Which year will the UK go cashless?

[Magdalia]

It's more expensive for small businesses to handle cash over card.

Looking at ongoing costs maybe, but for any business that is already started up the costs of change can be significant. That isn't just the time and money costs of switching. In particular there is the risk of losing existing customers and lots of businesses can't afford to take a chance on that.

New start ups are much more likely to go straight to card transactions.

From my experience of visiting London the cashless economy is also a cultural big City thing. Out here in the Fens things change more slowly!

Most small business (like barbers...) that don't accept cards because of that

No it isn't. They're concealing profits from the taxman

One of the things I've noticed in recent years is the significant growth in the number of barber's shops, out of all proportion to any possible change in the demand for haircuts. I'm suspicious about those that rarely seem to have any customers. Those that have lots of waiting customers will be operating legitimately.

 

[birchesgreen]

One of the things I've noticed in recent years is the significant growth in the number of barber's shops, out of all proportion to any possible change in the demand for haircuts. I'm suspicious about those that rarely seem to have any customers. Those that have lots of waiting customers will be operating legitimately.

Yes Turkish barbers seems to be the one growth industry we have right now, amazing how they survive with barely any customers.

 

[Halwynd]

Yes Turkish barbers seems to be the one growth industry we have right now, amazing how they survive with barely any customers.

Money laundering.

 

[Cross City]

Money laundering.

Some of it will be of course, but barbershops are possibly the cheapest businesses to set up hence them being attractive to people new to the country.

No stock, minimal if any staff, no licencing or inspections. It's literally just rent and utilities.

 

[KT550]

Looking at ongoing costs maybe, but for any business that is already started up the costs of change can be significant. That isn't just the time and money costs of switching. In particular there is the risk of losing existing customers and lots of businesses can't afford to take a chance on that.

New start ups are much more likely to go straight to card transactions.

From my experience of visiting London the cashless economy is also a cultural big City thing. Out here in the Fens things change more slowly!





One of the things I've noticed in recent years is the significant growth in the number of barber's shops, out of all proportion to any possible change in the demand for haircuts. I'm suspicious about those that rarely seem to have any customers. Those that have lots of waiting customers will be operating legitimately.

Customers waiting will probably be their mates just sitting around.

It's quite possible they will be banking more cash than they take in sales.

 

[LYradial]

It is, I think, inevitable that we will become a cashless society because we have a generation growing up who cannot understand
what these shiny little disks actually are.

might mean the end of street musicians though

 

[birchesgreen]

No stock, minimal if any staff, no licencing or inspections. It's literally just rent and utilities.

Both of which cost a bomb. Looking nearby in Erdington (not exactly an affluent area) even pretty small dingy premises are the best part of a grand a month rent, electricity alone will be a couple of hundred, then you will need to pay some wages.

Thats a lot of 10 quid haircuts (or whatever they cost these days).

 

[Cross City]

Both of which cost a bomb. Looking nearby in Erdington (not exactly an affluent area) even pretty small dingy premises are the best part of a grand a month rent, electricity alone will be a couple of hundred, then you will need to pay some wages.

Thats a lot of 10 quid haircuts (or whatever they cost these days).

Say £1200 a month in rent and utilities then. That's 120 £10 haircuts a month or roughly 4 per day (just under 6 per day if you're only open 5 days a week, which would be unusual for a barber).

That really isn't a lot, even a dodgy barber on a high street competing with multiple other barbers will get that in passing trade alone.

 

[birchesgreen]

Say £1200 a month in rent and utilities then. That's 120 £10 haircuts a month or roughly 4 per day (just under 6 per day if you're only open 5 days a week, which would be unusual for a barber).

That really isn't a lot, even a dodgy barber on a high street competing with multiple other barbers will get that in passing trade alone.

Some of the ones near me might manage 4 a week.

 

[Irascible]

I do see a future sooner rather than later where a traditional high street bank will be a thing of the past and the emerging 'Banking Hubs' idea will replace them full stop

My branch is in Finsbury Park - I haven't lived in London for a couple of decades now & don't remember the last time I went in any branch. I think the only time I ever went in my actual branch was to arrange a loan... I'm quite sure I can do that online now.

