Passengers access intermediate cab via open door and take 'selfies'

[furlong]

I actually don't think the person who notified staff and took some photos for fun did anything wrong.

Apart from breaking one of the railway byelaws?

Arrests are not unknown for this sort of thing - you'd expect a stern warning about foolish behaviour if not prosecution or cautions.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Really not much you can do in the cab with no key on... as people said, the Emergency Brake, change the lights, fiddle with the aircon, play with the wipers and hit the emergency stop button.

Trip circuit breakers...though the "interesting" ones tend to be sealed.

 

[Nym]

At least them circuit brakers are in the cab, unlike some fleets...

 

[BestWestern]

Nobody unauthorised should be able to access a cab, end of. Had this been a yobbo type on a saturday rather than a *reasonably* sensible member of the concerned travelling public, there are plenty of things that could be fiddled with that would cause significant issues and expensive delays at least. Knock out all the circuit breakers, hit the GSMR 'red button', etc etc; all very amusing and all guaranteed to cause a very substantial delay at very substantial cost to the ToC. There's also the point that members of the public need to respect the security of the railway, and that access rules and such are for real and not 'Mickey Mouse'. This sort of incident does little to reinforce that message.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Trip circuit breakers...though the "interesting" ones tend to be sealed.

The worst that is going to do is turn off the aircon or stop the train, though.

 

[jonty14]

Anecdote time: at a certain large university in London, there was an increasing problem with people leaving their laptops unattended briefly in the library (to go to the toilet or get coffee, etc.) only for them to be stolen.

The university's solution was for librarians to carry little business cards around with them, saying "next time it could be a thief!" Were they to see an unattended laptop as they went round the library on their duties, they would place one of these cards on top. The number of people leaving their laptops unattended dropped significantly after this policy was brought in.

Perhaps this is why the gentleman in question chose to take photographs of himself (an unauthorised member of the public) in the cab. If he'd just closed the door, no-one would have even known it was open in the first place. Now it has been reported, one hopes Southeastern's train crew will be more diligent about making sure the doors are locked properly.

True, he may not have been able to crash the train, but he could have stopped the train and caused significant disruption from the middle cab. And I'd definitely call that a security risk that needs reporting.

Well said

 

[ComUtoR]

The worst thing that I can see happening is that the passenger can exit the train whilst it is moving.

As BestWestern states you can hit the GSMR and cause huge disruption.

 

[Antman]

Hopefully a knock at his door by the transport police today for unauthorised access to the cab - what's the fine ?

Nothing probably as I doubt if the CPS would deem it to be in the public interest to prosecute somebody for highlighting security flaws, well that's how it would be seen

 

[jon0844]

Apart from breaking one of the railway byelaws?

Arrests are not unknown for this sort of thing - you'd expect a stern warning about foolish behaviour if not prosecution or cautions.

I'd expect someone to get a telling off, but doubt anyone would take action. Crikey, we let people off for a lot worse these days.

 

[ASharpe]

hit the GSMR 'red button'

Do the cab radios not need to be registered on the network for that to work?

 

[LowLevel]

They need to be switched on, which you probably won't be able to do unless you know what you're doing, it's not obvious.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

According to the Fail article, all cabs need to be locked "following the Madrid train bombings"... That would be bombings that took place in passenger areas, with absolutely no elements of hijack or sabotage then? :roll:

 

[Mintona]

Do the cab radios not need to be registered on the network for that to work?

No. Unless the GSMR MCB is tripped out the red button is live at all times. The rest of the radio only works if the train is keyed in.

The slightly silly thing about the whole story is that the cab (of a 376) is easily accessible to absolutely anyone with no keys at all required anyway.

 

[me123]

What a pair of idiots. What does this achieve? I'm no expert, but it's quite clear that no-one could have realistically done much in the cab. Yes, it should have been closed, but it's not going to make a huge difference to anything that it was open. He clearly knows that he should not have been in there, and yet he was. I'm in agreement with "furlong" and various other posters - charge them with trespass (although it clearly won't happen, as you'd have to fight the DM which isn't really worth the effort in this case).

And, FWIW, this has to be one of the worst selfies I've ever seen:

Unusually, I find myself agreeing with the commentards on the DM website:

Of course the door was wide open. I believe you. By the way, what part of "No Entry" do you not understand?

It's quite sad that young people nowadays would probably call this "investigative journalism". :roll:

 

[physics34]

the worse thing he probably couldve done would be to press the red button on the GSMR and cause alot of chaos...

Or he couldve caused an emergency brake application.

 

[me123]

Kind of wish he had pushed the emergency brake. Then he'd actually be in trouble rather than presenting himself as the hero of the hour.

 

[Tom B]

Alright, he's a bit of a prat.

But I'd assume that the TOC in question (and probably many others) are going to make sure their staff are aware of the problem and that doors are to be kept locked, and probably have maintenance check all the locks on their rounds to boot.

If he hadn't made a fuss, the attendant at London Bridge would have shut and locked the door, and that'd have been the end of it.

