People allowed in the cab

[AlterEgo]

I'd like to hope most drivers would be able to maintain concentration with somebody else in the cab. Seems a shame that interpretations of hse rules forbid entry in most cases

Have a look at historic railway accident reports and come back and tell me how many accidents have a cause listed of "unauthorised person in the cab".

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Freight crew changes happen away from stations so no need to carry the relief Driver around, they will turn up in a van.

That's not always the case, I think.

I often see changes happen on Newport station and just this morning I saw one happen on platform six at Cardiff Central.

Many years ago, I visited Millerhill Yard and walked around the shed at one end. I knew that I had to get to the other end for the second shed, and asked someone what the safe way to do so was.

He was a driver, and said ... "Well, I'm driving this up there now, so do you want a lift?" It was a Class 40, and my answer, needless to say, was "Yes, please!" ... so off we went!

When we got to the other end, I did what I needed to do, and someone (possibly the same chap) then arranged for me to go into Waverley station on the crew bus!

 

[Harbornite]

That's not always the case, I think.

I often see changes happen on Newport station and just this morning I saw one happen on platform six at Cardiff Central.

The also occur quite regularly at Tyseley, it's usually the Eastleigh- Mountsorrel ballast.

 

[cambsy]

I have had cab rides in the past, the most notable being Holyhead-Chester on a non stop relief train in late 80's on a 47'8, we were speeding all the way,had 99mph on Anglesey and most of the way 90 mph, limit was 75 mph, let me blow horn, got into Chester about 20 mins early, had ride in back cab of 158 when first used from Manchester to Glasgow and Edinburgh, had 1st class and was regional airways, was overnight train to Edinburgh, played with destination blind, coming up with all sort of silly destinations, Perth to Glasgow in DBSO on a push pull set, with 47'7 propelling, a 31 from Ely to March, back cab ride DVT 225 set from Edinburgh to Glasgow.

How would one find out about getting a cab ride with all the correct things in place, say London-Glasgow in a Pendolino?.

 

[Cowley]

Out of curiosity, if you were to walk up to say a Pendolino driver at Euston who was waiting to leave but had plenty of time and you asked if you and your child who was with you if you could have a quick look in the cab would that be completely disallowed now?

 

[notadriver]

The driver might say no. Is that allowed or is it bad customer service ?


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[Cowley]

The driver might say no. Is that allowed or is it bad customer service ?


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I'm not saying they should, was just wondering if they're allowed.

 

[broadgage]

I have had a few cab rides years ago but as many others have posted things are much stricter these days and unofficial cab rides are virtually unknown.

Relatively recently I travelled in the rear cab of a grossly overcrowded HST, together with an off duty driver. This was with the permission of a manager.
No Pullman service in the cab though.

 

[trainmania100]

Are the rules more relaxed for a cab ride in the back cab where the driver is not going to be disturbed?

 

[notadriver]

Back cabs are off limits.


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[ComUtoR]

Have a look at historic railway accident reports and come back and tell me how many accidents have a cause listed of "unauthorised person in the cab".

I can tell you of at least 2 incidents this year alone.

 

[driver9000]

That's not always the case, I think.

I often see changes happen on Newport station and just this morning I saw one happen on platform six at Cardiff Central.

Many years ago, I visited Millerhill Yard and walked around the shed at one end. I knew that I had to get to the other end for the second shed, and asked someone what the safe way to do so was.

He was a driver, and said ... "Well, I'm driving this up there now, so do you want a lift?" It was a Class 40, and my answer, needless to say, was "Yes, please!" ... so off we went!

When we got to the other end, I did what I needed to do, and someone (possibly the same chap) then arranged for me to go into Waverley station on the crew bus!

Sorry, I missed a crucial word out....meant to say they can happen away from stations.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Are the rules more relaxed for a cab ride in the back cab where the driver is not going to be disturbed?

All driving cabs are private unless you have authority to be in one.

 

[Huntergreed]

Back cabs are off limits

Train guards use them all the time. Surely riding from the back cab is of no danger as the rider would not have the train key.

 

[notadriver]

Train guards use them all the time. Surely riding from the back cab is of no danger as the rider would not have the train key.

Train guards are safety critical staff and traction trained on that particular stock.


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[Monty]

Train guards use them all the time. Surely riding from the back cab is of no danger as the rider would not have the train key.

The emergency brake can be applied from this location and that's just for starters. No unsolicited cab rides front, middle or rear period. You may be able to arrange one through senior management as others have already indicated. Other than that no means no.

 

[Rich McLean]

For me, no pass = no ride, regardless of position in the company or no matter how important the VIP. However, for example, on a particularity foggy day or during a particularly bad day of low adhesion where I will need as minimal distractions as possible in order to safely drive the train, I will and have refused those with cab passes to be in the cab on those occasions, but that is rare.

Drivers travelling pass on duty are allowed to travel in the cab, but it is not encouraged. More often than not they will travel in the rear cab (if the train is wedged) or in the passenger accomodation.

 

[physics34]

Had a strange request a few years ago.......

A man (suited) came to my cab at London Bridge and asked if he could cab ride with me to New Cross Gate... this was on a weekday lunchtime....

I asked him for a ID and his cab pass, which he didnt have.....but then he continued to ask to come in the cab... almost begging. Obviosuly i didnt let him in. Its was very odd.......

...I recognised him straight away. He was an actor who played DI Skase in the Bill in the 90s....

He boarded the train anyway and got off at New Cross Gate and then proceeded to cross over the footbridge and on to the up platform.

