Heathrow expansion.

[jonty14]

Hi. With all the news about this at the moment, there is no mention about the surrounding villages which will be destroyed. No news channel has mentioned it. What will happen to the people who live in the area to be demolished? I feel sorry for them.

 

[me123]

BBC news have been covering it. Here's an article dedicated to the local villages that will bear the brunt.

 

[AlterEgo]

This will mean the end of the Worst Hotel In The World, the Heathrow Lodge, in Longford.

While I won't shed a tear for that, the villages that will be lost are surprisingly pleasant.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Those affected will receive the value of their house plus 25% on top and will also have their stamp duty paid. In all honesty I really don't know why they are moaning.

And for what it's worth I live directly under one of the flight paths and will be worse off but I appreciate the need to look at the bigger picture. Not only that but my local MP Zac Goldsmith is going to resign on the back of the decision which I think is great news as I can't stand him!

 

[bnm]

Those affected will receive the value of their house plus 25% on top and will also have their stamp duty paid. In all honesty I really don't know why they are moaning.

The sort of response which highlights the cost of everything but the value of nothing.

It's a huge upheaval being forced to moved when you don't want to. Many would have put their life into their home, their family, their community. No amount of compensation can recompense that.

They have a god damn right to moan. And more. Direct action is wholly warranted.

While we're on the subject of compensation, how much will there be for those who don't need to move but will have their lives blighted by the new runway?

 

[northwichcat]

Not only that but my local MP Zac Goldsmith is going to resign on the back of the decision which I think is great news as I can't stand him!

He's resigned as a Conservative MP but he's going to stand as an Independent in a by-election.

 

[me123]

Those affected will receive the value of their house plus 25% on top and will also have their stamp duty paid. In all honesty I really don't know why they are moaning.

It's easy for someone like me to just up sticks and leave. I lead a rather nomadic lifestyle, and don't have ties that are so significant that I wouldn't be happy just to take the money and move. But a lot of the people affected have been settled in the area sometimes for generations. The community they've moved into will be forcibly dispersed. And I do feel a great deal of sympathy for them.

Out of curiosity, I wonder how much the "unaffected value of the property" will be? With the threat of a third runway for many years now, the homes affected have undoubtedly already been quite significantly devalued for some time which could ultimately affect the cash they receive. Even with 25% compensation, I'm not sure the residents will be able to find a similar quality of home with the same proximity to London.

 

[AlterEgo]

He's resigned as a Conservative MP but he's going to stand as an Independent in a by-election.

He will also probably get in.

 

[90sWereBetter]

Apparently the Tories will not stand a candidate in the by-election, meaning it's a straight fight between Goldsmith and the Lib Dems. It's gonna be interesting.

Also, if Goldsmith gets back in, that'll set a precedent for Tory backbenchers that they can rebel against the government, resign, and get re-elected as an independent, with the understanding that there won't be a official Tory candidate in their by-election. I think the Tories might have shot themselves in the foot here.

 

[RichmondCommu]

The sort of response which highlights the cost of everything but the value of nothing.

It's a huge upheaval being forced to moved when you don't want to. Many would have put their life into their home, their family, their community. No amount of compensation can recompense that.

They have a god damn right to moan. And more. Direct action is wholly warranted.

So why set up home next to Heathrow in the first place? The world and his dog knew that sooner or later there would be a third runway at Heathrow.
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He's resigned as a Conservative MP but he's going to stand as an Independent in a by-election.

Yes he is but I'm not convinced that he'll win. He's annoyed a lot of people, including my wife and I!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Apparently the Tories will not stand a candidate in the by-election, meaning it's a straight fight between Goldsmith and the Lib Dems. It's gonna be interesting.

Also, if Goldsmith gets back in, that'll set a precedent for Tory backbenchers that they can rebel against the government, resign, and get re-elected as an independent, with the understanding that there won't be a official Tory candidate in their by-election. I think the Tories might have shot themselves in the foot here.

I concur.
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While we're on the subject of compensation, how much will there be for those who don't need to move but will have their lives blighted by the new runway?

As I've already mentioned my wife and I will be worse off because of the third runway but I'm able to accept that its necessary for both Heathrow and the SE as a whole to continue to prosper.

 

[bnm]

As I've already mentioned my wife and I will be worse off because of the third runway but I'm able to accept that its necessary for both Heathrow and the SE as a whole to continue to prosper.

There's the rub. Your worse off so others have to be too.

My heart bleeds for the folk in the south east. You really have it tough. :roll:

 

[RichmondCommu]

There's the rub. Your worse off so others have to be too.

