SWR Class 458 to be retained

[Goldfish62]

2tph to Reading, I think primarily 455 now with 2/3 pairs 450 and 2/3 pairs 458/5, I think. Windsor is pretty solidly 450 except a morning diagram is 701 and you get the odd 458, same for Weybridge minus the 701.

Reading off peak is (pairs) 3 x 455, 3 x 450, 1 x 458/5, with some variation in the peaks and evenings.

 

[RacsoMoquette]

No, it was the height of the characters. Using a font with no descenders (hanging bits like on "g" and "y" is a long-established trick for getting more height of dot-matrix displays - otherwise you have at least one row of pixels that are only ever used by a handful of letters.

Specifically, per the Rail Vehicle Accessibility (South West Trains Class 458 Vehicles) Exemption Order 1999 (No. 2404):

(Note that 5(6)(a) was later amended to be 31 July 2006)

Regulation 13(7) being:

but the original displays had a 32 mm character height.

Ultimately new displays were fitted to the fleet - you can tell if you look closely at the curved centre-line panel in the ceiling, which curves ever so slightly over the larger panel. ScotRail's 334s were not modified - for reasons that I do not know - and they still have the original displays for comparison.

I should mention specifically for @TT-ONR-NRN's benefit that the no-descender fonts are probably much more common than he thinks; given that they're used in two different applications on Pendolinos and that he'll also encounter them on both Alstom and Annax systems should he visit Melbourne again.


== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Mar 2023 ==


Ah, you got there ahead of me! But yes, there were five other regulations with which non-compliance was only temporarily exempted. The explanatory note with the 1999 order lists the full set as:

For Reference:
Image of a Class 458 PIS Display before being heightened:

Class 458 - Disabled Lavatory & Vestibule (458010 - 25062005)

Explore [ MJF v2 ]'s 37180 photos on Flickr!

www.flickr.com

Image of a Class 458 PIS Display after being heightened:

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 May 2024 ==

Scotrail Class 334s still retain their original PIS housings and red LEDs

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 May 2024 ==

Just out of Curiosity, why did the SWT Class 458s receive orange instead of the previous red LEDs when heightened. They still bear the Classic Alstom font abnormalities though.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 May 2024 ==

I wonder why the PIS housing size was not an issue on the Coradia 1000 175s and 180s? I am pretty sure the pixel problem and the font size was the same as to the Junipers.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 May 2024 ==

The Class 175s and 180s had displays above

the internal sliding doors and to one side of the door at a horizontal angle.

 

[Snow1964]

Just out of Curiosity, why did the SWT Class 458s receive orange instead of the previous red LEDs when heightened. They still bear the Classic Alstom font abnormalities though.

I wonder why the PIS housing size was not an issue on the Coradia 1000 175s and 180s? I am pretty sure the pixel problem and the font size was the same as to the Junipers.

From memory when the regulations came in, mandating a minimum font size, the easiest way to meet the new rules were new displays that could use the existing software and display drivers. The original displays displayed smaller characters that were too small for new standard.

I think they found a standard one that could be used which ticked the display size box, so used that. No point in specifying and waiting for expensive non-standard displays.

 

[RacsoMoquette]

I always somewhat found Alstom's classic red displays to flicker a lot and each character was only formed of one pixel, which made for a rather poor quality looking character!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 May 2024 ==

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 May 2024 ==

Another Curiosity of mine is to why the Class 390s PIS does not scroll horizontally akin to other UK Alstom Stock, instead a single word lowers in to the housing and lasts for a few seconds, before proceeding to lower down, and said cycle continues. Why is this?

 

[wickham]

Can anyone confirm which four class 458s are stored at Eastleigh Works please ?
458428 + 458423 arrived there 26.02.24, while 458424 & another have arrived subsequently. What is the 4th and when did it & 424 arrive there ?
Around mid-day on 01.05.24 the headlights etc. were on on both sets and somebody was obviously on board "pumping them up".

 

[444045]

Can anyone confirm which four class 458s are stored at Eastleigh Works please ?
458428 + 458423 arrived there 26.02.24, while 458424 & another have arrived subsequently. What is the 4th and when did it & 424 arrive there ?
Around mid-day on 01.05.24 the headlights etc. were on on both sets and somebody was obviously on board "pumping them up".

The other 458 unit is 458416. I am reliabily informed that upto 8 x 458/4 will be stored at Eastleigh Works for the foreseeable future.

 

[Goldfish62]

The other 458 unit is 458416. I am reliabily informed that upto 8 x 458/4 will be stored at Eastleigh Works for the foreseeable future.

