New TfL "s" stock

[Chilterns Dan]

Because once all the other A-Stock is gone, you'd need at least two units (to cover for breakdowns), spares, sperate maintanence procedures etc. Exactly what SWT are just about to rid themselves of down Lymington way...

Makes sense that common fleets cut overheads. Chiltern do keep their bubble car on the Princes Risborough - Aylesbury branch, however I believe they use similar stock for departmental duties so perhaps it's more cost effective.

 

[anonymous0101]

Here's me in an A stock the other day doing 65/70mph.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGHnhKNYogU

Isn't the speedometer only calibrated up to 60 mph? A shot of the speedo would have been good.

 

[MCR247]

http://rtranmer2008.fotopic.net/p54754454.html

 

[Mojo]

Please don't tell me they've fitted door open buttons on them! For some reason it really annoys me when people press them!

 

[Daniel]

Please don't tell me they've fitted door open buttons on them! For some reason it really annoys me when people press them!

Afraid so!! They do have a purpose, though, on any stock that is fitted with them, the doors can be set to just enable to buttons, not open automatically. However, I speak from experience that, if you accidentally leave them switched in, everyone decides not to push the buttons.

 

[Voyager 2093]

It happens to me when im on the Class 313s alot, people dont realise to open the doors manually and will be standing there for like 5 seconds before realising, I always seem to press them on 1992 stock to be on the safe side.

 

[A60K]

Afraid so!! They do have a purpose, though, on any stock that is fitted with them, the doors can be set to just enable to buttons, not open automatically. However, I speak from experience that, if you accidentally leave them switched in, everyone decides not to push the buttons.

Quite! A sort of Underground Sodde's Law. That's the principal reason that passenger operated doors have fallen out of favour - they've tried it from 1938 and again from 1978 and each time it was abandoned within 10-25 years!

On the Central line when the 1992 Stock was introduced, for example, just having a two-second delay at each station while a passenger worked out that they had to open the doors themselves would lead to a train losing a minute over a typical east-west journey compared to driver operated doors.

I think, although can't be 100% certain, that the plan with S Stock is to operate with the driver opening (not just enabling) all the doors at each station. Because of the air conditioning the doors will be on the same sort of 10-15 autoclose as an Electrostar, and the buttons are purely to be used for a passenger to reopen a door that has autoclosed.


Note from the picture that the first passenger door is slightly narrower than all the rest - a prize for the first person to give the reason!

 

[ert47]

Note from the picture that the first passenger door is slightly narrower than all the rest - a prize for the first person to give the reason!

Something to do with the length of the first seated area (between the cab and the first set of doors) not being long enough to accommodate full sized passenger doors?

if that made sense

 

[A60K]

That is correct!

 

[Dstock7080]

I think, although can't be 100% certain, that the plan with S Stock is to operate with the driver opening (not just enabling) all the doors at each station. Because of the air conditioning the doors will be on the same sort of 10-15 autoclose as an Electrostar, and the buttons are purely to be used for a passenger to reopen a door that has autoclosed.

45 seconds on S Stock.

Something to do with the length of the first seated area (between the cab and the first set of doors) not being long enough to accommodate full sized passenger doors?

if that made sense

Also, if the cab door is open then a full size door would clash!

 

[jon0844]

Why 45 seconds? That's going to let in loads of hot air and totally shaft the air con!!

There is a reason why everyone else shuts the doors as quickly as possible you know.

 

[ert47]

Also, if the cab door is open then a full size door would clash!

Aye! Bit of a finger trap

can't wait to have a go on them new trains

 

[DavyCrocket]

Isn't the S Stock fitted with Auto Door Open (or whatever it's called), for when the train has stopped in the correct place.

 

[jon0844]

Oh great; technology to keep the doors closed for ages while it checks and confirms its location!!!

 

[Dstock7080]

Isn't the S Stock fitted with Auto Door Open (or whatever it's called), for when the train has stopped in the correct place.

'95, '96, '09 Tube Stock and S Stock are fitted with the ability to use auto-door-open but this has not been switched in yet.

 

[ert47]

'95, '96, '09 Tube Stock and S Stock are fitted with the ability to use auto-door-open but this has not been switched in yet.

doesn't the '96 stock do this on the sub-surface Jubiliee extension stations or is that a different system?

 

[Daniel]

doesn't the '96 stock do this on the sub-surface Jubiliee extension stations or is that a different system?

No, doors are controlled by the driver, even in the extension on the Jubilee.

 

[A60K]

As far as I know, only the DLR has automatically opening doors in the UK.

There are some metro systems - Lille, Copenhagen, Lyon line D for example - with no staff on the train or platform and doors automatically open and close.

 

[MCR247]

As far as I know, only the DLR has automatically opening doors in the UK.

377s do

 

[Ivo]

Right then folks, a few points. How I have yet to post on an 'S' Stock topic baffles me.

Would anyone be up for some 'A' stock farewell trips? A certain ex-moderator of this forum (who posts occasionally but reads the forum regularly) is a driver, so all the more reason to do it (we'll have to make sure he is driving on the days we choose!)

I'd get GC Valentas to/from London for the ultimate nostalgic experience.

If enough people are up for it I'll propose a meet under Forum Meets.

