Carmarthen to Aberystwyth Reopening?

[Tumbleweed]

The baby boomer bulge in the age pyramid is now reaching retirement age, where car ownership and usage will rapidly drop off as income declines, ailments increase and reactions slow, even though they'll live longer their propensity to drive will be on an ever downward curve. In Wales those on a downward curve in car usage will be forming an ever increasing %. In the meantime those reaching adulthood and replacing them in the workforce are less numerous. C800K per 5 year cohort compared to the baby boomer bulge in the UK. And this younger generation have a propensity to use cars less and defer car ownership and prefer urban living where public transport options are more viable.

Yet were told an increasing population means increased car usage.

I agree with what you are saying but it will take a lot longer to change attitudes in the government. Until then places like Camarthen, rural areas and areas choked with traffic like SE Wales will only see more roads not railways.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Really?
Then why is WAG spending money on the railway system at present?

I suggest you look at the Draft National Transport plan on the Welsh Government website recently out for consultation.

 

[Envoy]

Perhaps we should establish a green belt around Cardiff - rather than build on all the attractive countryside that surrounds the city - as is planned in the LDP. Then send all the people who wish to live in the Cardiff area to Lampeter where plenty of countryside exists for building houses. (Jobs would need to be created as well). Now, with a bigger population in Lampeter we would have definitely have a case for re-building the Carmarthen to Aberystwyth railway.

Here are the plans for just one bit of the countryside surrounding Cardiff. (If you click PLANNING - Design & Access statement, you will get more details. The amazing thing is that they have not decided where the stations will be on the new railway they plan to build out to Cregiau).http://plasdwr.co.uk/new-garden-city-proposed-for-cardiff/

 

[Bishopstone]

Perhaps we should establish a green belt around Cardiff - rather than build on all the attractive countryside that surrounds the city - as is planned in the LDP. Then send all the people who wish to live in the Cardiff area to Lampeter where plenty of countryside exists for building houses. (Jobs would need to be created as well). Now, with a bigger population in Lampeter we would have definitely have a case for re-building the Carmarthen to Aberystwyth railway.

These people who are 'sent' to Lampeter: where would they work, and what would they do - and where - in their leisure time?

We really are seeing some wacky suggestions in this thread, to justify re-building what would always be a scenic by-way of appeal mostly to enthusiasts and tourists.

I would take the opposite approach to you: do whatever it takes to ensure young people can live their dreams, which in most cases means leaving rural backwaters at the first opportunity and moving to a big city. Large parts of the green margins aren't particularly attractive and should be sacrificed for housing as soon as possible.

If that was politically unpalatable, how about 'sending' Cardiff retirees to Lampeter, to free-up housing stock in the city?

 

[Greenback]

I don't think Lampeter would want an influx of retirees any more than it would want houses built all over the surrounding fields

Things are getting a bit strange now!

 

[Gareth Marston]

These people who are 'sent' to Lampeter: where would they work, and what would they do - and where - in their leisure time?

We really are seeing some wacky suggestions in this thread, to justify re-building what would always be a scenic by-way of appeal mostly to enthusiasts and tourists.

I would take the opposite approach to you: do whatever it takes to ensure young people can live their dreams, which in most cases means leaving rural backwaters at the first opportunity and moving to a big city. Large parts of the green margins aren't particularly attractive and should be sacrificed for housing as soon as possible.

If that was politically unpalatable, how about 'sending' Cardiff retirees to Lampeter, to free-up housing stock in the city?

With the post 60 population ever increasing the idea of Lampter Retirement City is maybe not that far fetched. Rural areas already have a high proportion of retires that have moved in from urban areas.

 

[Greenback]

If people choose to move to Lampeter or other rural areas, that's their choice, they aren't being forced. I'm trying to get my elderly parents to move out of a rural area because of a lack of accessibility, though.

 

[Envoy]

Well, I did not think my suggestion would be taken too seriously. Retirees are surely not too keen to move to areas such as Lampeter due to the lack of public transport should they become unable to drive. Another concern must surely be the lack of decent hospitals. On the other hand, they will get more bang for their buck property wise.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

If people choose to move to Lampeter or other rural areas, that's their choice, they aren't being forced. I'm trying to get my elderly parents to move out of a rural area because of a lack of accessibility, though.

A very common dilemma - settling in a location where access (by bus or foot is a major asset for consideration) ....I cannot see myself in a converted barn in the middle of knowhere when I am 70+ .....

