The UK and white elephant stations

[Farigiraf]

There have been a few new station opening success stories in recent years - Leven, Woolwich, Okehampton, Tweedbank etc.
But for the few that do well, there seems to be an increasing amount of white elephant (not much use, yet high maintenance) stations being built.

See:
Bow Street - opened 2021, around 30k entries/exits in the last few years. Least used in Ceredigion but only competes with Aberystwyth and Borth. Fairly well used and theoretically great for P&R. Only problem - Just one train every 2 hours!
Reston - opened 2022, in a sparsely populated area, with high construction costs. A few TPE trains a day, and also served by the singular LNER service that doesn't go to London. Large car park that's rarely full.
Soham - similar situation to Bow Street. opened 2021, 2 hourly service, with no improvement until an Ely North Junction upgrade.

Other examples include Worcestershire Parkway (still none of the promised Edinburgh/Plymouth services), Thanet Parkway (lack of connection to the town it actually serves, Cliffsend) and Marsh Barton (not served by every Paignton stopper).

Why does this keep happening? I wouldn't call it a waste of money, as a half-done station is better than no station, but a little more rationality should be put into some of these proposals, and once they're completed, the promised service and ridership to be achieved. All while 'easy win' stations which are guaranteed to attract many passengers e.g. Elland, Leeds Bradford Airport station and Surrey Canal/New Bermondsey are consistently being put aside, versus another Just Barely Not The Middle Of Nowhere Parkway.

 

[John Luxton]

See:
Bow Street - opened 2021, around 30k entries/exits in the last few years. Least used in Ceredigion but only competes with Aberystwyth and Borth. Great for P&R. Only problem - Just one train every 2 hours!

I would not say that Bow Street is a white elephant. Been through to Aber a few times 2022 - 2024 and there are always people getting on and off. Would say from my trips through it is well used. Trains are now almost hourly in each direction. What does amuse me is the house which is some distance from the platform which has "Welcome to Hell" painted on the wall. Apparently the person who lives wasn't happy about the reopening! Not sure why as the house is away from the railway. Perhaps he doesn't like all the cars using the P&R which seems well filled.

Seems a like a railway problem neigbour! https://www.countytimes.co.uk/news/19126902.bow-street-station-neighbour-paints-welcome-hell-wall/

 

[Bletchleyite]

Reston was built for entirely political reasons, and aside from putting up an ecotown there is pointless.

Bow St - well, 2 hourly (hourly at times) is decent round there, I don't see the problem with it? I suspect you're applying South East standards to frequencies when hourly or less is the norm for regional services elsewhere?

 

[Tetchytyke]

I've only used it once, but when I did on a Saturday in January this year Worcestershire Parkway was very busy. Both for passengers waiting for the Birmingham train (which I alighted) and the London train (which I boarded).

Reston itself is small but serves as a railhead for quite a wide area, including places like Eyemouth and Duns. The service is mostly for the Edinburgh direction.

Connecting Leeds Bradford Airport to the railway network may be a win, but it certainly won't be easy.

Reston was built for entirely political reasons, and aside from putting up an ecotown there is pointless.

I doubt people from the borders region, places like Duns and Eyemouth, agree.

 

[takno]

Other examples include Worcestershire Parkway (still none of the promised Edinburgh/Plymouth services)

Nobody ever promised Edinburgh/Plymouth services apart from a couple of delusional councillors. It seems to be a moderately successful parkway station for people in Worcestershire to commute into Worcester, Birmingham and London, and has a good service to all of those and a range of other destinations.

 

[paulmch]

Worcestershire Parkway has been a great success by all accounts, especially considering that they're making do with an (allegedly) hourly service to Birmingham. If the proposed development of the new town at the site goes ahead then things will look even brighter for it.

 

[jfowkes]

East Midlands Parkway is another one.

The assumption that a lot of people will drive to a parkway station and the get the train doesn't seem to be one that holds up - in practise a lot more people will just drive all the way. You're already in the car anyway.

In the particular case of East Midlands Parkway, you're paying £8 for the parking, plus whatever the train fare is. That's comparable to daily car parking in a lot of places. Not exactly an attractive alternative.

 

[Farigiraf]

I would not say that Bow Street is a white elephant. Been through to Aber a few times 2022 - 2024 and there are always people getting on and off. Would say from my trips through it is well used. Trains are now almost hourly in each direction. What does amuse me is the house which is some distance from the platform which has "Welcome to Hell" painted on the wall. Apparently the person who lives wasn't happy about the reopening! Not sure why as the house is away from the railway. Perhaps he doesn't like all the cars using the P&R which seems well filled.

Seems a like a railway problem neigbour! https://www.countytimes.co.uk/news/19126902.bow-street-station-neighbour-paints-welcome-hell-wall/

Bow St - well, 2 hourly (hourly at times) is decent round there, I don't see the problem with it? I suspect you're applying South East standards to frequencies when hourly or less is the norm for regional services elsewhere?