I'm sure that soon SWR will have more units in store than actually being used in service...

 

[Siemens Staines]

SWR asked Porterbrook to carry out some cab mods on 6 x 458/4 units to get them into service to help out, I hear this is now supposed to be 20 units even though 20 haven't been converted yet!

I am reliabily informed that upto 8 x 458/4 will be stored at Eastleigh Works for the foreseeable future.

This would seem to imply 20 of the 458/4 to receive cab mods and eventually be used in service at some point in the future, and the other 8 to be stored at Eastleigh indefinitely. But perhaps I am drawing the wrong conclusion?

 

[OneTrackMinded]

This would seem to imply 20 of the 458/4 to receive cab mods and eventually be used in service at some point in the future, and the other 8 to be stored at Eastleigh indefinitely. But perhaps I am drawing the wrong conclusion?

The majority of it is for Porterbrook's benefit. Only 4 units will be used on SWR for a limited period of time in order to fill in for the fleet shortage.

 

[amazon1675]

Sorry,but why are Porterbrook presumably funding work on these units if they are not all likely to be used,but merely stored? Hmmm...if an open access operator wanted to start a rivel service,say Southampton to Waterloo,the 458s might be ideal ? Remember the threatened rival service on that route a while back? Units standing off lease and not earning are not ideal for the owner,nor are units on lease doing nothing in sidings for the leasing TOC,or am I missing something?

 

[43096]

Sorry,but why are Porterbrook presumably funding work on these units if they are not all likely to be used,but merely stored? Hmmm...if an open access operator wanted to start a rivel service,say Southampton to Waterloo,the 458s might be ideal ? Remember the threatened rival service on that route a while back? Units standing off lease and not earning are not ideal for the owner,nor are units on lease doing nothing in sidings for the leasing TOC,or am I missing something?

The work is being done because Porterbrook signed a contract with Alstom for it to be done, off the back of a contract with SWR to lease them through to 2028.

 

[Invincible]

Sorry,but why are Porterbrook presumably funding work on these units if they are not all likely to be used,but merely stored? Hmmm...if an open access operator wanted to start a rivel service,say Southampton to Waterloo,the 458s might be ideal ? Remember the threatened rival service on that route a while back? Units standing off lease and not earning are not ideal for the owner,nor are units on lease doing nothing in sidings for the leasing TOC,or am I missing something?

Refurbishment for SWR's Class 458 trains thanks to new contract between Porterbrook and Alstom

Porterbrook has announced that South Western Railway's (SWR) fleet of Modern Railway’s ‘Golden Spanner awards’ winning Class 458 will undergo major improvements following a new deal with Alstom.

www.railadvent.co.uk

Porterbrook signed a refurb contract with Alstom so the 458s could replace the ill fated 442s express trains on the Portsmouth line, then passenger levels droppef during the COVID lockdown and never recovered.

 

[444045]

This would seem to imply 20 of the 458/4 to receive cab mods and eventually be used in service at some point in the future, and the other 8 to be stored at Eastleigh indefinitely. But perhaps I am drawing the wrong conclusion?

I believe the reason for storing the units is because of a lack of space at Bournemouth Depot and Wimbledon Park.

There is no time duration on those units staying at Eastleigh Works, just a convenient location should they be needed.

 

[amazon1675]

I guess SWR cares little about passenger numbers now that it just runs a contract? Who is making the rolling stock policy these days? I assume DfT ? It all makes BR look very slick and cost effective. The freight operators seem much more cost aware.Imagine one buying 1000 new wagons then taking four years to get them into service for various dubious reasons.

 

[slicedbread]

Refurbishment for SWR's Class 458 trains thanks to new contract between Porterbrook and Alstom

Porterbrook has announced that South Western Railway's (SWR) fleet of Modern Railway’s ‘Golden Spanner awards’ winning Class 458 will undergo major improvements following a new deal with Alstom.

www.railadvent.co.uk

Porterbrook signed a refurb contract with Alstom so the 458s could replace the ill fated 442s express trains on the Portsmouth line, then passenger levels droppef during the COVID lockdown and never recovered.

The announcement about the 458 contract was March 2021 (if I remember correctly) so you would have imagined SWR had an idea about post covid numbers by then.

But perhaps they where expecting more of a recovery in numbers on the Portsmouth Direct than they got.

 

[Bikeman78]

Refurbishment for SWR's Class 458 trains thanks to new contract between Porterbrook and Alstom

Porterbrook has announced that South Western Railway's (SWR) fleet of Modern Railway’s ‘Golden Spanner awards’ winning Class 458 will undergo major improvements following a new deal with Alstom.

www.railadvent.co.uk

Porterbrook signed a refurb contract with Alstom so the 458s could replace the ill fated 442s express trains on the Portsmouth line, then passenger levels droppef during the COVID lockdown and never recovered.

