What changes would you make for the tube

[jopsuk]

Other than the Edgeware road problem, the Circle is much more reliable than it was before and there's a hugely improved Hammersmith service. Aren't there also more "Circle" services?

 

[Deerfold]

Aren't there also more "Circle" services?

No, except between Paddington and Edgware Road (and they go from different platforms/stations).

The old circle line was timetabled to run every 8½ minutes, as did the Hammersmith and City. Both are now timetabled to run every 10 minutes, so the frequency between Hammersmith and Paddington has increased by 70% but everywhere else is down by about 18%. However as the service is now more reliable the frequency is now probably often better than before.

 

[jon0844]

It's good when you come off Heathrow Express that the walk to the H&C line platform isn't far compared to the Circle line - but at the same time, if a train has come in then you'll struggle through the gates and down the steps. It's not really big enough for the passenger flows.

Is that going to be fixed in the (near) future as part of the work at the station?

 

[Mojo]

Is that going to be fixed in the (near) future as part of the work at the station?

Yes, there is a Paddington (suburban) station capacity project.

 

[TGV]

Somehow....and I confess I'm not sure how, but I'd like to link Waterloo with Kings Cross/St Pancras WITHOUT the need to change. It must be one of the most, if not the most asked question by visitors travelling between the two - "what's the best way to get to..."

Maybe a new Northern Line spur somehow?

The Waterloo and Kings line?! Direct between the two with no intermediate stops?! (that's a joke by the way...)

 

[MCR247]

Kingerloo/Kingloo line?

 

[Mojo]

It must be one of the most, if not the most asked question by visitors travelling between the two - "what's the best way to get to..."

Easy; Bakerloo to Oxford Circus and cross platform interchange to the Victoria.

 

[causton]

Get on a Northern line train and hope it eventually switches from going via Charing X to going via Bank, that way you don't need to change!

 

[coupwotcoup]

I'd like to see tunnel width doubled and we could have our own
fast underground service..a la the RER in Paris.
After the war, the Central Line was going to be extended by a link
from Hainault to Collier Row and ending at Harold Hill/Wood.
Would never be feasible now of course.

 

[TGV]

Easy; Bakerloo to Oxford Circus and cross platform interchange to the Victoria.

Oh I know the answer - I do it every day (back of the Bakerloo train, turn left at Ox Circ and back of the Vicky line train for shortest route to KGX) - BUT - I've overheard and indeed been asked myself on many occasions of tourists or visitors asking the same question. Most of them choose the Northern line to Euston and change there. Not what I'd choose.

The point is, there is not a direct route between 2 of the busiest stations on the network which is a flaw I'd correct if there was time, money and space!

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I normally change at Leicester Square for the Piccadilly - slightly more walking involved, but I find it typically 2 minutes quicker - as long as I remember to be at the back of the Northern Line train and to stay at the back of the Piccadilly train ( for the Waterloo to KX direction; obviously front of the Piccy and middle of the Northern for the other direction! ).

 

[317653]

I would say extend the Victoria line to East Croydon because that would give people faster journey time to get to east london and the NXEA routes much quicker than changing at victoria

 

[MCR247]

What?

 

[coupwotcoup]

I normally change at Leicester Square for the Piccadilly - slightly more walking involved, but I find it typically 2 minutes quicker - as long as I remember to be at the back of the Northern Line train and to stay at the back of the Piccadilly train ( for the Waterloo to KX direction; obviously front of the Piccy and middle of the Northern for the other direction! ).

I take it I am not the only one who gets all smug on the tube, as a bit
of insider knowledge can save a good ten minutes on a complicated
journey that involves at least two changes.
Getting in the right carriage so to alight opposite the connecting walkway to the next line,
or knowing a short cut, despite what the signs say.
You ease your way from one line to another, past the nonplussed day-trippers and tourists.
Then you arrive at the next platform only to see your connection disappear down the pipe
and two minutes later a giggle (sic) of Japanese schoolgirls
you had left in your wake, emerge on to the platform.
Tortoise beats the hare..again. :cry:

 

[PaulLothian]

A further Q: Given that the FCC line down from Finsbury Park to Moorgate was originally built to be part of the Northern line would the existing rolling stock be able to run on the Waterloo and City (general terms rather than a comprehensive clearence!!!)?

The line in question was never a traditional underground line. Originally named the Great Northern & City Railway, it was intended to allow mainline trains of the Great Northern Railway to run from Finsbury Park directly into the City of London at Moorgate. As a result, the tubes were made large enough to take a main-line train, unlike those of the other tube railways being built in London at the time. The internal diameter was 16 feet (4.9 m),[2] compared with less than 12 feet (3.7 m) for the Central London Railway and smaller still for the original City & South London Railway tunnels. The original stock was considerably bigger than other underground stock.

If I understand the question, FCC stock would not get down the W & C (both because of tunnel size and sharpness of bends), and using tube stock on the Great Northern & City Railway would not encourage longer distance travel!

 

[Voyager 2093]

I personally would like to see faster trains. I know it may sound a bit naive but I find it amusing that on some lines we are restricted to 40mph such as the Bakerloo.

That is just me.

 

[MCR247]

So having a 60mph section between two stations that are about 1 1/2 minutes apart is what you would spend money on?

 

[deltic]

Given where capacity exists on the underground possible extensions are the Bakerloo south to Camberwell then perhaps splitting to serve a number of locations in south London -

Blackfriars station on the W&C

extend Central line to Harlow

Met Line Watford to Watford Junc

Northern line - Mill Hill East to Mill Hill Broadway to Edgeware to Stanmore and on to Bakerloo line at Harrow

 

[Fred26]

I'd extend the Victoria Line to Chingford. This would free up some paths into Liverpool Street... and get rid of a stub that annoys me.

