Nottingham Express Transit - Reliability & Renewals (2023-2024)

[Jozhua]

The app is better if you have a suitible phone especially as it does push notifications.

Yes app was quite good with service updates this morning.

I also asked them to include cancelled trams at one point and they introduced that a week or two later.

 

[duffield]

Yes app was quite good with service updates this morning.

I also asked them to include cancelled trams at one point and they introduced that a week or two later.

So I guess they don't bother improving their wretched website. Maybe they should put a big banner at the top saying "Don't use this website, it's useless, use the app instead!".

Maybe I'm weird but when I'm *at home* planning a trip, I like to use a proper laptop screen rather than a poky mobile screen.

 

[tram21]

Track Renewals: David Lane

18th & 19th May 2024

https://www.thetram.net/planned-maintenance

 

[Jozhua]

Track Renewals: David Lane

18th & 19th May 2024

https://www.thetram.net/planned-maintenance

Fair enough, the track does look a bit worn round there!

Looks like a tram broke down at Hyson Green today

 

[tram21]

Looks like a tram broke down at Hyson Green today

After a few weeks of excellent service reliability, everything has gown pear-shaped this week with 6 separate tram faults & an overhead line fault in the space of 6 days. A tram broke down on every day of the week!

Fair enough, the track does look a bit worn round there!

As does the High School southbound track, which now has a 5kph (so slow!) TSR in place. I was told this is in place until its retracking in September- hopefully they meant late August as I don't think coinciding it with the return of all three schools there would be popular (along with many others on the route that would be affected!)

 

[Jozhua]

After a few weeks of excellent service reliability, everything has gown pear-shaped this week with 6 separate tram faults & an overhead line fault in the space of 6 days. A tram broke down on every day of the week!


As does the High School southbound track, which now has a 5kph (so slow!) TSR in place. I was told this is in place until its retracking in September- hopefully they meant late August as I don't think coinciding it with the return of all three schools there would be popular (along with many others on the route that would be affected!)

And now it looks as though another tram has broken down today!


Image taken from Nottingham Post Article:
Nottingham tram breaks down in city centre causing heavy delays for commuters

Surprising how poor the reliability is on both the older and newer tram units. I have a feeling that they aren't getting enough TLC, or there are issues with the shared computer/signalling systems installed on both types of tram.

 

[MCR247]

I was on the tram heading to Beeston on Saturday and there was an Incentro parked up in the ‘loop’ at Beeston Centre. I assume that had failed at some point too?

 

[Jozhua]

I was on the tram heading to Beeston on Saturday and there was an Incentro parked up in the ‘loop’ at Beeston Centre. I assume that had failed at some point too?

Given the number of failures in the past week, likely the case yes!

 

[tram21]

Maintenance work to take place between 1st and 15th July at High School and Royal Centre.

Will be quite disruptive given its still term time!

Nottingham Express Transit (NET) will be carrying out necessary tram track improvements this July, with tram users urged to check affected routes before travelling and consider alternative routes.

There will be no trams running between The Forest and Old Market Square between Tuesday 2 July and Sunday 14 July, with High School, Nottingham Trent University and Royal Centre stops all closed, as the essential maintenance takes place. Maintenance work will be specifically carried out at the High School and Royal Centre tram stops. Regular service will continue over the rest of the extensive NET tram network.

To minimise disruption, a replacement bus service will run from Tuesday 2 July every ten minutes between The Forest Park & Ride tram stop and Market Street, which is located next to the Old Market Square tram stop. Normal tram service is set to return to all stops on Monday 15 July.

Trevor Stocker, NET head of operations, said: “We’re committed to ensuring the optimal safety and reliability for our tram users, and these track works are an essential part of that. Some of our tram tracks have been operating since 2004, so with natural wear and tear, this type of maintenance work allows us to keep everything running smoothly – especially on such a key and highly-used part of our tram network.

“Like with any of our improvement works, we put steps in place to keep disruption levels to a minimum. The track works starting on Tuesday 2nd July will be ongoing 24/7, so noise prevention measures will be implemented. However, people may experience some noise while the works are taking place, just for a short period of time.

“We ask that all affected tram users plan ahead, allow additional time for their journeys and become familiar with our replacement bus service. Normal service is set to resume Monday 15 July as we head into the working week.”

Overnight preparation works will commence at the High School tram stop between Sunday 23 June and Monday 1 July, and at the Royal Centre tram stop between 16 June and Monday 1 July. During this time, noise prevention measures will be in place to support reducing the noise created by the works.

For further information about services affected by the upcoming track works, together with details of alternative travel arrangements such as the tram replacement bus service, visit, https://www.thetram.net/planned-maintenance.