At the risk of going round in circles, Covid happened before the 442s were scrapped so why the 458 plan was ever agreed is a mystery to me. SWR could easily run the whole electric operation with 444/450/701.

 

[DMckduck]

At the risk of going round in circles, Covid happened before the 442s were scrapped so why the 458 plan was ever agreed is a mystery to me. SWR could easily run the whole electric operation with 444/450/701.

Makes you wonder, as HMT and the gov would have been involved at some level.

I wonder if there was handouts that benefitted a select few...

 

[pompeyfan]

Could it be as simple as the contract was signed March 2020 pre Covid, but wasn’t announced until 18 months after as Covid got in the way of the announcements? The 442s at the time had issues with their re-tractioning and were only exempt from PSVAR (or the railway equivalent) until 2024 so plans needed to be in place to replace the 442s anyway. This is complete guesswork though.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Could it be as simple as the contract was signed March 2020 pre Covid, but wasn’t announced until 18 months after as Covid got in the way of the announcements?

Having had to work within such criteria over the years, very likely the case indeed. Seem to recall reading (recently) somewhere, that one aspect about railway operations (in the here and now) is that they are deemed too slow to react to changes that are deemed necessary? I fully understand the various reasons why changes take time, but that doesn't stop outside criticism being launched at the railway (operations side) from those with other (eg political) agenda's at stake.

 

[Benno]

The next unit for refurbishment at Widnes should be 458512 departing Bournemouth Tuesday 14th May.

 

[Goldfish62]

Could it be as simple as the contract was signed March 2020 pre Covid, but wasn’t announced until 18 months after as Covid got in the way of the announcements? The 442s at the time had issues with their re-tractioning and were only exempt from PSVAR (or the railway equivalent) until 2024 so plans needed to be in place to replace the 442s anyway. This is complete guesswork though.

That's the first possible explanation I've seen that actually makes sense.

The formal announcement was along the lines of, "We're getting rid of these trains because we don't need them for capacity anymore, but we're instead keeping these other trains which we were going to get rid of so we can provide the capacity we just said we didn't need".

 

[SEtrains]

The paths for 458413 To be returned down south and 458512 for refurbishment have now appeared on RTT

Light Loco

Realtime Trains | 5Z53 0723 Leicester L.I.P. to Widnes Transport Tech | 13/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Z53 0723 departure from Leicester L.I.P. to Widnes Transport Tech on 13/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Loco+458413
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:K07042/2024-05-13/detailed

Realtime Trains | 5X64 1135 Wembley Receptions 1-7 to Southampton Central | 14/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 5X64 1135 departure from Wembley Receptions 1-7 to Southampton Central on 14/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains | 5Q64 1534 Southampton Central to Bournemouth T&R.S.M.D | 14/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q64 1534 departure from Southampton Central to Bournemouth T&R.S.M.D on 14/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Loco+458512

Realtime Trains | 5Z66 2018 Bournemouth T&R.S.M.D to Eastleigh East Yard | 14/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Z66 2018 departure from Bournemouth T&R.S.M.D to Eastleigh East Yard on 14/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Onwards paths from Eastleigh east yard do not currently show.

 

[Mainsideman]

Deleted

 

[Invincible]

They have been cleared on the weybridge and hounslow loop lines. it's on a traction and train crew bulletin on our notice boards.

Thanks for the photos, far too good for Portsmouth, much more suited to Hounslow

 

[Dr_Intoxicated]

Looking forward to seeing them or the 701s in regular service on the Windsor services

 

[TEW]

Probably see the 458/4s first, limited to Waterloo-Weybridge via Hounslow and Hounslow Loop services, for now at least anyway.

 

[LUYMun]

(credit to an swr staff member)

Grr, look at the poor window alignment for those two sets of table seats!

 

[43096]

Still got the Stagecoach blue on the strip below the window. Wall coverings look original, too.

 

[Kite159]

Those seats don't look that comfortable with the angle of the back, reminds me a bit like the seats on a TfW 175. Shame because the seats on the 458/5s are quite decent. I presume the pointless armrest by the window side will be locked in a down postion

At least there are some large seat back tables, hopefully they will stay connected once some of the lovely feral 'customers' start trying to sit on them [I put customers in quote because they probably won't be paying]

 

[Benno]

458526 will be the next unit for conversion at Widnes, leaving Bournemouth 29th May. 458534 will also go off lease week commencing Mon 27th May.