Anyway - back to the topic - my honest belief - "no chance" .....

 

[HowardGWR]

I live in a rural retirement area and one should regard this 'activity' as 'long term tourism'. What happens is that they move in, perhaps taking early retirement and immediately start running everything or get roped into that. After about 10 - 15 years, one of them, usually the husband, will go down with something dreadful, or worst still, dies. The widow or wife stuck with an incapacitated hubby, becomes isolated for all the usual reasons, although it is getting better that way, as the new lot of retirees usually have a wife who drives, due to the 60s-onwards emancipation.

Then the next phase kicks in with even worse deterioration to one or both, such as dementia. Then they become a burden on the rural county councils, who simply do not have the facilities do deal with the situation, but have to contribute to care home / home care costs.

Sorry to post this on the eve of Christmas, but I could see that a properly funded retirement city could be a reality of late 1940s baby boomer future geriatric facilities.

 

[Gareth Marston]

A very common dilemma - settling in a location where access (by bus or foot is a major asset for consideration) ....I cannot see myself in a converted barn in the middle of knowhere when I am 70+ .....

Anyway - back to the topic - my honest belief - "no chance" .....

It will probably be a more popular choice in the responses to the Welsh Government's Draft Transport Plan than the M4 "relief" road.
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I live in a rural retirement area and one should regard this 'activity' as 'long term tourism'. What happens is that they move in, perhaps taking early retirement and immediately start running everything or get roped into that. After about 10 - 15 years, one of them, usually the husband, will go down with something dreadful, or worst still, dies. The widow or wife stuck with an incapacitated hubby, becomes isolated for all the usual reasons, although it is getting better that way, as the new lot of retirees usually have a wife who drives, due to the 60s-onwards emancipation.

Then the next phase kicks in with even worse deterioration to one or both, such as dementia. Then they become a burden on the rural county councils, who simply do not have the facilities do deal with the situation, but have to contribute to care home / home care costs.

Sorry to post this on the eve of Christmas, but I could see that a properly funded retirement city could be a reality of late 1940s baby boomer future geriatric facilities.

Mum bought herself a new car when she was 61 worked part time for another 4 years but gave up driving when she was 68. ( I wont list the illnesses and hospital appointments we could be here some time). Ironically in the village she lives in she is a short walk to the bus top with roughly a bus every hour into the nearest market town, the railway station with a train every 2 hours, and the village has a Post Office, Butchers, Spar, Deli, garage, chip shop, 3 pubs and a club with the closest facility 200 yards away being the Doctors surgery. The only problem is she has a large garden and no downstairs toilet. Id never replicate that for her moving her into a town. However I know this is the exception rather than the rule!

 

[HowardGWR]

Gareth
That's some 'village'. Yes that is a sustainable location for old age but in my area, I had to convince the local plan inspector of the folly of allowing retirement development in villages with no facilities. I was successful. The Inspector removed 43 villages from the list of places where development could take place. Good seasonal wishes to you and your mother.

 

[Llanigraham]

Was going to say it sounded like Llani, Gareth, then I realised you said 3 pubs. We've only got 8!!

 

[Gareth Marston]

Was going to say it sounded like Llani, Gareth, then I realised you said 3 pubs. We've only got 8!!

It is the place where the staff for Moat Lane Junction predominantly came from!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Sorry to post this on the eve of Christmas, but I could see that a properly funded retirement city could be a reality of late 1940s baby boomer future geriatric facilities.

Lampeter could train some of this proposed new influx of elderly residents into a resurrection of the double-wove tapestry cloth trade that Lampeter was once famous for.

 

[Llanigraham]

It is the place where the staff for Moat Lane Junction predominantly came from!

Yes, I guessed so.
I keep saying we must try the "new" pub; I've heard good reports.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Yes, I guessed so.
I keep saying we must try the "new" pub; I've heard good reports.

I've heard contrary reports on the food at the Unicorn.

 

[CardiffKid]

There was a meeting list night where the group Traws Link Cymru revealed it's hopes for a 90 minute service between the two towns:

Over 100 people attended a meeting amid hopes a rail link between Aberystwyth and Carmarthen can be reopened.

The meeting in Aberystwyth was organised by campaign group Traws Link Cymru which revealed its hopes for a 90 minute service between the two towns.

The line closed in 1965 and at that time the journey took almost three hours, stopping at over 20 stations.

But reinstating the 56-mile line could cost around £650m. The group is trying to get funding for a feasibility study.

