_id=0

 

[74A]

So at the moment they are only running 6 units for 6 diagrams. So they need 100% availability. Surely more unit must come into service soon.

 

[Goldfish62]

So at the moment they are only running 6 units for 6 diagrams. So they need 100% availability. Surely more unit must come into service soon.

As highlighted a few posts back Alstom have made more units available to SWR for passenger use but ASLEF apparently disagree. Seems like the industrial relations problems surrounding these trains still haven't been resolved.

 

[norbitonflyer]

So at the moment they are only running 6 units for 6 diagrams. So they need 100% availability. Surely more unit must come into service soon.

Which is why we often only have five diagrams running. To date there have only been five days when all six have been out, although the commonest reason for cancellation is "problem with the crew" (presumably no-one available) rather than a fault with the unit itself.

 

[Lockwood]

So... What is special about those 6 that ASLEF like them, or don't dislike them enough, compared to the others?

 

[swr444]

As highlighted a few posts back Alstom have made more units available to SWR for passenger use but ASLEF apparently disagree. Seems like the industrial relations problems surrounding these trains still haven't been resolved.

I don’t think ASLEF have anything to do with it.

 

[Peter Sarf]

So at the moment they are only running 6 units for 6 diagrams. So they need 100% availability. Surely more unit must come into service soon.

Correction - there are seven that have been used although the use of 710028 was for only three days back in February almost a year ago.

 

[Mordac]

As highlighted a few posts back Alstom have made more units available to SWR for passenger use but ASLEF apparently disagree. Seems like the industrial relations problems surrounding these trains still haven't been resolved.

Alt text: A photo of the late Canadian comedian Norm MacDonald, with his famous quote superimposed "Now, this might strike some viewers as harsh, but I believe everyone involved in this story should die"

Not so harsh, but everyone involved with these trains' introduction looks at best ridiculous.