Bedford - Where is it?

[anti-pacer]

Odd question you may think, but I'm listening to the comedian Mark Steel on YouTube who did a show in Bedford. He asked where it is, saying, "Is it Midlands? Not really. Is it South? Not really. Is it East Anglia? Not really".

He has a point. Bedford seems to be in no-mans land. Officially it was transferred from South East England to the East of England region by the government in 1994, however, it don't see it as that. Biggleswade and Sandy maybe, but not Bedford.

Despite being on a similar latitude as Stratford-upon-Avon I don't see it as being in the Midlands. What's more the accent is more Southern than Midlands, but is it really that Southern geographically?

Where would you place it?

 

[Bevan Price]

Along with Rugby, Northampton & Milton Keynes, I would regard it as still being part of South Midlands, but in danger of being sucked into a sort of "Outer London Commuter Land".

 

[yorksrob]

A cracking programme.

Although the one description Mark Steele forgot (and the most important one IMO) was "on the Midland Mainline between London and Leicester".

 

[muddythefish]

Bedford is in the South Midlands I would say, Northampton in the East Midlands; Rugby in the West Midlands.

Milton Keynes is an awful place that doesn't belong anywhere in England.

 

[fowler9]

Bedford is in the South Midlands I would say, Northampton in the East Midlands; Rugby in the West Midlands.

Milton Keynes is an awful place that doesn't belong anywhere in England.

Harsh. Ha ha. Bedford I would always think of as a London commuter town and thus the south east. Purely a personal opinion and nothing against anyone from there.

 

[anti-pacer]

Along with Rugby, Northampton & Milton Keynes, I would regard it as still being part of South Midlands, but in danger of being sucked into a sort of "Outer London Commuter Land".

Bedford is in the South Midlands I would say, Northampton in the East Midlands; Rugby in the West Midlands.

Milton Keynes is an awful place that doesn't belong anywhere in England.

I don't get this "South Midlands" thing. When Central TV South was around, their studios were in Abingdon, which is as far south as parts of London. Hardly "Midlands" in any shape or form.

Bedford and MK accents are both "Southern" sounding, so I guess both are Southern to me (only just). Look at Chesterfield. East Midlands, but further north than a lot of Cheshire, which is the North West. Cheshire to me, geographically is Midlands, or certainly anywhere south of the Mersey, but culturally Northern.

 

[fowler9]

I don't get this "South Midlands" thing. When Central TV South was around, their studios were in Abingdon, which is as far south as parts of London. Hardly "Midlands" in any shape or form.

Bedford and MK accents are both "Southern" sounding, so I guess both are Southern to me (only just). Look at Chesterfield. East Midlands, but further north than a lot of Cheshire, which is the North West. Cheshire to me, geographically is Midlands, or certainly anywhere south of the Mersey, but culturally Northern.

Geographically Cheshire is probably the midlands given how far north (Or south) it is but I would say it is Northern. Its biggest town is Warrington and I don't think many would refer to it as being in the Midlands.

 

[anti-pacer]

Geographically Cheshire is probably the midlands given how far north (Or south) it is but I would say it is Northern. Its biggest town is Warrington and I don't think many would refer to it as being in the Midlands.

Like I said, it's geographically Midlands, but culturally Northern.

 

[edwin_m]

Going by the other thread, DfT and the train operators are trying their best to sever any links between Bedford and the Midlands and capture it for the South East.

 

[AM9]

Bedford is in the South Midlands I would say, Northampton in the East Midlands; Rugby in the West Midlands.

Milton Keynes is an awful place that doesn't belong anywhere in England.

How can Bedford be in the South Midlands and Northampton in the East Midlands when Northampton is about 30Km west of Bedford? Bedford is in Eastern England these days, - it's only 10Km due west of Sandy which is never considered anywhere but the East. The fact that the MML passes through Bedford doesn't make it in the Midlands.

 

[roversfan2001]

This'll end up turning into another "where does the north end and south begin" thread no doubt, but with my limited knowledge of that area of the country I'd say Bedford is more of a South East place, mainly due to this..

Bedford I would always think of as a London commuter town and thus the south east. Purely a personal opinion and nothing against anyone from there.

