How does reduced ticket office opening hours protect staff and customers?

[The DJ]

Just noticed on the TfL website that Southall Station ticket office now has reduced opening hours "to protect staff and customers". I don't see it. The risk is no greater in the late evening than it is during the day. IMHO train companies including TfL are using the current situation as a handy excuse to reduce ticket office opening hours. The average ticket seller can deal with passengers quickly and efficiently so they move away either down onto the platform or out the door fairly quickly which seems preferable to people milling around queueing for and then trying to figure out the TVM.

 

[jamesst]

Its called saving money, nothing else!!

 

[mpthomson]

Shorter shifts for staff equals less exposure to the hopefully reduced number of passengers travelling. Alternatively if it means only one shift of staff per day instead of two then that's immediately halved the time that staff interact with the public, which helps protect them.

 

[gaillark]

TfL makes no secret of its dislike for ticket offices.
They want them all shut down.
On West Anglia and the North London Line quite a number of offices have closed and many others had reduced hours. The former Great Western managed stations will in the not too distant future see a consultation published on closing or reducing facilities permanently.

 

[30907]

Shorter shifts for staff equals less exposure to the hopefully reduced number of passengers travelling. Alternatively if it means only one shift of staff per day instead of two then that's immediately halved the time that staff interact with the public, which helps protect them.

So logically staff customer-facing hours should be cut to zero?
Then the travellers would be completely protected from the staff, and v.v.

 

[Tom Quinne]

Beware of cost cutting measures dressed up as “safely improvements” or even better “innovation in efficiency”.

TFL like the rest of the railway, country is broke they need to cut costs, as usual it’s nice and easy to cut front line jobs on £20,000-£30,000 pa vice management jobs on £100,000+ i mean turkey’s dont vote for xmas do they...

 

[DB]

Shorter shifts for staff equals less exposure to the hopefully reduced number of passengers travelling. Alternatively if it means only one shift of staff per day instead of two then that's immediately halved the time that staff interact with the public, which helps protect them.

But more people will come when te ticket office is open, once they know about the reduced opening hours. OK, some won't, but the reduction in number of people interacted with is not going to be anything like 50%.

And ticket offices normally have perspex screens anyway, so there is very little risk.

This sounds like just an excuse for cutting hours.

 

[Ianno87]

But more people will come when te ticket office is open, once they know about the reduced opening hours.

No, people come to the ticket office when they want to travel.

 

[DB]

No, people come to the ticket office when they want to travel.

Some do, but others will go in advance to sort out their tickets - especially those who aren't happy using the internet services.

 

[bramling]

No, people come to the ticket office when they want to travel.

There is the danger of it becoming like the banks, who have made it so difficult to attend branches that it becomes self-fulfilling.

I’ve has a couple of occasions since March where I’ve turned up at the station and the booking office has been closed at a time when advertised to be open, which has resulted in a free journey.

 

[Ianno87]

Some do, but others will go in advance to sort out their tickets - especially those who aren't happy using the internet services.

How many such people are there, especially at the present time?

 

[PeterC]

I suppose that if staff numbers are significantly reduced due to sickness and shielding then it makes sense to reduce the number of shifts so that advertised hours match availability. Dressing it up as "protection" seems a bit silly though.

 

[DB]

How many such people are there, especially at the present time?

Dunno - I guess it's going to be related to what the make-up of current passenger loads are (which I don't know).

 

[Caaardiff]

Its 2020, with smartphone options and TVM. Are ticket offices really needed?

Most Airlines got rid of them years ago.

 

[High Dyke]

Now this is one of the things that trade unions campaign over; sadly though their posturing somewhat overshadows the heart of the matter. Reduced hours, temporarily during the current situation, makes sense, but IMO it is just masking the long-term will of employers to sacrifice the lower paid workers, as mentioned above.

 

[Watershed]

Its 2020, with smartphone options and TVM. Are ticket offices really needed?

Most Airlines got rid of them years ago.

No, they're not needed - after all, in high crime areas where you can't have cash-taking TVMs, people who need to use cash can walk to the nearest "safe" station instead. And those needing discounts that aren't available at TVMs can pay full fare. Oh, and we can advise people unfamiliar with the railway to guess the right option on the app or TVM - if they get it wrong they can pay a Penalty Fare, so it's not a problem. Simple - reduce costs and increase revenue, who could complain!

 

[Ianno87]

No, they're not needed - after all, in high crime areas where you can't have cash-taking TVMs, people who need to use cash can walk to the nearest "safe" station instead. And those needing discounts that aren't available at TVMs can pay full fare. Oh, and we can advise people unfamiliar with the railway to guess the right option on the app or TVM - if they get it wrong they can pay a Penalty Fare, so it's not a problem. Simple - reduce costs and increase revenue, who could complain!