My point is that people need to understand the reasons behind the decision. The very fact that the highly polluting "stack" will likely be eliminated is a big enough reason to accept the third runway.
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T
My heart bleeds for the folk in the south east. You really have it tough. :roll:

I would argue that we don't. In fact we need to invest more in the East Midlands and the North but the fact is the SE needs airport expansion.

 

[backontrack]

I feel so callous for saying this. Many people's lives will be horrible affected, not to mention wildlife, the environment...the Heathrow area already breaches EU air pollution limits. It's all horrible.

But, a question: what happens to Longford station now?
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Turns out I was thinking of Longcross.

 

[Busaholic]

Goldsmith could lose an election twice within a few months. Lady Bracknell would have had something to say about that, and Lady Annabel may have something to say too.

Goldsmith, bigging himself up as usual, says it 'will be a referendum on Heathrow expansion'. Well, yes, if you accept the referendum only applies to Richmond Park residents, in which case, great news, we voted to remain in the EEC!

 

[Grimsby town]

Apparently the Tories will not stand a candidate in the by-election, meaning it's a straight fight between Goldsmith and the Lib Dems. It's gonna be interesting.

Also, if Goldsmith gets back in, that'll set a precedent for Tory backbenchers that they can rebel against the government, resign, and get re-elected as an independent, with the understanding that there won't be a official Tory candidate in their by-election. I think the Tories might have shot themselves in the foot here.

If they stand a candidate though it's likely they'll split the vote meaning there's a good chance the Lib Dems will win. Perhaps they are worried that'll give the Lib Dems moment and perhaps even boost the anti Brexit movement. I think they are in trouble either way though to be honest.

 

[northwichcat]

If they stand a candidate though it's likely they'll split the vote meaning there's a good chance the Lib Dems will win. Perhaps they are worried that'll give the Lib Dems moment and perhaps even boost the anti Brexit movement. I think they are in trouble either way though to be honest.

I imagine their thinking is while Goldsmith doesn't agree with them on Heathrow, he is more likely to vote for Conservative policies on the opposition benches than a replacement Lib Dem MP would and with the Conservatives having a wafer thin majority that extra vote might make the difference.

With the Lib Dems I think they have a difficult decision as to whether to use a candidate they used in the area before, to use someone more high profile or to use a fresh face.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Those affected will receive the value of their house plus 25% on top and will also have their stamp duty paid. In all honesty I really don't know why they are moaning.

Because they are getting booted out of their house to make the Spanish owners of Heathrow Airport and the Spanish owners of British Airways richer?

There shouldn't be a Compulsory Purchase Order made. HAL should have to pay whatever the owners want to sell their house, like in the old days. That would be interesting, wouldn't it.

My view, as I've said on the aviation thread, is that Heathrow is the wrong choice for expansion and that the main justification for expansion doesn't make sense. South east expansion can be delivered at Stansted and Gatwick- if you're going to London it doesn't matter which airport you use, they're all 30-45 minutes from central London- and regional expansion can be delivered at Manchester and Edinburgh or Glasgow. Gatwick's second runway should have come way before Heathrow.

 

[ivanhoe]

I just don't see this runway being built. Legal challenges, the M25 tunnels( there's no way they can close the motorway for any great periods) and a growing awareness that there maybe more people who will suffer from the pollution of an increased capacity at Heathrow.

How much traffic could realistically be relocated from Heathrow to Gatwick?
although Gatwick has been connected by rail for many years, is it fit for purpose for an expansion in numbers without greater tax payer investment in both the motorway and rail infrastructure?
Is the best option to build a brand new airport, thus releasing vast swathes of land for housing development in the future?

Living in the East Midlands, my air travel needs are met by EMA, BHX and occasionally MAN.
It would be useful to hear from members who frequently use Heathrow or live either under or close to flight paths?

 

[DynamicSpirit]

My point is that people need to understand the reasons behind the decision. The very fact that the highly polluting "stack" will likely be eliminated is a big enough reason to accept the third runway.

Permanently? Or will Heathrow simply fill up the 3rd runway until after a couple of years, the polluting stack is back, but this time with 50% more planes?

 

[edwin_m]

BBC is now suggesting the new runway could include a gentle ramp so it bridges over the M25 instead of re-routeing it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37773052

Chris Grayling said this would be "cheaper and quicker" than building a tunnel for the M25 under the new runway and would cause less disruption for drivers during construction.

He said many other airports around the world had built runways over motorways.

There would be "a very gentle hill up which the planes would take off".

 

[47802]

I bit like an on land aircraft carrier


Now I not an aviation expert at all but wouldn't a sloping runway be less than ideal for landing so does these mean they will only use this runway for take off's?