I have cash for transport round here. I've been paying everything I can by card well before mobile banking was a thing though, I'd imagine most of us have - cash is stubbornly not going away completely.

I've also had a debit card with attached account with what was the Midland since I was 14, I don't think you could get anything younger than that back then.

 

[simonw]

It is, I think, inevitable that we will become a cashless society because we have a generation growing up who cannot understand
what these shiny little disks actually are.

might mean the end of street musicians though

Plenty of street musicians round here and on the tube have contactless payment devices

 

[jon81uk]

One is services delivered in the home. For example tomorrow I will be paying my window cleaner in cash.

My window gets a bank transfer from me after he sends a text message to state its done. No card payment so no fees, I just open my online banking app and transfer it. Means he doesn't need to waste time making sure I'm in the house to ask for the cash either.

Cash is still cheapest for businesses that rely on large numbers of small transactions, barber's shops being a good example. That's why some small businesses have a minimum spend for card transactions.

The barbers for me is £20 and although it is cash only (I expect for tax reasons) that isn't a small transaction really. The corner shops who do have a minimum spend its usually £5.

 

[cb a1]

Really! I've not had one for a good few years now, way before covid. I don't think my wife paid that much though, maybe because we are in Scotland.

They were wanting over £500 for a crown, no chance I'm paying that.

My understanding is max fee for NHS dental treatment in Scotland is £384.
I had a tricky extraction last month. Cost £28.84. Going private that would have been about £150.

 

[azt]

My understanding is max fee for NHS dental treatment in Scotland is £384.
I had a tricky extraction last month. Cost £28.84. Going private that would have been about £

I didn't know that, thanks, but they won't do it under the NHS, private only!

Shocking!

 

[Thirteen]

QR code payments like they have in China and India is something I'd like to see in the UK and indeed elsewhere.

 

[jon81uk]

QR code payments like they have in China and India is something I'd like to see in the UK and indeed elsewhere.

I've paid a trader who had a QR code from his Monzo bank account which then just pre-filled in the bank transfer details. I guess there is nothing stopping other providers setting this up too.

I think contactless and Apple Pay has taken over in the UK really so I doubt we will get QR codes for vending machines etc. Where it could work is Big Issue sellers and similar, although my local one has a PayPal Zettle contactless reader.

 

[Thirteen]

I've paid a trader who had a QR code from his Monzo bank account which then just pre-filled in the bank transfer details. I guess there is nothing stopping other providers setting this up too.

I think contactless and Apple Pay has taken over in the UK really so I doubt we will get QR codes for vending machines etc. Where it could work is Big Issue sellers and similar, although my local one has a PayPal Zettle contactless reader.

I don't think QR payment will ever be as mainstream compared to other countries but it'd be a good addition alongside Sumup and Square terminals.

 

[Hadders]

Various sectors of the economy are still heavily reliant on cash.

One is services delivered in the home. For example tomorrow I will be paying my window cleaner in cash.

I shop at markets where lots of stallholders are still cash only. This particularly applies to markets that only operate occasionally.

I use cash for small transactions with small businesses out of consideration to them, because it saves them from paying fees to card companies.

Cash is still cheapest for businesses that rely on large numbers of small transactions, barber's shops being a good example. That's why some small businesses have a minimum spend for card transactions.

I get my cash by withdrawing it in person at my local building society branch, which helps to keep it going.

I mostly avoid businesses that do not take cash. The place where I find that most difficult is getting a cup of tea in Kings Cross/St Pancras when I don't have time to go off the station. At Liverpool Street I still have the Polo Bar in Bishopsgate.

I suspect this your perception rather than reality.

Pre-pandemic I needed a small plumbing job doing at home. Typical job that historically you just paid in cash. I withdrew sufficient money from the bank, plumber came round fixed the job and I went to get my recently withdrawn cash and he just said ‘I’d rather not have cash’ and whipped a card machine out of his pocket!

I ended up laying the cash back into the bank.

 

[Ediswan]

Cash is still cheapest for businesses that rely on large numbers of small transactions, barber's shops being a good example.

In my barbers, the cutters are all indepedent. They pay the owner a rental for the use of the chair. Each looks after their own takings. They would each need their own card payment device. Each cutter would have relatively few transactions per day They do not all work every day.

 

[Woolos 22]

It will never happen. As we can never 100% electricity supply .

