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Rail industry preparing for national strikes

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furnessvale

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only if you cancel most of the countries regular services though, someone needs to drive them, maybe the signallers could be trained.:D
What percentage of the passenger market do you think rail has? At present, Buxton has one train an hour towards Manchester but a bus every 30 mins (change at Stockport at the same bus stop onto a bus every 5 mins).

The buses wouldn't even notice if they picked up 100% of rail passengers.
 
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Fokx

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That depends on your circumstances and situation doesn't it? If you rely on the extra 20% and/or do lots of overtime then yes, remaining at work was probably best. If you only do the minimum, then 80% for doing absolutely nothing while avoiding the stress and hassle of the job (including the shift work and commuting) is quite an attractive position....particularly as some companies topped up to 100% anyway.
Plus many of those who were furloughed were able (and legally entitled) to seek employment opportunities elsewhere whilst still receiving full furlough payments.

I had friends that were receiving 80% of their income whilst at the same time taking up roles as delivery drivers and 0hr roles that meant they were nearly doubling their income
 

yorksrob

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What percentage of the passenger market do you think rail has? At present, Buxton has one train an hour towards Manchester but a bus every 30 mins (change at Stockport at the same bus stop onto a bus every 5 mins).

The buses wouldn't even notice if they picked up 100% of rail passengers.

They would of they suddenly had train loads of passengers wanting to go long distance. Buses are full of people doing short hops (i'm one of them).
 

Starmill

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I say most of the country needs a 24/7 railway for freight traffic.
A large proportion of the freight will happily run in the daytime you know. Given the passenger operators are going to be on strike as well that's not going to be too difficult.

Freight and a skeleton long distance passenger service on major routes in the daytime, nothing on secondary routes or early mornings and late evenings.

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They would of they suddenly had train loads of passengers wanting to go long distance. Buses are full of people doing short hops (i'm one of them).
A bus already runs between Buxton and Manchester Airport, it's not long distance. Lots of people use it end to end.
 
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bramling

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Agreed about the government not particularly caring about key workers - but equally the railway did receive far more support than road and air transport. They were fully intending to use this as a negotiation ploy.


A work to rule would be more supported by the travelling public I imagine. It’s easy to blame striking rail workers as a passenger - shortage of train crew, on the other hand, becomes very much the TOCs taking the blame…



Isn’t remaining in work at 100% pay better than 80% pay furloughed? The fact still remains that rail got more direct support than any other method of transport.

Everyone is being hit by the cost of living crisis. The railway risks biting the hand that feeds it too much and returning to decline.

On the point about remaining in work, the answer is it depends. During spring 2020, I suspect most railway staff would have been quite happy to remain at home on 80%, reducing the at the time unquantifiable risk to their health.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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Isn’t remaining in work at 100% pay better than 80% pay furloughed? The fact still remains that rail got more direct support than any other method of transport.

Everyone is being hit by the cost of living crisis. The railway risks biting the hand that feeds it too much and returning to decline.
What would your thoughts have been if there had been no Governmental furlough scheme?
 

Llandudno

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They would of they suddenly had train loads of passengers wanting to go long distance. Buses are full of people doing short hops (i'm one of them).
Not so sure that there are many ‘full’ buses these days…
 

Falcon1200

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The way I see it is the Government want people back in offices (so their wealthy donors/stakeholders can reap rent).

Seriously ? That's the first time I've ever seen that stated as a reason for ending working from home. More often it been the serious loss of income to transport operators (including of course the railway), coffee and sandwich shops, other High St businesses, etc. Plus getting offices, including Government departments, to work more effectively.
 

uglymonkey

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The railway needs to decide if its public sector ( no pay rises, but a warm community glow) or a private enterprises ( lots of cash, but ruthless "slash and burn" if the shareholders are not happy).
 

Bow Fell

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I echo some of the earlier comments above, while a national strike, would bring things to a standstill, it’d be effective in creating maximum impact, but for public opinion, not so much.

Despite the doom and gloom of some, the railway is recovering, for some TOC’s in terms of revenue and patronage, it’s almost business as usual. Let’s keep it that way, please!

But the comment about withdrawal of RDW for action short of strike, would be just as effective as a strike!

If you think TOC’s are far too reliant on RDW, then trust me, you ain’t seen nothing yet, on the Network Rail side! I’ve experienced a entire day shift, panels and a meal relief all RDW before. The second you stop RDW on the signalling side, it’s as good as a strike.
 

SignallerJohn

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Lol public opinion. As if public opinion pays bills. As if the government are going to say oh the public want railway staff to get a pay rise…… because they always listen to the will of the people don’t they?
 

Tomnick

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I agree, but what I’m saying is you strike you lose any pay raise you may get. You work to rule, no rest day work, mo favours you don’t lose money but the pain is still felt on Sodor Island and can be sustained if required over a long period.
I'd like to think that your union exec would recognise that if it actually came to strike action though. The very real risk from their point of view is that strikes can't be sustained for very long, exactly for the reason that you state. The mandate alone sends a powerful message though, and the mere threat of even a couple of carefully considered strike days puts more pressure on a Government who are seemingly already feeling nervous (and rightly so). Removing rest day work will certainly cause them some problems (but not necessarily everywhere?), and in reality that's probably what'll have the greatest impact, but the membership saying "no, we won't go on strike" is a serious sign of weakness.
 

778

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Has anyone heard any rumours about when the strikes are likely to take place? I am not blaming anyone for going on strike, I would just like to know the dates ASAP, so I can make plans around them.

Are the strikes more likely to take place at weekends rather than weekdays, because a lot of people (not everyone) can work from home and that would lessen the impacts of any strike? I know the recent TPE strikes have taken place at weekends. Would events like Glastonbury and the Commonwealth Games be targeted?