 

[Howardh]

I bit like an on land aircraft carrier


Now I not an aviation expert at all but wouldn't a sloping runway be less than ideal for landing so does these mean they will only use this runway for take off's?

Many airport runways slope - in fact, how many are dead level? If the angle's 2 or 3 degrees from start to finish, shouldn't be a problem?

I notice that it takes around 2.5hrs if anyone wants to get to Euston from Manchester Airport involving a change. Surely it could take some of the pressure off Heathrow if pax could fly to Ringway, walk to the station and get a direct train from there to London - a Virgin could do it in 1hr 50 (or less)?

Even better if/when HS2 starts?

 

[AlterEgo]

I bit like an on land aircraft carrier


Now I not an aviation expert at all but wouldn't a sloping runway be less than ideal for landing so does these mean they will only use this runway for take off's?

There are lots of sloping runways. Jersey, Newcastle, Leeds-Bradford are just three I know of which have sloping runways.

Here's Leeds-Bradford's: https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7158/6539713653_979dc7e536_b.jpg

Newcastle: http://www.lebanontimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/d3c9a083289_964x4741.jpg

Jersey Teletubby Land Airport: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7b/PAPI_Jersey_Airport.JPG

Luxembourg: http://code7700.com/images/ellx_rwy_06.jpg

 

[Tetchytyke]

BBC is now suggesting the new runway could include a gentle ramp

No need to bulldoze Harmondsworth after all

 

[AM9]

Many airport runways slope - in fact, how many are dead level? If the angle's 2 or 3 degrees from start to finish, shouldn't be a problem?

Three degrees is the standard glide path so hitting a runway that rises at three degrees would be difficult and possibly hazardous as a regular event. Exceptionally, very short runways allow steeper approaches for smaller aircraft such as at London City, but to land a long haul vehicle at that angle would be unsustainable, (Emirates has been trying to secure additional intrusions into the Heathrow night curfew by proposing it but the UK ATC has pointed out that the airplanes would need to level out as much as 6 miles before touchdown).

 

[Darandio]

Now I not an aviation expert at all but wouldn't a sloping runway be less than ideal for landing so does these mean they will only use this runway for take off's?

Can't imagine it's ideal, but if they can do it at Courchevel........

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/38/Courchevel_aeroport.jpg

 

[306024]

No need to bulldoze Harmondsworth after all

Thunderbirds 1 and 3 wouldn't need a runway at all. Perhaps we should redesign aircraft instead

Do we have to wait for Boris to lay down in front of a bulldozer before construction can begin? His comments in future should be entertaining if nothing else.

 

[Mag_seven]

The new runway could just cross the M25 on the level and have a large set of level crossing barriers come down every time a plane was due.

 

[deltic]

I just don't see this runway being built. Legal challenges, the M25 tunnels( there's no way they can close the motorway for any great periods) and a growing awareness that there maybe more people who will suffer from the pollution of an increased capacity at Heathrow.

How much traffic could realistically be relocated from Heathrow to Gatwick?
although Gatwick has been connected by rail for many years, is it fit for purpose for an expansion in numbers without greater tax payer investment in both the motorway and rail infrastructure?
Is the best option to build a brand new airport, thus releasing vast swathes of land for housing development in the future?

Living in the East Midlands, my air travel needs are met by EMA, BHX and occasionally MAN.
It would be useful to hear from members who frequently use Heathrow or live either under or close to flight paths?

I live under the Heathrow and City Airport flight paths! Expansion is a mixed blessing - more aircraft but supposedly greater restriction on night time flights with those 5am arrivals put back an hour.

Knowing people who worked on some of the background studies the view was that the big decisions were bottled.

The long term decision should have been to go for a 4 and eventually 6 runway airport in the Thames estuary - yes there are some issues with it but they could be overcome and would have given London and south east a long term (100yr plus) solution. Heathrow is closed and becomes a new London borough providing around 100,000 homes going someway to meet the housing crisis. City airport would also go again freeing up land for housing and development. Stansted would go and be converted into either a new garden city or returned to agricultre.

Having dropped the estuary idea they should have said yes to both Heathrow and Gatwick. This would have led to real competition in terms of raising funds and delivering in shortest possible time. If one turned out not to be affordable or subject to legal delay the risk is reduced of not having any airport. If both went ahead then there would be greater competition between airports forcing down prices and improving services.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

The new runway could just cross the M25 on the level and have a large set of level crossing barriers come down every time a plane was due.

Wouldn't it be cheaper to just have the planes take off and land along the M25? I'm sure it's long enough

And traffic moves so slowly on that bit of the M25 anyway that I'm sure none of the motorists would particularly notice extra the interruptions to traffic