Might I ask, what happened to this idea? Ten days have passed, and a couple of "I'd do it" posts aside, nothing. I would more than happily plod along!

Also, a few questions if I may. Firstly, with the new stock being so "hi-tech" are there are plans to modernise the stations they will be used on? For instance, are there any plans to install Platform-Edge Doors anywhere (on the network as a whole actually)? And what will become of the C&L bay platform? Will it become a dud? One that just sits there, out of use? My last question is that are the 'S' Stock actually derived from the modern Electrostar design? I know that they are made by the same company, but I never realised just how similar they are in appearance to the 378s. Or is it just me...?

Also, going back to the early posts in the thread, just to clarify something:

I am not sure if there isn't an EU directive that says all doors on Metro systems should be open at stations they call at for safety reasons which stomps on the 7 car circle trains.

If there was such a "directive", then (unless something has changed during the last few months) the Northern Line Charing Cross branch would be in breach of it already. '1995' stock units use Selective-Door Opening at Charing Cross, and possibly others (I can't remember).

Lastly, just to say, I honestly can't wait to use the 'S' Stock. Can anyone clarify when each line can expect its roll-out please?

 

[Mojo]

377s do

I keep reading that here. Is this actually true because I thought that all the GPS did was to ensure the train was stopped in the correct location before the release could actually be given rather than actually release the doors?

 

[MCR247]

I keep reading that here. Is this actually true because I thought that all the GPS did was to ensure the train was stopped in the correct location before the release could actually be given rather than actually release the doors?

A member of staff at southern said over the PA, although I'm sure I've seen the guard opening doors at Crawley, so your probably right

 

[Mojo]

On the 377s the doors are closed by the guard, yes, but I'd always assumed that the doors are manually released by the driver but to ensure the train is stopped in the correct place, and for SDO, anything has to be "authorised" by GPS.

 

[Ivo]

I keep reading that here. Is this actually true because I thought that all the GPS did was to ensure the train was stopped in the correct location before the release could actually be given rather than actually release the doors?

A member of staff at southern said over the PA, although I'm sure I've seen the guard opening doors at Crawley, so your probably right

On the 377s the doors are closed by the guard, yes, but I'd always assumed that the doors are manually released by the driver but to ensure the train is stopped in the correct place, and for SDO, anything has to be "authorised" by GPS.

The only time I've used a 377 in 2010 thus far, the doors were operated - or not, because the system didn't work properly! - by the guard. This is the first I've heard of any GPS-opening in the UK.

 

[campainr]

can't wait to have a go on them new trains

Remember when Cl 66s first came out, we were all desperate to see one, and now, we're all sick of them and search in vain for other things.

We'll be bored of them soon enough, and lament the days of proper underground stock... :roll:

 

[90019]

We'll be bored of them soon enough, and lament the days of proper underground stock... :roll:

So what's new?

 

[Fincra5]

The only time I've used a 377 in 2010 thus far, the doors were operated - or not, because the system didn't work properly! - by the guard. This is the first I've heard of any GPS-opening in the UK.

Well at London Victoria the doors do not open as quickly as they do on other stations as the driver needs to tell the GPS system where it is.

 

[ert47]

Remember when Cl 66s first came out, we were all desperate to see one, and now, we're all sick of them and search in vain for other things.

We'll be bored of them soon enough, and lament the days of proper underground stock... :roll:

Aye, that be true.

I tend to like the new things which is why I used to get the Jubilee Line instead of the Northern Line travelling to College years back (London Bridge => Poplar DLR)

The journey was more pleasant even though transferring @ Canary Wharf was a pain.

Mind you, saying that, I used to love getting class 319/456 trains because of the nice seating before the 377's turned up

geez, im shallow XD

No, doors are controlled by the driver, even in the extension on the Jubilee.

Ah, kk. I just thought that it was automatic because some times when the doors are mis-aligned, the driver has to move the train forward a tad before the doors open

 

[Daniel]

Ah, kk. I just thought that it was automatic because some times when the doors are mis-aligned, the driver has to move the train forward a tad before the doors open

No, that's CSDE (correct side door enable). There's only a small zone where a signal on the platform is transmitted to allow the trains to open the doors, (but it's still controlled by the driver). It's mainly to prevent doors being opened on the wrong side or opened outside of platforms.
The only line without this is the Victoria, but it's being brought in with the new trains.

 

[Daimler]

Quite! A sort of Underground Sodde's Law. That's the principal reason that passenger operated doors have fallen out of favour - they've tried it from 1938 and again from 1978 and each time it was abandoned within 10-25 years!

On the Central line when the 1992 Stock was introduced, for example, just having a two-second delay at each station while a passenger worked out that they had to open the doors themselves would lead to a train losing a minute over a typical east-west journey compared to driver operated doors.

I think, although can't be 100% certain, that the plan with S Stock is to operate with the driver opening (not just enabling) all the doors at each station. Because of the air conditioning the doors will be on the same sort of 10-15 autoclose as an Electrostar, and the buttons are purely to be used for a passenger to reopen a door that has autoclosed.


Note from the picture that the first passenger door is slightly narrower than all the rest - a prize for the first person to give the reason!

Would it not be possible to have the driver open all the doors at inner-London stations, but on the Met Uxbridge/Amersham lines have them passenger-opened?