It's perfectly functional as a parkway, and if you know when the train is going to depart, it's useful. But many P&R users, as at other UK park & rides, will simply turn up, and wait for the next bus or train to arrive. Which works excellently where there is a reliable and frequent service, but seeing that the next service into town is in an hour or more is off-putting. An hourly service will be a good change, as at that point the station can do its job reasonably (for example Aylesbury Vale Parkway) but still removes the turn up & go aspect that should be a given for Park & Rides. While hourly may unfortunately be 'South East standards' for now (although most regional services are hourly at worst even in the North), it is, and should be where it isn't, the standard in the rest of Western Europe.

 

[Bletchleyite]

East Midlands Parkway is another one.

The assumption that a lot of people will drive to a parkway station and the get the train doesn't seem to be one that holds up - in practise a lot more people will just drive all the way. You're already in the car anyway.

In the particular case of East Midlands Parkway, you're paying £8 for the parking, plus whatever the train fare is. That's comparable to daily car parking in a lot of places. Not exactly an attractive alternative.

East Midlands Parkway may have succeeded had easyJet not withdrawn from the airport, sending it firmly into the "backwater" territory.

 

[The exile]

While potential usage is of course a major determining factor- there are others. A new station that will see 100K pax a year is more likely to get built than one that will see 1 million if the 100K one can be served with no significant time penalty by an existing service whereas the million one would require additional trains / a new spur etc. Equally, “social need” may trump figures - a London station may have the potential to reach over a million passengers by saving them a 10 minute walk, but may cost as much as 4 or 5 rural stations which save their passengers a 20 minute drive.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's perfectly functional as a parkway, and if you know when the train is going to depart, it's useful. But many P&R users, as at other UK park & rides, will simply turn up, and wait for the next bus or train to arrive. Which works excellently where there is a reliable and frequent service, but seeing that the next service into town is in an hour or more is off-putting.

I think you're misunderstanding the purpose. Hardly anyone would use it as a P&R for Aberystwyth, as driving in is fine and parking isn't expensive (though it may have a level of that use during the school summer holidays when it gets busy there, and the locals may use it for that on foot). The P&R role will be for going to Shrewsbury or Birmingham without the need to drive into Aberystwyth to park at the station. And people making long distance journeys certainly will look at a timetable and possibly even book an Advance.

This is not, once again, the South East of England, and the standards from that area cannot be applied to it.

 

[The exile]

It's perfectly functional as a parkway, and if you know when the train is going to depart, it's useful. But many P&R users, as at other UK park & rides, will simply turn up, and wait for the next bus or train to arrive. Which works excellently where there is a reliable and frequent service, but seeing that the next service into town is in an hour or more is off-putting. An hourly service will be a good change, as at that point the station can do its job reasonably (for example Aylesbury Vale Parkway) but still removes the turn up & go aspect that should be a given for Park & Rides. While hourly may unfortunately be 'South East standards' for now (although most regional services are hourly at worst even in the North), it is, and should be where it isn't, the standard in the rest of Western Europe.

Was the intention of Bow Street primarily to act as a P&R for people travelling into Aberystwyth or for people travelling East / North who would have otherwise have had to drive into Aberystwyth?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Having seen matters grind to an embarrassing halt with still no promised new station opening, there are some who now describe White Rose station as "a white elephant", including some existing users of Cottingley station which is scheduled to be axed.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

In the particular case of East Midlands Parkway, you're paying £8 for the parking, plus whatever the train fare is. That's comparable to daily car parking in a lot of places. Not exactly an attractive alternative.

Is the £8.00 daily car park charge possibly the highest across the GB rail network for a station which is set up to be operating as a "parkway" or "park and ride" station? One of the nearest such stations to me is possibly Horwich Parkway where, I believe, car parking is still free to passengers with a valid rail ticket. Similar position, I think, at Liverpool South Parkway and Hazel Grove.

 

[Farigiraf]

Was the intention of Bow Street primarily to act as a P&R for people travelling into Aberystwyth or for people travelling East / North who would have otherwise have had to drive into Aberystwyth?

TFW's public view at least was for both to relieve parking issues in Aberystwyth and to act as a 'Transport Hub' for the area, although the former was the one adopted more by other media outlets (and therefore became my impression). The sparser service of course does push it more into the long-distance 'Transport Hub' (a halt and a large car park apparently qualifies for this) territory.
The hourly service will start in 2026 and be summer only, from what I can see.

 

[jfowkes]

East Midlands Parkway may have succeeded had easyJet not withdrawn from the airport, sending it firmly into the "backwater" territory.

As I understand it, it was never particularly easy to access the airport from station anyway - either an expensive taxi or a shuttlebus, both of which have to fight traffic over the M1 junction. And the airport is very well served by cheap, regular buses from Derby, Nottingham and Leicester so the rail demand must be pretty limited.

 

[thealexweb]

Reston isn’t credibly served. You’ve got two and four gaps in the timetable. Before construction there was talk of the Scotrail stopper to Berwick and Liverpool-Edinburgh being hourly. What happened?