The meeting heard that around 3% of the track bed has been built on but Traws Link Cymru said that was no obstacle to reopening the line.

Ceredigion AM Elin Jones was at the meeting and said she would arrange for members of the group to meet with Economy, Science and Transport Minister Edwina Hart during the next few months.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-30844784

 

[Llanigraham]

There was a meeting list night where the group Traws Link Cymru revealed it's hopes for a 90 minute service between the two towns:



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-30844784

An AVERAGE speed of 45mph.....................



oink oink from a great height!!

 

[47802]

Hmm £650 million isn't the welsh valleys electrification costing about £300m that's leaves a fair bit left to buy some new electric train for the valleys as well, I wonder which is better value:-x

 

[CardiffKid]

isn't the welsh valleys electrification costing about £300m that's leaves a fair bit left to buy some new electric train for the valleys as well, I wonder which is better value:-x

Valleys electrification costs £500, not including trains

 

[47802]

Valleys electrification costs £500, not including trains

really so with the government allegedly paying £125m plus the Welsh Government paying £170m who's paying the rest then?

 

[merlodlliw]

There was a meeting list night where the group Traws Link Cymru revealed it's hopes for a 90 minute service between the two towns:



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-30844784

I wish it well,but ive seen film footage on BBC Wales stating lack of use was the main reasons for closure.
So whats the current bus service? The Minister does not want duplication.

 

[Bald Rick]

Over a hundred people attended?

If they each committed to do 100 return trips, each day, it might just wash it's face.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Has the existing bus service not been good enough to serve the existing demand?

 

[PHILIPE]

Over a hundred people attended?

If they each committed to do 100 return trips, each day, it might just wash it's face.

Where were they, or their ancestors, when there was a train service. I recall a pub closing near to us some years ago now with people attending meetings, signing petitions etc., many of whom had never been there. Motto is "Use it or Lose it".

 

[edwin_m]

Where were they, or their ancestors, when there was a train service. I recall a pub closing near to us some years ago now with people attending meetings, signing petitions etc., many of whom had never been there. Motto is "Use it or Lose it".

Reminds me of the story about the meeting to protest at the planned closure of the Lynton and Barnstaple. Turned out not a single person had travelled to the meeting by train...

 

[Parallel]

90 mins between Aberystwyth and Carmarthen still sounds like a fairly long journey, but a big improvement on the previous reported journey times! A link between Aberystwyth and Carmarthen/Swansea should mean that it will actually be quicker to travel to Cardiff than the existing route via. Shrewsbury. Cardiff Central also has connections to many areas in the south west too.

If anything ever came of these plans, I think they need to make it an express service as it will need to be as appealing as possible. I'm unfamiliar of where the trackbed exactly ran, but core stops at Aberystwyth (obviously), Lampeter, Carmarthen (obviously) and if they extended the services to Swansea, then Llanelli too. No reason why they couldn't run a couple of extentions to Cardiff a day either, just calling at the big stations, or offering Swanline strengthening. Any larger communities near the railway line between Aberystwyth and Carmarthen which are likely to increase passenger traffic could do with a station (even if it's just a request stop halt), so long as there aren't too many!

So in short, I can't see this happening in my life time. But if it does, I'm going to do a journey on it (It would also be my quickest route to Aber.)

 

[Gareth Marston]

Where were they, or their ancestors, when there was a train service. I recall a pub closing near to us some years ago now with people attending meetings, signing petitions etc., many of whom had never been there. Motto is "Use it or Lose it".

Probably living in the SE of England, the demographics of baby boomers retiring to rural Wales is a big issue.
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Has the existing bus service not been good enough to serve the existing demand?

You've never tried to use a bus through Ceredigion Paul or you wouldn't be askinglol:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Over a hundred people attended?

If they each committed to do 100 return trips, each day, it might just wash it's face.

Lots of retired baby boomers plus a few Plaid types

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

You've never tried to use a bus through Ceredigion Paul or you wouldn't be askinglol:

Indeed, my knowledge of your wonderful country is very good going from north Wales as far south as Aberystwyth, but with the exception of Cardiff itself, there it ends. This was one reason in 2014 in an attempt to belatedly garner some knowledge at the ripe old age of 69, my good lady wife and I based ourselves in a good hotel in Porthcawl and spent the best part of a fortnight visiting a different area each day. I was quite impressed by the new bus station in Swansea. I spent some time in Brecon seeking out what were the former stations there.