But again, what percentage of users does that represent? Does the cost of providing for these users exceed the benefit?

E.g. Cash can be covered by 'Promise to Pay' notes, like Northern do.

 

[Watershed]

But again, what percentage of users does that represent? Does the cost of providing for these users exceed the benefit?

E.g. Cash can be covered by 'Promise to Pay' notes, like Northern do.

You could apply that logic to the millions of pounds spent on adding lifts and accessible footbridges to certain stations to cater for a handful of passengers who might need these facilities each year. And yet it's seen (quite correctly IMO) as a higher priority than investing the same money in infrastructure upgrade projects. The railway is not just about serving the 'easiest' customers as cheaply as possible. It is about (certain) societal benefits. That has become even clearer over the course of the pandemic.

 

[greyman42]

Its 2020, with smartphone options and TVM. Are ticket offices really needed?

Most Airlines got rid of them years ago.

Not everyone has a smartphone/PC and there should not be a requirement to pay for one.

 

[scrapy]

Possibly the ticket office staff have enhanced cleaning duties taking up the extra time? Or on the clinically extremely vunerable category so need to stay at home

 

[Ianno87]

You could apply that logic to the millions of pounds spent on adding lifts and accessible footbridges to certain stations to cater for a handful of passengers who might need these facilities each year. And yet it's seen (quite correctly IMO) as a higher priority than investing the same money in infrastructure upgrade projects. The railway is not just about serving the 'easiest' customers as cheaply as possible. It is about (certain) societal benefits. That has become even clearer over the course of the pandemic.

No you couldn't.

Firstly, railway accessibility is the law.

Secondly, making people buy tickets via an App, or via Telesphone etc. is not discriminatory as these alternatives are accessible. Nobody is totally prevented from being able to use the railway.

 

[Watershed]

No you couldn't.

Firstly, railway accessibility is the law.

Secondly, making people buy tickets via an App, or via Telesphone etc. is not discriminatory as these alternatives are accessible. Nobody is totally prevented from being able to use the railway.

It's the law... Except it's not, because any existing station is effectively grandfathered in so long as nothing is changed. Which means that all these improvements are just as voluntary as operating ticket offices.

If you move to an app/phone only railway it definitely excludes some people. You'd probably find that it does so disproportionately to people with disabilities.

I'm not saying this means it is unacceptable to close ticket offices under any circumstances. But suitable adjustments need to be made, and crucially there needs to be honesty about why it's happening and what the options are.

 

[Ianno87]

If you move to an app/phone only railway it definitely excludes some people. You'd probably find that it does so disproportionately to people with disabilities.

That's where ticket machines come in.

 

[Surreytraveller]

Because it protects staff who are shielding by not requiring them to come to work

 

[Caaardiff]

Diversify to save money. Most will have access to Apps or credit/debit cards to pay for tickets. I would imagine most ticket offices around the country barely see anyone throughout the day, especially at less busy stations, so productivity must be minimal, yet many ticket office duties are kept separate from other station duties. Ticket Offices are very often not open 24/7, whereas railway is pretty much 24/7.
Why doesn't the railway look to Travel Agents to sell tickets for those less able to use TVM's or Smartphones.
It's time for the railway to become more innovative and modern. Times have changed. It's not much different to the Airline industry that has adapted and costs kept low.

 

[adc82140]

Surely ticket offices had plexiglass screens between staff and passengers before it became fashionable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Diversify to save money. Most will have access to Apps or credit/debit cards to pay for tickets. I would imagine most ticket offices around the country barely see anyone throughout the day, especially at less busy stations, so productivity must be minimal, yet many ticket office duties are kept separate from other station duties. Ticket Offices are very often not open 24/7, whereas railway is pretty much 24/7.
Why doesn't the railway look to Travel Agents to sell tickets for those less able to use TVM's or Smartphones.
It's time for the railway to become more innovative and modern. Times have changed. It's not much different to the Airline industry that has adapted and costs kept low.

Travel agents are a dying breed, but you could easily get corner shops involved.

 

[Wychwood93]

I was going to have a few comments about how useful ticket office staff are, but realised that the OP was not looking to go down that road. There is drift going on here! We have lockdown, we have fun, we have seasons (how many?) in the sun.

 

[bramling]

Surely ticket offices had plexiglass screens between staff and passengers before it became fashionable.

The trend has tended to be to remove the screens, especially at some of the major stations. Both King’s Cross and St Pancras have an open desk layout (or at least they did before this spring!).

 

[Non Multi]

TfL have this ongoing fetish for roving customer service assistants armed with tablet computers. They assist at TVMs, TfL Rail doing away with traditional behind window ticket clerks outside the AM peak.

In the quieter TfL Rail stations they can be seen standing, bored and freezing cold on the platforms.