 

[NSEWonderer]

Woolwich is very quickly becoming a victim of its own unexpected success. Its three escalators and one entrance are mostly choked with passengers, which will only get worse with the completion of more housing and leisure developments around it and nearby feeder communities.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

Ivybridge in South Devon was another (opened 1994), although today it has more respectable passenger numbers. It was billed as a P & R for Plymouth with a large car park, but the service wasn't (isn't) frequent enough to attract many punters. It is also in the wrong location to the east of the town.

Devon CC got badly burnt by this, putting on bus services to places like Bigbury from the station, which didn't last very long. I think it put them off investing in rail for quite a few years - happily not the case today. Today I think the station is used more for travelling 'up-country', especially amongst students.

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

I've had to use East Midlands Parkway a few times in the last year or so - I've actually found the car park to be pretty busy. Not full, but have had to park much further away from the station than I'd anticipated and walk across the big car park.

I did wonder whether people are using it to park their car for the airport and getting a taxi, as it is presumably working out cheaper than paying airport parking prices.

The station itself was pretty quiet.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Ivybridge in South Devon was another (opened 1994), although today it has more respectable passenger numbers. It was billed as a P & R for Plymouth with a large car park, but the service wasn't (isn't) frequent enough to attract many punters. It is also in the wrong location to the east of the town.

Not a very useful P&R, but potentially useful for access on foot to Dartmoor. That's now available from the north at Okehampton, but wasn't previously available at all.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Having seen matters grind to an embarrassing halt with still no promised new station opening, there are some who now describe White Rose station as "a white elephant", including some existing users of Cottingley station which is scheduled to be axed.

When I've used the term "White Elephant" in relation to White Rose, it's usually referring to the shopping centre itself rather than the station. Mostly in relation to the idea that it draws business away from Leeds city centre which is itself a major retail destination. The pun being a bit of an "open goal" helps too!

The WRC itself has improved in recent years with the expanded leisure area which includes numerous restaurants and a cinema. However it still is and will always be a predominantly car-centric location.

 

[Stompehh]

Soham - similar situation to Bow Street. opened 2021, 2 hourly service, with no improvement until an Ely North Junction upgrade.

Despite only having a 2 hourly service, Soham is well used when I go there and appreciated by the community.
Yes, it needs a more frequent service, but that will come with time. The station will be there for many many years, it doesn't matter if the service upgrades are a few years out of sync with construction.

 

[yoyothehobo]

I disagree with Reston. It has been very handy for me the three times i have got a train to visit my friends who live in Reston.

Its handy to have a private station

 

[brad465]

Ebbsfleet International initially wasn't a white elephant, but now that Eurostar have stopped calling their indefinitely a large part of the station is not getting any use. Southeastern High Speed services still seem to be faring okay though, particularly with housing developments in the valley and recently available quarry nearby, as well as being a popular hub to drive to for a train into London.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

Other examples include Worcestershire Parkway (still none of the promised Edinburgh/Plymouth services), Thanet Parkway (lack of connection to the town it actually serves, Cliffsend) and Marsh Barton (not served by every Paignton stopper).

Why does this keep happening? I wouldn't call it a waste of money, as a half-done station is better than no station, but a little more rationality should be put into some of these proposals

Where do you think the good burghers of mid-Worcestershire want to travel most often: Birmingham and London, or Plymouth and Edinburgh?!

Worcestershire Parkway has 335,000 passengers a year, making it significantly busier than any of the other stations on the Cotswold Line between Oxford and Worcester. It has been an undoubted success. I don't think the station promoters are the people suffering from a lack of "rationality" right here.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

When I've used the term "White Elephant" in relation to White Rose, it's usually referring to the shopping centre itself rather than the station.

Why have the works on White Rose new railway station come to a halt and what is the latest official information?

 

[Farigiraf]

Where do you think the good burghers of mid-Worcestershire want to travel most often: Birmingham and London, or Plymouth and Edinburgh?!

Worcestershire Parkway has 0.335m passengers a year, making it significantly busier than any of the other stations on the Cotswold Line between Oxford and Worcester. It has been an undoubted success. I don't think the station promoters are the people suffering from a lack of "rationality" right here.

It was just another example where a station was promised something (although apparently here it wasn't actually), then not delivered. Worcs. Parkway is definitely a useful interchange and parkway due to its catchment area by rail, and also serves some businesses nearby. It got very lucky with its location on both automobile and rail lines. If the station only consisted of the XC part however, people would be upset by the service.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Why have the works on White Rose new railway station come to a halt and what is the latest official information?

I've not been keeping fully abreast of the situation, but as I understand it the works were halted due to cost overruns.

The site is not particularly conducive to construction, being on a fairly high and steep-sided embankment, in an area littered with old mine workings- some of which date back to a time when record keeping of such practices was not great.

 

[The exile]

If the station only consisted of the XC part however, people would be upset by the service.

Not sure why it would make any difference to those not interchanging. Those going north/south would have exactly the same service as they currently do and the Cotswold Line passengers wouldn’t be there. Or do you just mean that the Cotswold Libe passengers are currently much more satisfied than Han those travelling north/south