Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[LothianBusesPh]

Right so it definitely seems the 24 is the next BZL candidate. That’s 5 on it this morning.

That’s correct, the next “fully electrified” service is the 24, then it will be the 23.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Silly question but I was behind 1002 this morning and it has some sort of grill/vent on the back between decks, with the Lothian logo off to the side.

I haven't noticed this on any other B9s whether ex-London or native.

Is it a different spec?

Its an air conditioning vent, 1001/1002 never had the vents removed like the rest of the second hand stock did

 

[edinbusnerd]

716 appears to have gone on a trip from Central to what seems to be a bus/lorry repair place in Glasgow. https://bustimes.org/vehicles/loth-716#journeys/650134523

 

[Bus9120UK]

716 appears to have gone on a trip from Central to what seems to be a bus/lorry repair place in Glasgow. https://bustimes.org/vehicles/loth-716#journeys/650134523

716/7 are both there. I don't think they're at Ferrymill for a repair but what they are there for is unclear. 717 was only taken out Seafield yesterday.

Ferrymill Motors is where Lothian vehicles go most of the time for larger repairs and has been painting Lothian's vehicles for a long time.

 

[Resuwen]

I’m told the rest of the BZLs should be here within the next few months.

Realistically then, in order to fully withdraw everything upto and including the 11 plates, another order for at least 100 DDs is going to be needed in the next year or so - will be interesting to see what this involves.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I’m told the rest of the BZLs should be here within the next few months.

Realistically then, in order to fully withdraw everything upto and including the 11 plates, another order for at least 100 DDs is going to be needed in the next year or so - will be interesting to see what this involves.

I don’t think the 11 plates will be going anywhere anytime soon. Certainly I agree everything prior to them probably hasn’t got long left though. Priority needs to be that alongside new Airlink’s and some new single decks in my opinion.

 

[ScotRail158725]

I don’t think the 11 plates will be going anywhere anytime soon. Certainly I agree everything prior to them probably hasn’t got long left though. Priority needs to be that alongside new Airlink’s and some new single decks in my opinion.

Pretty sure its been said already only the stuff pre 11 plates will be leaving

With 841-850 at 17 years old now are they the longest vehicles Lothian have had in service? I cant think of any older batches that lasted more than 15 years let alone 17

 

[Lothianbus703]

Pretty sure its been said already only the stuff pre 11 plates will be leaving

With 841-850 at 17 years old now are they the longest vehicles Lothian have had in service? I cant think of any older batches that lasted more than 15 years let alone 17

Coach seated Leyland Olympian's 366-371 were new in June 1989 on F regs and were withdrawn in May 2009 very close to their 20th year in service.
These were also Lothians last Leyland Buses ever purchased.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

Coach seated Leyland Olympian's 366-371 were new in June 1989 on F regs and were withdrawn in May 2009 very close to their 20th year in service.
These were also Lothians last Leyland Buses ever purchased.

841-850 won’t last much longer.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Nov 2024 ==

The BZLs are taking their time which is helping their prolonged lifespan.

 

[stevenedin]

841-850 won’t last much longer.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Nov 2024 ==

The BZLs are taking their time which is helping their prolonged lifespan.

They will probably be used as school buses once they are withdrawn and sold as they are still in good condition inside.

 

[GusB]

Pretty sure its been said already only the stuff pre 11 plates will be leaving

With 841-850 at 17 years old now are they the longest vehicles Lothian have had in service? I cant think of any older batches that lasted more than 15 years let alone 17

There were a few mid-70s Atlanteans around when I began to spend time in Edinburgh in the early 90s. The oldest ones I can recall had MSF-P registrations, so they would have been getting on for 17 years old at the time.

An old vehicle isn't necessarily a bad vehicle if it's looked after properly, but we have had a series of legislative changes (emissions and disability) that has shortened the lives of vehicles that would have normally been kept on longer.

When were the ECW-bodied Olympians withdrawn? Olympians were definitely still around when I moved to Edinburgh for a while in 2001, but the switch to low-floor was well underway at that point.

 

[Ghostbus]

It's weird how they don't look all that old. The Gemini 1 styling seems to have held up well, while in contrast, the last of the Presidents looked like old fashioned oddballs when their time to leave drew near. But they in turn looked modern when first introduced compared to an RH/ECW (if not necessarily a Royale).

Quite a bit of variety in the fleet now, common usage decker wise. Enviro400MMC/XLB, Gemini 2, Gemini 3 and now BZL. And quite bizarrely, very hard to tell from the styling alone which are the new modern buses and which are the old war horses next in line for the cull. Is that a good thing? I guess so. Might be a first, even?

 

[stevenedin]

There were a few mid-70s Atlanteans around when I began to spend time in Edinburgh in the early 90s. The oldest ones I can recall had MSF-P registrations, so they would have been getting on for 17 years old at the time.

An old vehicle isn't necessarily a bad vehicle if it's looked after properly, but we have had a series of legislative changes (emissions and disability) that has shortened the lives of vehicles that would have normally been kept on longer.