 

[jon81uk]

In my barbers, the cutters are all indepedent. They pay the owner a rental for the use of the chair. Each looks after their own takings. They would each need their own card payment device. Each cutter would have relatively few transactions per day They do not all work every day.

I went to a barbers/hairdressers like that in London with lots of signage stating they are independent contractors, but the store still took the payment both card and cash. I assume its like Uber, the cashier at the store is just a payment processor.

 

[Howardh]

My understanding is max fee for NHS dental treatment in Scotland is £384.
I had a tricky extraction last month. Cost £28.84. Going private that would have been about £150.

If dental work is required, and assuming an NHS dentist is available, unless your situation is that you get it for free, then it's always worth checking around as sometimes private can be cheaper. Sometimes private dentists insist on an initial check-up and x-ray even though we know what the problem is, so that has to be negotiated. After all, they want your business money so may well drop the unrequired elements.

Also, if the work required is so severe, such as a complicated extraction, as happened to me a while ago after a severe abscess, the NHS should treat you in a hospital for free. I went first to the doctor who immediately referred me to a dental hospital (Blackburn as it turned out) and there was no charge.

The irony is that at the time I had regular 6-monthly check-ups with an NHS dentist, not that I had gone years without seeing one and letting my teeth rot away!!

 

[TAS]

In my barbers, the cutters are all indepedent. They pay the owner a rental for the use of the chair. Each looks after their own takings. They would each need their own card payment device. Each cutter would have relatively few transactions per day They do not all work every day.

Mine has a set up like that. Each has their own card machine (from various different providers) on the counter.

 

[GardenRail]

Went in a cafe the other day, it was card only. Not really a problem, but how ironic that they had a tips jar on the counter..... No tip from me, they were card only. Idiots. You see, I would have paid by cash, I had a fiver, and my order was £4.25. I would have told them to put the cash change, in the jar.

 

[Ladder23]

The only time I use cash is for a certain food restaurant I use 2/3 times a week, and the amount of times I get half way there and forget to even check I have cash! (Resorting in taking a detour for a cash point machine - which is now also hard to find for free)!

 

[jon0844]

I went into a shop to buy a can of coke and bar of chocolate, they said I couldn't use my card as it was under a fiver, so I went to put the items back and suddenly it was OK to use my card!!

Pretty sure that their merchant account terms don't allow them to impose a minimum limit, but many shops do (some £2, some £5). I've walked out of shops, including a fish and chip shop that wouldn't let me pay card for a portion of chips (and I didn't have my wallet or any change). But, like you, some will make an exception.

My local kebab van is the funniest. Can take cards but doesn't advertise the fact, and they always say 'cash' when someone asks if they take card. However, if someone says they don't have cash then the get the card reader but give the customer evils.

They recognise me enough to know I'm going to pay by card, but I don't go there often now as I don't need the judgement!

Cash will remain for a while though. While I won't accuse all Turkish barbers of being involved in crime, there are plenty of Albanian run ones that are cash only for money laundering purposes. I doubt the drug trade is ready for card only yet.

 

[GardenRail]

I went into a shop to buy a can of coke and bar of chocolate, they said I couldn't use my card as it was under a fiver, so I went to put the items back and suddenly it was OK to use my card!!

I never understand the minimum transaction thing.... Don't they just get charged a percentage per transaction? So that proportionately its the same whether £100 or £1?

 

[JamesT]

I never understand the minimum transaction thing.... Don't they just get charged a percentage per transaction? So that proportionately its the same whether £100 or £1?

I believe for some card processors, the fees are structured with a fixed per-transaction fee plus the percentage. So for small transactions that might wipe out their profit margin.

 

[Howardh]

I believe for some card processors, the fees are structured with a fixed per-transaction fee plus the percentage. So for small transactions that might wipe out their profit margin.

If that's the case, as long as the shopper knew I suppose they could add-on a card charge of a few pence? No idea if any shops do that, perhaps they think it would scare them away for the sake of twenty p?

 

[JamesT]

If that's the case, as long as the shopper knew I suppose they could add-on a card charge of a few pence? No idea if any shops do that, perhaps they think it would scare them away for the sake of twenty p?

Charging extra for paying by card has been illegal since 2018.