Iam guessing he was a plant, employed by Network Rail or the HSE to see if train drivers check for cab passes.

 

[Gemz91]

For me, no pass = no ride, regardless of position in the company or no matter how important the VIP. However, for example, on a particularity foggy day or during a particularly bad day of low adhesion where I will need as minimal distractions as possible in order to safely drive the train, I will and have refused those with cab passes to be in the cab on those occasions, but that is rare.

Drivers travelling pass on duty are allowed to travel in the cab, but it is not encouraged. More often than not they will travel in the rear cab (if the train is wedged) or in the passenger accomodation.

Drivers at my TOC aren't permitted to travel pass in the leading cab even if they are on duty. You are only allowed to travel in the front cab if it is in direct line of your duties (driving, route learning, route conducting, inspecting the line and so on).

 

[Rich McLean]

Drivers at my TOC aren't permitted to travel pass in the leading cab even if they are on duty. You are only allowed to travel in the front cab if it is in direct line of your duties (driving, route learning, route conducting, inspecting the line and so on).

Different rules for different TOC's. However, it's allowed if circumstances dictate (travelling back via diversionary route so useful for route knowledge retention), but its not encouraged and frowned upon. Most of the time its inside the train, but if busy they travel in the back cab and use the cab to cab to let us know they are there.

 

[dgl]

Been in the cab of a 159 in the early 90's when I was a kid somewhere between Crewkerne and Honiton, even got to toot the horn.
But you wouldn't be allowed to do that now and I fully understand the reasons why


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[E&W Lucas]

I'd like to hope most drivers would be able to maintain concentration with somebody else in the cab. Seems a shame that interpretations of hse rules forbid entry in most cases

A post which shows exactly why some people should not be allowed anywhere near machinery.
Some other posts from the OP are quoted above, but seem to have been removed. If anyone is in any doubt as to the consequences of overloading the driver of a steam loco, dig out the details of the fatal accident involving a member of footplate crew in the early 1990s (MHR I think it was).

 

[richieb1971]

Lots of videos online of people not only riding but talking to the driver non stop.

 

[E&W Lucas]

Out of curiosity, if you were to walk up to say a Pendolino driver at Euston who was waiting to leave but had plenty of time and you asked if you and your child who was with you if you could have a quick look in the cab would that be completely disallowed now?

Can of worms. What happens if you slip on the steps up to the cab?
The issue of child safeguarding too. Never, ever leave yourself alone with another's child, or lift them up, etc.

Mainline railway - it's not an entertainment venue - no one near my cab.
When driving on a preserved railway, i will let kids in the cab, provided that a parent accompanies, does any lifting up and that there is another crew member with me. This is in line with some guidance we were issued with a few years back (written by a retired senior copper).

Worth pointing out that it can be very hard for railway staff to gain cab access when required for work purposes. New qualified drivers, those who've had incidents and anyone ion training aren't allowed to have anyone with them. Can make route learning tricky.

The rule is simple though. Unless there is an operational need for someone to be in a driving cab, there have no business being there. Risk of distraction is significant and acknowledged by all.

 

[ComUtoR]

Lots of videos online of people not only riding but talking to the driver non stop.

Your point ?

 

[Rich McLean]

Lots of videos online of people not only riding but talking to the driver non stop.

The only time conversation is permitted in my cab is when running on plain line under greens and not approaching a station or slowing up for a Junction. A major one is no electronic devices in the cab apart from approved items issued by the TOC and even then not used while on the move. That solves the issue of Go pro videos and the like ending up on Youtube.

Woe and betide any driver caught giving unofficial cab rides published on Youtube, and yes, drivers have been caught this way.

 

[AlterEgo]

The only time conversation is permitted in my cab is when running on plain line under greens and not approaching a station or slowing up for a Junction. A major one is no electronic devices in the cab apart from approved items issued by the TOC and even then not used while on the move. That solves the issue of Go pro videos and the like ending up on Youtube.

Woe and betide any driver caught giving unofficial cab rides published on Youtube, and yes, drivers have been caught this way.

GoPro suction mount solves this, mount it outside the cab.

(Not really, only a fool would risk a good job doing that)

 

[noddingdonkey]

I recall the guard on a 153 that was running vice the usual full and standing 142 closing the back cab door across the driver's side of the cab (as it would be when coupled) and allowing a few passengers to stand in the secondman's side and the middle part where the corridor is. Suspect that wasn't completely legitimate but it did mean everybody got on.

 

[43096]

Absolutely no and strictly not allowed

I guess there may be the possibility that an arranged cab ride might be allowed still, I defer to those currently drivers on that one, if it were arranged beforehand and with a DSM or the like also in attendance

If the rules have changed recently I would be most surprised

I've had cab rides on a couple of occasions over the last few years - always accompanied by a Driver Manager (or Head of Operations on one occasion). These were done with official agreement (at Ops Director level) and for a specific purpose.

TOCs have also auctioned cab rides for their chosen charities, again accompanied by a cab pass holder - at least EMT and GBRf have done this, I believe.

 

[Huntergreed]

I recall the guard on a 153 that was running vice the usual full and standing 142 closing the back cab door across the driver's side of the cab (as it would be when coupled )

I've always wondered if sprinters work in multiple, would you be allowed to sit on the second man's seat, as technically it's in the train saloon

 

[Rich McLean]

I've always wondered if sprinters work in multiple, would you be allowed to sit on the second man's seat, as technically it's in the train saloon

You can't as the outer gangway door locks off the secondman's side when coupled up with another gangway ended unit