When were the ECW-bodied Olympians withdrawn? Olympians were definitely still around when I moved to Edinburgh for a while in 2001, but the switch to low-floor was well underway at that point.

The last of the ECW Olympians were withdrawn in 2002 from memory. I think that the 51 reg Dennis Tridents replaced them.

 

[ScotRail158725]

An old vehicle isn't necessarily a bad vehicle if it's looked after properly, but we have had a series of legislative changes (emissions and disability) that has shortened the lives of vehicles that would have normally been kept on longer.

841-850 a prime example, all still in good working order with decent interiors from their mid life refurbs, they don’t feel 17 at all

 

[stevenedin]

841-850 a prime example, all still in good working order with decent interiors from their mid life refurbs, they don’t feel 17 at all

I agree. The only place you can tell is by listening to the engine as they sound a bit tired but then again all of the B9TLs sound a bit work out now.

 

[Resuwen]

I think the older front headlight design makes them look much older than anything else in the fleet

 

[Graeme Duncan]

If my memory serves me well several Atlanteans of 1975 the JSG N Registration were still in service into the beginning of 1994.

 

[computerSaysNo]

According to lvf.io, bus 445 is currently operating a 73 in West Lothian; this would seem to be the first of the 2016 batch to be in service there(?).
I'll link the source webpage here but it's updated live so the results others see might not match those that I've seen.

An old vehicle isn't necessarily a bad vehicle if it's looked after properly, but we have had a series of legislative changes (emissions and disability) that has shortened the lives of vehicles that would have normally been kept on longer.

Do the emission modifications on older vehicles have any effect on vehicle performance (assuming they're not on "limp mode" - I don't think I've ever been on a Lothian vehicle with such poor performance that I've thought it was on limp mode)?

841-850 a prime example, all still in good working order with decent interiors from their mid life refurbs, they don’t feel 17 at all

I agree and even the 2011 vehicles are excellent inside, and the one I was on recently sounded really smooth and healthy too.

I think the older front headlight design makes them look much older than anything else in the fleet

I agree, I think the design with the large round headlights looks significantly more aged than the Gemini 2 (or onwards) design with the tiny lights.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

According to lvf.io, bus 445 is currently operating a 73 in West Lothian; this would seem to be the first of the 2016 batch to be in service there(?).
I'll link the source webpage here but it's updated live so the results others see might not match those that I've seen.

It is indeed out, albeit on a 72.

 

[DunsBus]

The last of the ECW Olympians were withdrawn in 2002 from memory. I think that the 51 reg Dennis Tridents replaced them.

The last of the ECW Olympians were withdrawn in April 2004. They were replaced by the final batch of Transbus Tridents on 04-plates.

 

[stevenedin]

The last of the ECW Olympians were withdrawn in April 2004. They were replaced by the final batch of Transbus Tridents on 04-plates.

I never realised that they lasted so long, thanks.

 

[computerSaysNo]

It is indeed out, albeit on a 72.

Oops, typo! Thanks for the correction.

 

[Resuwen]

So for withdrawal are we looking at 841-50, 929-31/3-6 from country, 905/6, 926-8 from Lothian and 937-50 at East Coast?

That’s a total of 37 buses.

 

[Bus9120UK]

So for withdrawal are we looking at 841-50, 929-31/3-6 from country, 905/6, 926-8 from Lothian and 937-50 at East Coast?

That’s a total of 37 buses.

From what I've heard 926-936 are to stay for a while longer.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

So for withdrawal are we looking at 841-50, 929-31/3-6 from country, 905/6, 926-8 from Lothian and 937-50 at East Coast?

That’s a total of 37 buses.

I believe it’s just the 12 remaining Gemini’s, 841-850 and 905-906.

The increase in overall fleet should result in service improvements in the New Year.

 

[Resuwen]

So there will be 09 and 10 plates staying, while other 09s and 59s have been sold off some time ago?

 

[stevenedin]

So there will be 09 and 10 plates staying, while other 09s and 59s have been sold off some time ago?

That’s correct. The others were sold off a while ago as there wasn’t a need for as many buses at that time.

 

[Lx008]

Im a little surprised that 905/906 are leaving, they seem to be perfect for the Uni Shuttle Bus, low utilization so can use an older bus that may need a little more downtime with a captive market that doesn’t really care about how modern the bus is, no need for screens or anything since only 2 stops.
Is the difference in parts between a Gemini and Gemini 2 big enough to warrant not keeping them?

 

[CN04NRJ]

That’s correct. The others were sold off a while ago as there wasn’t a need for as many buses at that time.

Probably one of the most short sighted decisions of recent years!

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Probably one of the most short sighted decisions of recent years!

Completely agree. No idea why 301-350 were sold.

Similarly I’d say taking 171, 173-175 off normal service, all being turned into trainers and 173 sold, was short sighted too. 161-166 should’ve been the training fleet for me. That possibly could’ve even allowed 167-170 to stay in service as well.