 

[MCR247]

Wow that’s a very long block that will impact a lot of passengers, given NET usually only run an every 10 minutes service to Clifton and Toton when there is a block north of the city centre

 

[Jozhua]

I don't know wether it's because they can't get the staff in, but I do wonder why they haven't been replacing larger sections of track and rather doing everything piecemeal and having the busiest section of the network shut down for longer?

 

[MCR247]

I don't know wether it's because they can't get the staff in, but I do wonder why they haven't been replacing larger sections of track and rather doing everything piecemeal and having the busiest section of the network shut down for longer?

It does seem odd. Perhaps cash flow isn’t helping? Is it me or is this closure quite ‘last minute’ for one so significant?

 

[tram21]

It does seem odd. Perhaps cash flow isn’t helping? Is it me or is this closure quite ‘last minute’ for one so significant?

It certainly is last-minute! The only explanation, and I may find out more soon, is that they previously referenced a September closure to get rid of the TSR at High School, so that was the plan, but the contractors found space in July so they opted for the earlier dates (as you would) bringing the plans forwards.

It's odd how everything was announced and released together, its unusual for them to be so organised! On Monday everything was released on the website, signs went up at affected stops and word spread very quickly!

 

[Jozhua]

Tram failure between Highbury Vale and Hucknall this morning.

A couple of trams were also withdrawn from service, presumably due to technical issues, but maybe also staffing?

It does seem odd. Perhaps cash flow isn’t helping? Is it me or is this closure quite ‘last minute’ for one so significant?

Yeah, I suspect that's the case. That and perhaps a lack of available contractors.

 

[Tram203]

During a visit to Nottingham last week I observed 32 of the 37 trams in service; 14 of the 15 older Incentro trams and 18 out of the 22 newer Citadis trams.

Given these observations, are the older Incentros known for being more reliable or was it most likely just luck of the draw?

 

[liamf656]

During a visit to Nottingham last week I observed 32 of the 37 trams in service; 14 of the 15 older Incentro trams and 18 out of the 22 newer Citadis trams.

Given these observations, are the older Incentros known for being more reliable or was it most likely just luck of the draw?

Possibly just luck on that day. Whenever there's a block on and part of the network is cut off from the depot NET will concentrate the Citadis trams to that section as they believe they'll be less likely to break down and become stranded.

 

[tram21]

During a visit to Nottingham last week I observed 32 of the 37 trams in service; 14 of the 15 older Incentro trams and 18 out of the 22 newer Citadis trams.

Given these observations, are the older Incentros known for being more reliable or was it most likely just luck of the draw?

That's certainly luck of the draw, the Citadis are regarded to be more reliable. The Citadis diagnose their own faults, so it easy to know how to fix faults, whereas the Incentros don't so they may need to go into the workshop to diagnose them.

Whenever there's a block on and part of the network is cut off from the depot NET will concentrate the Citadis trams to that section as they believe they'll be less likely to break down and become stranded.

They've learnt that leaving Incentros is a bad idea, so now they always use Citadis during planned blockades on the section which cannot access the depot

 

[joieman]

That's certainly luck of the draw, the Citadis are regarded to be more reliable. The Citadis diagnose their own faults, so it easy to know how to fix faults, whereas the Incentros don't so they may need to go into the workshop to diagnose them.

They've learnt that leaving Incentros is a bad idea, so now they always use Citadis during planned blockades on the section which cannot access the depot

Presumably that's simply because the Incentros are older and therefore both less technically advanced and less reliable. It's strange to think that the Incentros are twenty years old this year.

 

[tram21]

It's strange to think that the Incentros are twenty years old this year.

20 years in public service. More like 22/23 years old!

 

[duffield]

Presumably that's simply because the Incentros are older and therefore both less technically advanced and less reliable. It's strange to think that the Incentros are twenty years old this year.

I seem to remember the trams all have a small battery, used to power up and pan up (and perhaps to operate doors etc. in an emergency), maybe the batteries are lower capacity and a more primitive type, so not holding charge well on the older trams.

I'd think the depot would have a "jump start" facility for this, so you wouldn't want the old trams cut off from that facility, and that might be the specific reason for not isolating them from the depot.

Anyhow, just a guess.

 

[ChrisC]

Nottingham tram fares have increased again from today. Although the fare increases are mainly small, with just an increase of 10p on single and day ticket fares, these are on top of two other larger increases during the last 15 months. Since April last year single fares have gradually increased for £2.80 to £3.30 and day tickets from £4.80 to £5.40.