 

[anti-pacer]

This'll end up turning into another "where does the north end and south begin" thread no doubt, but with my limited knowledge of that area of the country I'd say Bedford is more of a South East place, mainly due to this..

The North ends where the Midlands start, and the South begins where the Midlands ends.

Don't forget the Midlanders. They are always in our hearts (of England).

 

[DarloRich]

Bedford - Where is it?

just along from me

 

[anti-pacer]

just along from me

Well I know that DarloRich but do you class it as Southern, Midlands, East?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Milton Keynes is an awful place that doesn't belong anywhere in England.

Have you been here?

The centre is a bit rubbish, but so many of them are anyway. The rest of it is lovely - green, open spaces, low density housing - and you can drive from one side to the other in the rush hour in 15 minutes if that.

FWIW I usually use the NSE definition of the South East (minus some of the extremes, e.g. Weymouth is definitely not). To me it's about where a place associates. Going up the WCML, Rugby is the first place that doesn't associate to London any more than anywhere else in the Midlands does, arguably more to Birmingham. Northampton and Long Buckby associate to London and there are plenty of commuters.

 

[DarloRich]

Bedford is in the South Midlands I would say, Northampton in the East Midlands; Rugby in the West Midlands.

Milton Keynes is an awful place that doesn't belong anywhere in England.

what utter rot.

Well I know that DarloRich but do you class it as Southern, Midlands, East?

southern

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Look at Chesterfield. East Midlands, but further north than a lot of Cheshire, which is the North West. Cheshire to me, geographically is Midlands, or certainly anywhere south of the Mersey, but culturally Northern.

Chesterfield is in the North, people there associate themselves far more with Sheffield than they do with Derby. Similarly Buxton is most definitely in the North West regardless of being in Derbyshire. "Border" towns are places like Matlock (East Midlands or North) or Worksop (East Midlands or Eastern or even North!).

West of the Pennines the Midlands becomes the North West just north of the Potteries though I'm never sure where that leaves Kidsgrove.

 

[eastdyke]

Chesterfield is in the North, people there associate themselves far more with Sheffield than they do with Derby. Similarly Buxton is most definitely in the North West regardless of being in Derbyshire. "Border" towns are places like Matlock (East Midlands or North) or Worksop (East Midlands or Eastern or even North!).
West of the Pennines the Midlands becomes the North West just north of the Potteries though I'm never sure where that leaves Kidsgrove.

I think that Chesterfield is an either/or. But it's Sheffield really at the margin?
Had a great week in Chesterfield back in the day - and you know what, I simply didn't care about north or south!

 

[anti-pacer]

Chesterfield is in the North, people there associate themselves far more with Sheffield than they do with Derby. Similarly Buxton is most definitely in the North West regardless of being in Derbyshire. "Border" towns are places like Matlock (East Midlands or North) or Worksop (East Midlands or Eastern or even North!).

West of the Pennines the Midlands becomes the North West just north of the Potteries though I'm never sure where that leaves Kidsgrove.

Ignoring government defined regions, I would say Chesterfield and Worksop are in the East Midlands, Buxton (unreserved on that one), Glossop is North West, Kidsgrove is West Midlands (region not county).

By your definition, Worksop being East Midlands, Chesterfield being in the North, well Worksop is actually marginally north of Chesterfield so not sure how that works.

It matters not a jot that Chesterfield identifies more with Sheffield than Derby. Gretna identifies more with Carlisle than Dumfries, but it's still in Scotland. Northallerton identifies more with Darlington/Teesside than York, but it's still in the Yorkshire region.

 

[Abpj17]

tv-wise it is east;

it’s not really north - nor is bedfordshire a home county (doesn’t touch London)

it’s not really south, but nor is is midlands (even more not the case for south beds/luton which itself is more prone to being cast as london commuter land - because it is)

everyone knows the north begins at watford gap. so by definition bedford, milton keynes and luton are absolutely all south

 

[anti-pacer]

tv-wise it is east;

it’s not really north - nor is bedfordshire a home county (doesn’t touch London)

it’s not really south, but nor is is midlands (even more not the case for south beds/luton which itself is more prone to being cast as london commuter land - because it is)

everyone knows the north begins at watford gap. so by definition bedford, milton keynes and luton are absolutely all south

The only people who believe the North starts at Watford Gap are people who deny the existence of two very large regions that man up the Midlands.