I think I read somewhere than the earliest it can happen is June 7th, but I assume that would still be too early, because the strikes would have to be co-ordinated with other unions (e.g ASLEF).
 

choochoochoo

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Seriously ? That's the first time I've ever seen that stated as a reason for ending working from home. More often it been the serious loss of income to transport operators (including of course the railway), coffee and sandwich shops, other High St businesses, etc. Plus getting offices, including Government departments, to work more effectively.

Loss of income to high st businesses (coffee shops etc) leads to their closure and ultimately leads to less rent to the property owners.
 

KendalR

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Mark my words there will NOT be strike vote for signallers, action short of maybe but definitely a NO to strike.
You seem to be very sure of yourself. All but 1 out of about 25 signallers I've spoken to have voted yes.

Striking for a pay rise by losing xxx pounds. Hmmm even uneducated signallers aren’t that stupid.
Then they are fools.
A strike isn't just about getting a few extra pound notes in your pocket. The writing is on the wall, GBR on the horizon and it will be a case of our way or the high way unless the workforce stick tougher. Same happened with Railtrack and hence the 1994 strikes.

Roll over and that's that, worsening T&C's, attacks on pensions and under inflation pay rises if we are lucky to get them in the future.
 

Andyh82

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Times and FT tomorrow reporting that NR and operators are preparing contingency plans to deal with a national strike should RMT vote for industrial action over the proposed NR maintenance staffing cutbacks and pay & conditions at TOCs.



12 hour working will be as a result of signallers taking industrial action. Also goes on to say that keeping freight moving will be the higher priority so if your on freight route you might get a train service unless the operators staff is taking action as well.

Ballot close next Tuesday so result should be known middle of week.

FT goes on say


DfT are in danger are being too optimistic here although its not clear whether the thresholds apply to each individual organisation or aggregate of all those voting.

Open access operators aren't being balloted.
There was 49 RMT ballots in 2020? And with half the year being in lockdown, I’m guessing this was lower than normal

What on earth can all the issues have been to issue 49 ballots? I wonder what the total number of strike ballots across all unions was, probably about 50?
 

Ianigsy

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One strategy would be to bring different TOCs out on different dates and NR signalled out on another day altogether. That way you can have an ongoing campaign of disruption while minimising loss of earnings to members and be seen to be maintaining a service of sorts, if (say) you brought Avanti and LNER out on different days and the same with Northern and TPE.
 

Darandio

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It happened in 2017. Don't know if it was a coincidence or targeted deliberately.

Considering the RMT dragged a mobile billboard around Aintree on the day i'd say it was targeted.
 

Robertj21a

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Considering the RMT dragged a mobile billboard around Aintree on the day i'd say it was targeted.
Presumably, the RMT were very proud of the action they had taken. It does rather emphasise how out of touch they are.
 

CyrusWuff

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There was 49 RMT ballots in 2020? And with half the year being in lockdown, I’m guessing this was lower than normal

What on earth can all the issues have been to issue 49 ballots? I wonder what the total number of strike ballots across all unions was, probably about 50?
Ballot results are all archived on the RMT website.

By way of comparison, there were 139 ballots in 2021, and there have been 34 so far this year excluding the current batch that close on Tuesday.
 

Jez

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If there was to be a national strike how long would it be allowed to go for ? E.g usually when a TOC strikes its for a day or a few days. And then I'd doesn't get resolved another strike further down the line. Also would any services run at all. I know when some TOC have strikes a limited service operates.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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If there was to be a national strike how long would it be allowed to go for ? E.g usually when a TOC strikes its for a day or a few days. And then I'd doesn't get resolved another strike further down the line. Also would any services run at all. I know when some TOC have strikes a limited service operates.
96 years ago, there was a National Strike, in which the railway unions went on strike with other trades unions. It started on 4th May 1926 and ended on 12th May 1926.
 

danielcanning

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I wonder who exactly funds the RMT? It wouldn’t surprise me if they’ve received ‘donations’ from Russia to be honest…
 

BrummieBobby

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Frankly, as a signaller, public opinion does not concern me. Inflation is through the roof, pay rises have been witheld, cutting maintenance positions will have a detrimental effect on safety, at a time when NR are already understaffed on the operations front. I voted yes to strike and action short.

Speaking to people at my place, I have not heard anybody say they have voted no. The utterances from NR management have time and again antagonised the situation and, if anything, convinced those who were unsure to also vote yes.

I would be highly surprised if the result is not a big mandate for action.
 

Starmill

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If there was to be a national strike how long would it be allowed to go for ? E.g usually when a TOC strikes its for a day or a few days.
How long is a piece of string? But it's likely that there will be at least one day of industrial action in every week. For example Aslef members could strike on Fridays and RMT / TSSA members on Sundays. And then the next week they might swap around. It might be Saturdays instead of Fridays. Multiple sets of members might also take Industrial action at the same time.
 

Andyh82

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One strategy would be to bring different TOCs out on different dates and NR signalled out on another day altogether. That way you can have an ongoing campaign of disruption while minimising loss of earnings to members and be seen to be maintaining a service of sorts, if (say) you brought Avanti and LNER out on different days and the same with Northern and TPE.
Plus of course striking for 24 hours straddling two days, meaning two days are effected with only one days pay lost. Seems to be a trick they often use on the London Undergound

And of course announcing a strike but cancelling it at the last moment meaning everyone has already cancelled their plans and made alternative arrangements, but no days pay is therefore lost

I’m just hoping none of the days coincide with any of the days I’ve already booked Advances for
 
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