Unfair competition from the governments £2 bus fares have again been given as one of the reasons why fares have been increased. This may be the case, but won’t this further fare rise just increase the number of people switching from tram to bus. When and if the government subsidised bus fare scheme comes to end, it will be interesting to see how much higher single bus fares will be in comparison to when the scheme began. Most bus companies have increased their day tickets quite considerably over the last 18 months so I think bus passengers are in for quite a shock if the scheme does come to a complete end.

 

[duffield]

Nottingham tram fares have increased again from today. Although the fare increases are mainly small, with just an increase of 10p on single and day ticket fares, these are on top of two other larger increases during the last 15 months. Since April last year single fares have gradually increased for £2.80 to £3.30 and day tickets from £4.80 to £5.40.

Unfair competition from the governments £2 bus fares have again been given as one of the reasons why fares have been increased. This may be the case, but won’t this further fare rise just increase the number of people switching from tram to bus. When and if the government subsidised bus fare scheme comes to end, it will be interesting to see how much higher single bus fares will be in comparison to when the scheme began. Most bus companies have increased their day tickets quite considerably over the last 18 months so I think bus passengers are in for quite a shock if the scheme does come to a complete end.

Somewhat unfortunate timing for the fare rise given that the engineering works start tomorrow, so many passengers will be both paying more and getting a slower, less convenient journey. They really should have postponed the fare rise until after the works were completed.

As a reminder, there's no service between The Forest and Old Market Square from Tuesday 2nd July to Sunday 14th July.

 

[tram21]

All the Incentros (older trams) have been isolated to the south of the system, which is unusual, as talked about a couple of posts upthread.

Edit: there are a few of each!

 

[STINT47]

The peak time frequency on the 'extensions' has been cut to 10 minuets instead of 7 leading to my tram this morning being crush loaded. Yesterday I got a seat.

Putting fares up and then offering a poorer service for two weeks does seem yo be an odd decision that does not send a good message to customers

 

[MCR247]

I went past the tram replacement bus stop earlier at 5.30pm and the queue was very long and none of them looked too happy!

 

[tram21]

I went past the tram replacement bus stop earlier at 5.30pm and the queue was very long and none of them looked too happy!

This is why we don't do track works in term time...
I asked them about the dates and route of the tram replacement, and they said it was due to contractor availability they couldn't do any other dates.

 

[MCR247]

This is why we don't do track works in term time...
I asked them about the dates and route of the tram replacement, and they said it was due to contractor availability they couldn't do any other dates.

Ah that’s interesting. I’m somewhat surprised at how much pull the contractors have to be honest, but then I guess it will require specialists.

I do sometimes wonder how long it’ll take for NET to effectively become a victim of its own success. Trams at peak times get crush loaded but the system never seems to be doing too well financially. I wonder how much frequencies could be increased to, assuming more trams were ordered of course.

 

[ChrisC]

I do sometimes wonder how long it’ll take for NET to effectively become a victim of its own success. Trams at peak times get crush loaded but the system never seems to be doing too well financially. I wonder how much frequencies could be increased to, assuming more trams were ordered of course.

I agree that at peak times some trams can get crush loaded but there certainly are not as many people using it as there were before Covid. The car park at Hucknall used to be completely full to capacity well before 9.00am but now there are always spaces to be found at all times of the day.
I used to find it a real problem trying to park at Hucknall to get a Robin Hood Line train at around 9.30am because there was never anywhere to park. There are always plenty of spaces when I arrive at that time these days.

It’s very difficult to match timetables according to demand because, especially outside of peak times loadings are so variable from day to day. Trams can be full to capacity on evenings when there are lots of events on in the city. If there are events at the theatres, concert hall and arena, plus sporting fixtures, trams at around 10pm out of the city can be busier than in the peak and leaving people behind. On the other hand, for example on a quiet evening early in the week, often Monday with no events, trams can be running almost empty all evening.

 

[Nottingham59]

It’s very difficult to match timetables according to demand because, especially outside of peak times loadings are so variable from day to day. Trams can be full to capacity on evenings when there are lots of events on in the city. If there are events at the theatres, concert hall and arena, plus sporting fixtures, trams at around 10pm out of the city can be busier than in the peak and leaving people behind. On the other hand, for example on a quiet evening early in the week, often Monday with no events, trams can be running almost empty all evening.

Then they should have an employment model where more drivers can be called in at busy times to provide additional trams when needed.

And change the timetable to have fewer trams on the extremities of the network, with a queue-busting shuttle service between, say, Forest and Beeston that runs whenever trams on the full network are getting more than half full.

 

[MCR247]

It’s annoying NET don’t publish any public facing timetables during tram works like this. Not only are you reducing the number of trams, you also want me to guess at when they’ll turn up