I'd split the Northern Line, because it makes sense. I like my Tube Lines to be neat and branches do not equal neat.

I'd suggest that any new line should be similar to the Victoria Line. As in, it would have as many interchanges as possible.

I'd also suggest that the next new line run via the West End, with a new station in Soho and a new/reopened station at Aldwych. I know these places are close to Covent Garden/Leicester Square/Charing Cross, but I think think those busy stations would be given some much needed relief if there were more intense services.

Away from the Tube, I'd extend the DLR to Dagenham Dock, as was suggested before the recession bit.
I'd also like to investigate extending the DLR from Stratford to Kings Cross/St Pancras. I'd do this by running along the North London Line until just past Kings Cross, then running to an above ground terminus called Kings Cross St Pancras DLR. The new station would be between the mainline stations.

If I had a lot of money and didn't have to worry about planning permission, I'd love to bulldoze every GOBLIN station. I'd replace them with new stations where the GOBLIN cross other lines, thereby creating interchanges. Currently the GOBLIN crosses a handful of lines, yet makes good connections at only Barking, Blackhorse Road and Gospel Oak. Every other connection involves a street walk. To show you what I mean, I'd bulldoze Woodgrange Park (GOBLIN) and Forest Gate (NXEA) and possibly Manor Park (NXEA) and build one station with a low level and a high level. To do the whole line would cost a fortune, but I dream of the day.

 

[LE Greys]

If I had a lot of money and didn't have to worry about planning permission, I'd love to bulldoze every GOBLIN station. I'd replace them with new stations where the GOBLIN cross other lines, thereby creating interchanges. Currently the GOBLIN crosses a handful of lines, yet makes good connections at only Barking, Blackhorse Road and Gospel Oak. Every other connection involves a street walk. To show you what I mean, I'd bulldoze Woodgrange Park (GOBLIN) and Forest Gate (NXEA) and possibly Manor Park (NXEA) and build one station with a low level and a high level. To do the whole line would cost a fortune, but I dream of the day.

The joys of the pre-Grouping railway. :roll: Lines back then hated to connect with each other, because it meant that they might have to share revenue. Sorting it all out is actually a very good idea.

 

[Voyager 2093]

So having a 60mph section between two stations that are about 1 1/2 minutes apart is what you would spend money on?

No one said 60mph. Please tell me where you got that figure from?

Also not every London underground station is '1 1/2 minutes apart' as you quote. Its my preference not yours!

 

[MCR247]

Well what would you increase the speed to? Its kind of pointless isn't it?

 

[Voyager 2093]

Well what would you increase the speed to? Its kind of pointless isn't it?

err Maybe 50....

 

[jon0844]

The new tube trains seem like they could reach 100mph easily (I know they can't btw!) so if there's better acceleration and better braking then why not increase the line speed by 5 or 10mph?

Even if you don't run a tighter timetable, it always gives a bit of recovery time.

It's not something to do overnight, but as part of routine maintenance and expansion.

 

[coupwotcoup]

It is better to travel hopefully than to arrive

 

[LE Greys]

Finsbury Park-Seven Sisters is a good five minutes (or seems so at least), so is Hammersmith-Acton Town, and some of the station spacing on the Central Line above-ground sections must be fairly long as well. I'd say there's scope for a bit of speeding up. As for Harrow-Moor Park, that really needs something capable of 75-100.

 

[DavyCrocket]

Finsbury Park-Seven Sisters is a good five minutes (or seems so at least), so is Hammersmith-Acton Town, and some of the station spacing on the Central Line above-ground sections must be fairly long as well. I'd say there's scope for a bit of speeding up. As for Harrow-Moor Park, that really needs something capable of 75-100.

Increasing the speed then means that they'll be less trains running through though.

The Brighton Main Line is a good example (albeit an NR one), peak flow journey times are longer as there are more trains (and different stock, with different acceleration and braking characteristics at that).

 

[Deerfold]

Increasing the speed then means that they'll be less trains running through though.

The Brighton Main Line is a good example (albeit an NR one), peak flow journey times are longer as there are more trains (and different stock, with different acceleration and braking characteristics at that).

I'm not sure I follow that one. Peak flow journey times tend to be longer due to some trains making more stops or dwell times having to be longer due to more passengers (And of course on the Brighton main line there's a variety of stock). I can't see how it can be because the trains are travelling faster!

You might find there's little to be gained as a fast section just means the trains will catch up with the one before and then have to be slowed or stopped to maintain a safe distance.

 

[jon0844]

I am not suggesting that more trains are run because they can run a bit faster, but it gives the means to recover after delays (or indeed, just catch up when a train has dwelled at a station for a bit longer than planned, perhaps due to congestion or a passenger blocking the doors).

If you did try to run faster to reduce the time between stations I think that would be a recipe for disaster as you'd then get trains bunching up because of the very reasons you wanted to have some recovery time in the first place!

Once you go out to the furthest reaches of some lines, the increased speed might make a bit of a difference.

 

[Voyager 2093]

Finsbury Park-Seven Sisters is a good five minutes (or seems so at least), so is Hammersmith-Acton Town, and some of the station spacing on the Central Line above-ground sections must be fairly long as well. I'd say there's scope for a bit of speeding up. As for Harrow-Moor Park, that really needs something capable of 75-100.

Very true. On the Central between Northolt and South Ruislip there is a huge gap at least 4 minutes or so, that could do with a line increase, the 1992 Stock are amazing at braking so they would not struggle with braking into stations, There is quite a gap between Ruislip Gardens and West Ruislip. Also on the eastern side of things, there are huge gaps between Epping and Loughton and all the intermediate stations.