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Creation of class 230 DEMUs from ex-LU D78s by Vivarail

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devinier

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You're making a mistake about being dismissive of a "Ford Transit engine".

The unit isn't proposed to be a DMMU - i.e. whereby the engine is driving a gearbox. My understanding is it will be used as a 'generator' to provide electricity to the existing motors, so the engine should be relatively unstressed - and certainly not mechanically stressed as it would be in a DMMU.

+1 ☺

The particular "Transit" engine they are using is already proven in many other areas, it is also probably the best engine (reliability wise) used in Transits. It is one of Fords industrial engines used to power generators, pumps etc.
 
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kieron

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Well we have a provisional specification for the final product, so I don't see what's wrong with brainstorming etc.
We don't have anything like enough information to say how it will perform on any section of railway. Saying it will work somewhere is just as legitimate as saying it won't work there in the absence of actual facts.

Saying that it will work badly somewhere, but might be used there anyway, is also as on topic.
 
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+1 ☺

The particular "Transit" engine they are using is already proven in many other areas, it is also probably the best engine (reliability wise) used in Transits. It is one of Fords industrial engines used to power generators, pumps etc.

also modern 'van ' engines are as powerful if not more so than the 'bus' engines used in th 1st gens
 

FordFocus

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Any word on the capability of coupling to other DMUs or is it going to be a within class unit?
 

GrimsbyPacer

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Any word on the capability of coupling to other DMUs or is it going to be a within class unit?

I haven't heard anything either and would like to know.
If they were to replace Northern or Welsh Pacers they may be compatible with them??
But then whatever they couple with will have to slow down.
So it probably doesn't matter much.
 

Nym

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Any coupler with any kind of depth will need to protrude quite far from the front of the train, something with a gathering horn like the Dellner and Strafenburg (or the newer Wedgelocks for S-Stock, where this isn't yet fitted) if you where to fully deflect the coupler in it's current length the gathering horn gets dangerously close to the sector bar and inner longs. Making it longer changes the dynamic profile of the inter unit position significantly, so it's not likely to have the coupler changed, and even if it did, the control system is very unlikely to talk to other DMUs.

So in a sentence, I highly doubt it.
 
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northwichcat

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One other factor to note is tagging on a Sprinter (even if possible) would limit the top speed of the entire formation and may also prevent the alleged faster acceleration of the D-Train.
 

Chris125

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Would they not need to change, or at least modify, the couplings for the gangways it seems they now intend to fit?
 

Domh245

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Would they not need to change, or at least modify, the couplings for the gangways it seems they now intend to fit?

AFAIK, the gangways are internal (ie car to car) and so no modifications would be needed to be made to the front beyond the current armouring. It would also seem to be the case that installing a front gangway would remove one of the main parts of the new crash structure.

The new gangway is one of the bellow style fitted to most modern units, as detailed here

They've also put the first engine into it's engine module along with a particulate filter, see here
 

Darandio

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May I enquire in what Vivarail document is this image published and what relationship does this image have a Vivarail project

It's part of the latest news article, linked off the Vivarail main page.

http://www.vivarail.co.uk/the-quiet-man-an-interview-with-henry-posner-iii/

Head of a global enterprise, hailed as the saviour of at least two national railways and an Ivy League alumnus … it was more than daunting to sit down for an interview with Henry Posner III and feel I had anything like an intelligent enough question to ask him.

However Henry is not what you might expect from that brief CV, he is frank and open about his methods of business, his beliefs and his failures. He is driven by a desire to innovate, find the most unusual niches and see how to make them work …

In 1995 at the dawn of the privatisation of the UK’s railways Henry was invited over to share his expertise because it was widely believed that the North American model could be replicated here. “It couldn’t for freight” he tells me, “in fact what the UK has done for passenger could instead by exported back to the US. But I learned a lot and met some good people.”

One of whom was Adrian Shooter, and they first worked together when Adrian joined him as Special Advisor on the HamburgKoln Express. This is where one of Henry’s tenets comes into play – finding the people you want to work with. His father gave him a maxim: it is better to be in a bad business with a good partner than vice versa. And that means sticking together through the bad times. An example is the Iowa Interstate Railroad of which Henry’s company now owns 100%. This had become so marginal that at one point the shareholders were digging deep in their own pockets to keep it going – but then came bio-ethanol. Suddenly from loss to profit but only because the team had stuck together through the bad times and been prepared to accept failure.

Henry is not in business for the short haul or quick returns. This is the true American business model, the complete opposite to Wall Street. It is solid and reassuring – Henry doesn’t want to take the easy buck, he wants to find the real value in something. Where others would fight shy of involvement in Europe’s railways, Henry is actively investing in France, Belgium and Germany right now – and still seeking other ventures in what many believe to be a dying market. But somehow he is finding the niches that exist and the profit that lies within them.

And so to Vivarail … “it was a chance to work with Adrian again,” he says, “when he approached me with the D-Train proposal I could see it was a solid opportunity but also a chance to work with some interesting partners. Logically the D-Trains make good commercial sense and we have total belief that Adrian and his team can make them work.”

This quiet man is a risk-taker extraordinaire and who would like to bet against him?
 

CdBrux

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I wonder if there is an outside chance that, should this project not find enough UK customers, then Henry Posner could be thinking about taking a few of them to the US?
 

Rational Plan

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Maybe I miss read it, but the last issue of Modern Rail had something about Great Western getting a few units as part of a trial on it's branch lines, with potential for more. I'm sure it said it had DFT backing.


Then it went on to mention ATW looking at them for Wales.
 

AT300

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Hi all
I'm new to this forum. I joined because I heard yesterday that the Viva Rail D-Stock is going to be trialled on the Plymouth - Gunnislake branch within the next 6 months and I wanted to share it with you.
Cheers
 

Greenback

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Hi all
I'm new to this forum. I joined because I heard yesterday that the Viva Rail D-Stock is going to be trialled on the Plymouth - Gunnislake branch within the next 6 months and I wanted to share it with you.
Cheers

Are you able to share your source for this information? It does seem to tie in with what Rational Plan said about Modern Railways
 

Blindtraveler

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*Rubs Hands together and thanks lucky stars I didnt get that ALR done in June after all*

They are going to need a good grunt to get them up there arnt they? The idea is great and I hope all 70 or however many units get built, that will certainly help stock shortages.
 

RPI

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Would have thought Looe would be better, being self contained away from the main line
 

Harpers Tate

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Possibly, but given their origin, I'd have to guess they are actually quite curve-capable.
 

Greenback

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I was thinking that, but the Liskeard curve does appear to be somewhat unique, at least on the National Rail network!
 

edwin_m

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There are some pretty tight curves around Calstock too.

Assuming the 2-car version of the D78 is chosen, I think this has 50% axles motored with electric transmission so probably more sure-footed than a 153.
 
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