I saw a guard's panel on a 225 open a couple of years ago. The only person who I could find, a trolley dolly, was uninterested. I locked it with the multi-tool I have on my keyring!

 

[Muzer]

It's quite sad that young people nowadays would probably call this "investigative journalism". :roll:

People have always moaned at young people for being less intelligent than their generation. You can find quotes from Ancient Greece that say pretty much the same things, about how modern technology and conveniences are making the youth of the day stupid. Given the number of older people who read the Daily Mail, I suspect there are just as many likely to do so in your generation as there are in ours

(The only reason there might not be is that people in your generation have had more time to kill themselves with their own stupidity. Not sure how much this would affect the figures, but I'd assume not much...)

 

[jon0844]

I don't think people are less intelligent, but it's certainly easier to get by without taxing your brain.

I now look up loads of things on Wikipedia, or a Google search, and it's downright lazy as often I know things but feel I have to double check (and verify against potentially incorrect or misleading sources).

And social media is a pretty lousy way to get news. Sure, when there's a big disaster it's a great way to get photos/video at the scene, but for proper detailed information? Very, very hit and miss.

Who knows if there will still be traditional newspaper and qualified investigative journalists in 10 or 20 years from now. Where will the funding come from if people expect everything for free?

Will Unilever and the like fund this sort of thing?

As it is, the mainstream media relies a lot on social media and people doing this sort of thing (just look how many stories there are about videos from headcams/dashcams) and it's easy to put things in inverted commas if not entirely sure about the accuracy. After all, let the reader/viewer decide.

 

[BestWestern]

iI saw a guard's panel on a 225 open a couple of years ago. The only person who I could find, a trolley dolly, was uninterested. I locked it with the multi-tool I have on my keyring!

Not ideal certainly, but unless you had the relevant keys I would assume little could be achieved there.

Had this muppet been inclined to fiddle with the train, and brought the thing up in a heap, the Driver would likely have spent a considerable time sat in the front cab playing with the TMS and trying to fathom what had occurred. A cab should be secure and therefore it probably isn't going to feature in the 'whats gone on here' considerations for a fair while. Meanwhile the TOC is being rinsed for delay minutes stacking up...

 

[Bletchleyite]

I saw a guard's panel on a 225 open a couple of years ago. The only person who I could find, a trolley dolly, was uninterested. I locked it with the multi-tool I have on my keyring!

I've seen that a few times, not that you could do anything with it without the key. I just push it closed if the guard is not around.

 

[bradders1983]

Not ideal certainly, but unless you had the relevant keys I would assume little could be achieved there.

Had this muppet been inclined to fiddle with the train, and brought the thing up in a heap, the Driver would likely have spent a considerable time sat in the front cab playing with the TMS and trying to fathom what had occurred. A cab should be secure and therefore it probably isn't going to feature in the 'whats gone on here' considerations for a fair while. Meanwhile the TOC is being rinsed for delay minutes stacking up...

How on earth is he a muppet for highlighting what he thought was a serious issue? The layman doesnt know the minuatae of what can and cant be done from the back cab of a train.

 

[SPADTrap]

How on earth is he a muppet for highlighting what he thought was a serious issue? The layman doesnt know the minuatae of what can and cant be done from the back cab of a train.

Which is exactly why you'd have thought a sensible person wouldn't touch anything or even go there...? Or anyone with a brain....

 

[bradders1983]

Well I cant see anywhere on the article where he is pressing buttons or pushing/pulling levers. In the pictures he is quite obviously touching the lever for the purpose of the photo, I highly doubt he is pulling/pushing it.

And had he merely told someone at the station and not made the press, then it would have just been forgotten about and nothing else would have been done other than the door being locked.

 

[Greenback]

It's not the fact that he wanted to highlight what he saw as a concern, it's more the way he chose to do it. He had no need to go in to the cab area or put his hand on any of the controls at all. A picture of the open door would surely have sufficed.

 

[bradders1983]

It's not the fact that he wanted to highlight what he saw as a concern, it's more the way he chose to do it. He had no need to go in to the cab area or put his hand on any of the controls at all. A picture of the open door would surely have sufficed.

Doubt that would have made the Daily Mail....

At least this shames the TOC into doing something about it. Which is what we all want, surely?

 

[Greenback]

I think that the argument that only by involving the press will anything be done is a dubious one. If the TOC had been contacted directly then I am sure that they would have reminded staff about the need to keep doors locked at the very minimum.

I don't see what's been gained by going the social media route, apart from people describing him as a bit of muppet! Then again, maybe I'm just old fashioned and not enamoured with social media or the way it's used these days.

 

[ASharpe]

There has been a lot of talk about how serious it could be that the cab is unlocked. But on many trains the cab can easily be accessed by anyone by using an emergency access handle, often by smashing a glass cover.

Should they be sealed up?

Or is the door being closed enough of a deterrent to terrorists?

My view is that it's a non-issue.

 

[Greenback]

My view is that there's very little a terrorist could do from the cab that they couldn't do elsewhere in the train.

 

[ComUtoR]

Closing the door stops opportunists. You wont stop terrorists.