Should XC call all trains at Reston and leave Dunbar to LNER?

[adrock1976]

Although more of a timetabling question, has the frequency of trains calling there been sorted out properly yet?

I do recall reading the East Coast 2022 timetable consultation that the section for Crosscountry mentioned that although they are happy to call at Reston, they would not be able to also call at Dunbar with the same train.

Should ICXC call all trains at Reston and leave Dunbar to ICEC/LNER being as Dunbar has always had direct London trains?

 

[Baxenden Bank]

This is the RealTimeTrains information, when I looked at the beginning of the month:

	LNER	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE
	1S00	9S07	9S09	9S12	9S13	9S15	9S16	9S21
Newcastle	0622	0704	0919	1206	..	..	1614	2101
Berwick	0716	0800	1011	1302	1405	1616	1709	2156
Reston	0727*	0811	1022	1313	1416	1627	1720	2207
Edinburgh	0807	0855	1101	1352	1458	1702	1804	2248
	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	LNER
	9N05	9N09	9N11	9N14	9N15	9N17	9N19	1E30
Edinburgh	0529	0933	1137	1410	1514	1734	1911	2100
Reston	0617	1011	1214	1448	1553	1813	1950	2140*
Berwick	0629	1023	1225	1500	1604	1824	2002	2153
Newcastle	0724	1122	..	1554	..	1922	2056	2242
							york	leeds
*service stop unadvertised
calls show up by doing an 'hour by hour' run through

 

[adrock1976]

This is the RealTimeTrains information, when I looked at the beginning of the month:

	LNER	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE
	1S00	9S07	9S09	9S12	9S13	9S15	9S16	9S21
Newcastle	0622	0704	0919	1206	..	..	1614	2101
Berwick	0716	0800	1011	1302	1405	1616	1709	2156
Reston	0727*	0811	1022	1313	1416	1627	1720	2207
Edinburgh	0807	0855	1101	1352	1458	1702	1804	2248
	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	TPE	LNER
	9N05	9N09	9N11	9N14	9N15	9N17	9N19	1E30
Edinburgh	0529	0933	1137	1410	1514	1734	1911	2100
Reston	0617	1011	1214	1448	1553	1813	1950	2140*
Berwick	0629	1023	1225	1500	1604	1824	2002	2153
Newcastle	0724	1122	..	1554	..	1922	2056	2242
							york	leeds
*service stop unadvertised
calls show up by doing an 'hour by hour' run through

Many thanks for that.

It does seem to be a bitty timetable rather than an even frequency clockface timetable.

 

[Watershed]

Many thanks for that.

It does seem to be a bitty timetable rather than an even frequency clockface timetable.

The TPE service is based around what can be fitted into the existing ECML timetable (which was designed well before Reston was even a concrete proposal), using 2 units. Whilst the LNER services are based on those which could call with minimal impact, i.e. services to/from Newcastle/Leeds, not London.

If the station proves to yield sufficient passenger numbers, I am sure there will be demand for more services.

 

[Class 170101]

Problem is a chicken and egg situation. I would say there is a good morning peak service to Edinburgh but a poor peak service south to Newcastle. Similar in the evening peak an adequate service from Edinburgh but nothing from Newcastle. Would the service as shown here encourage demand, seems unlikely.

 

[hexagon789]

Problem is a chicken and egg situation. I would say there is a good morning peak service to Edinburgh but a poor peak service south to Newcastle. Similar in the evening peak an adequate service from Edinburgh but nothing from Newcastle. Would the service as shown here encourage demand, seems unlikely.

I imagine the intention is for Reston to have it's best service provision to/from Edinburgh, the fact trains extend to Newcastle is simply a byproduct of necessity than careful design.

I understand in another time the intention was Reston to be served by a two-hourly ScotRail run Edinburgh-Dunbar-Reston-BerwickUponTweed service rather than TPE. So Newcastle wasn't really an intended destination when this was all planned out some years presumably.

 

[EastisECML]

I'm wondering if a consistent clock face stopping schedule would be better? LNER continues calling at just Alnmouth or Berwick. Whilst the XC service calls at Morpeth, Alnmouth, Berwick and Dunbar every hour. Along with the TPE Newcastle to Edinburgh service. Pity Leeds will only have 1tph to Edinburgh and that train would be stopping so many times in Northumberland whilst York gets two much quicker trains mind. Is there much demand from Leeds that would warrant two faster trains to Edinburgh every hour?

 

[zwk500]

I'm wondering if a consistent clock face stopping schedule would be better?

do you think that such an options was available and has been deliberately not chosen?

LNER continues calling at just Alnmouth or Berwick. Whilst the XC service calls at Morpeth, Alnmouth, Berwick and Dunbar every hour. Along with the TPE Newcastle to Edinburgh service.

so what calls at Reston?

Pity Leeds will only have 1tph to Edinburgh and that train would be stopping so many times in Northumberland whilst York gets two much quicker trains mind. Is there much demand from Leeds that would warrant two faster trains to Edinburgh every hour?

Not really, but more importantly is there the capacity between York and Edinburgh to find slots for such services?

 

[EastisECML]

do you think that such an options was available and has been deliberately not chosen?

so what calls at Reston?

Not really, but more importantly is there the capacity between York and Edinburgh to find slots for such services?

1) I don't know, hence why I asked.

2) The TPE Newcastle to Edinburgh service. Newcastle-Cramlington-Morpeth-Widdrington-Alnmouth-Berwick-Reston-Dunbar-Musselburgh-Edinburgh possibly.

3) There is or has been 2tph from Leeds to Edinburgh so I'm guessing so? But if LNER get their third train per hour to Newcastle I'm guessing not. Maybe in the distant future if HS2 gets the bulk of Edinburgh to London passengers traffic on the ECML will be relieved to allow for better inter-regional trains?

 

[Watershed]

The TPE Newcastle to Edinburgh service. Newcastle-Cramlington-Morpeth-Widdrington-Alnmouth-Berwick-Reston-Dunbar-Musselburgh-Edinburgh possibly.

Unfortunately that's not possible unless you slowed down the LNER fasts and/or had the service looped and/or completely recast the freight paths. None of which are impossible but each have their own issues.

 

[EastisECML]

Unfortunately that's not possible unless you slowed down the LNER fasts and/or had the service looped and/or completely recast the freight paths. None of which are impossible but each have their own issues.

Probably more likely if HS2 services makes ECML London-Edinburgh services largely redundant then. I wonder how TPE are going to fit in those Newcastle-Edinburgh trains?

I think there are ambitions for a station at Belford as well. I assume the priority for these stations will be getting to and from Edinburgh/Newcastle rather than to other local stations?

 

[tbtc]

I think a consistent clock face timetable for Reston is the best forward

Based on the paths in the OP, I'd suggest departures from Reston towards Edinburgh at 08:11 and then every twenty four hours - similarly departures from Edinburgh at 17:34 and then every twenty four hours

That should be sufficient to tick a box by giving the station some service - any other trains that stop there are a waste of paths and fuel (slowing down, speeding up again) and if there is scope for additional paths on Newcastle to Edinburgh trains then they'd be much better having those stops at Morpeth/ Alnmouth/ Berwick/ Dunbar

(East Linton is a marginally better case for stops, but Reston is a complete waste of time on what should be a line for fast trains that are 130/260m long)

 

[zwk500]

Out of interest, do new stations have a 'probation' period where if the passenger numbers turn out to be very low it can be closed quite quickly or once it's had 1 train call does it then have to go through the proper process?