 

[anti-pacer]

Or even "make up" the Midlands.

 

[Groningen]

The only thing i know about Bedford is that there is a train from Brighton to Bedford.

 

[Howardh]

what utter rot.

I had so spend a weekend in Milton Keynes for a hockey festival and whilst the surrounding countryside is lovely, the town (city?) makes your heart sink. Sounds more like a comedian or a university lecturer! How people can live there I don't know, and I complain daily about run-down, derelict, zombied-out Bolton but even that wins hands-down! Sorry MKers and all that, but I like places with a bit of history.

Then there's Skelmersdale.... oh my....

 

[DarloRich]

I had so spend a weekend in Milton Keynes for a hockey festival and whilst the surrounding countryside is lovely, the town (city?) makes your heart sink. How people can live there I don't know, and I complain daily about run-down, derelict, zombied-out Bolton but even that wins hands-down! Sorry MKers and all that, but I like places with a bit of history.

Oh sorry. For a town with no history:

• The Enigma code ( and others like Lorenz) were broken in the history less MK at Bletchley Park
• Blethcley park where the the world's first programmable, electronic, digital computer (Colossus) was developed, built and operated
• Watling Street runs through it and was home to several roman settlements ( One being my own home village where the oldest gold coin in Britain was found)
• Perhaps the largest hoard of Bronze Age jewellery ever found in Britain was discovered there
• Anglo saxon cemeteries and settlements have been found
• Market towns existed here since the 12th century ( Stony and Fenny Stratfords)
• that a benedictine priory was founded in the 11th century (Bradwell Abbey)
• that it was on the main stagecoach routes of the 18th century ( A cock and bull story and all that)
• that the grand union canal ran through the town
• that Wolverton railway works have existed since the 1840's.

Not bad for no history!

 

[John Webb]

For museum purposes, both Beds and Herts are counted as part of the East Anglia area. Not quite certain why Herts, as a 'Home County' is included - possibly to ensure that the "South East" isn't too large a region, perhaps?
Bedfordshire does have links to the East Anglia area, mainly via the Great Ouse, which has been used for transport for many hundreds of years. That may explain it's inclusion?

 

[Hornet]

Oh sorry. For a town with no history:

• The Enigma code ( and others like Lorenz) were broken in the history less MK at Bletchley Park
• Blethcley park where the the world's first programmable, electronic, digital computer (Colossus) was developed, built and operated
• Watling Street runs through it and was home to several roman settlements ( One being my own home village where the oldest gold coin in Britain was found)
• Perhaps the largest hoard of Bronze Age jewellery ever found in Britain was discovered there
• Anglo saxon cemeteries and settlements have been found
• Market towns existed here since the 12th century ( Stony and Fenny Stratfords)
• that a benedictine priory was founded in the 11th century (Bradwell Abbey)
• that it was on the main stagecoach routes of the 18th century ( A cock and bull story and all that)
• that the grand union canal ran through the town
• that Wolverton railway works have existed since the 1840's.

Not bad for no history!

Milton Keynes didn't exist when I was a lad, so it's history only extends back to the early 70's.

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/44233/page/827

 

[DarloRich]

Milton Keynes didn't exist when I was a lad, so it's history only extends back to the early 70's.

Well, technically, it did. Milton Keynes village has existed since about the 11th century. In any event even if your point were true the "new" MK began construction in the late 60's after a germination period dating back to the 50's.

 

[Howardh]

There was a hamlet called Milton Keynes IIRC and in the early 70's we spent a lot of time caravanning around there, staying around Newport Pagnell. No matter how many broke codes in a farm outbuilding there, it's wanton destruction of lovely countryside, and the above post of all the history around proves it!! Good bus service though. Meanwhile https://news.files.bbci.co.uk/vj/li...iltonkeynessign/GettyImages-3364646_6oa9t.jpg (link to sign of MK in the old days). Happily Stony Stratford's interior still remains.

 

[Bromley boy]

settlements ( One being my own home village where the oldest gold coin in Britain was found)

I thought you were a proud northerner?!