Scotland votes no to Independence

[Trog]

And North Korea wasn't created in the most peaceful and democratic birth of a new state the world has ever seen. If this is the best you can come up with you're not doing well here.

That was the Czech and Slovakian republics wasn't it?
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That Westminster doesn't give a toss about the loss of industry? A cursory glance at Scotland, the North of England and Wales. If they did care, this referendum wouldn't be happening.

Wake up and smell the coffee the old heavy industries were dead the moment the likes of India and China started to industrialise. The only way to match their prices for standard items, would be to match their pay and working conditions. That would not change regardless of who or where the government was based.

 

[danielnez1]

That Westminster doesn't give a toss about the loss of industry? A cursory glance at Scotland, the North of England and Wales. If they did care, this referendum wouldn't be happening.

And here it is... the centre of the whole issue.

From time to time I look at the South envy, I'll admit that. However every country has disparities from region to another. Independence won't change that fact. Likewise trying to portray Westminster as the bogeyman responsible for all your ills underlines an unhealthy victim mentality.

And North Korea wasn't created in the most peaceful and democratic birth of a new state the world has ever seen. If this is the best you can come up with you're not doing well here.

Yep, all thanks to David Cameron, oh the irony. Anyway I give you an example of how a written constitution means nothing if it is not upheld. I'm quite astonished you don't get it.

Instead of sprouting SNP/Yes Scotland style sound bites perhaps you should start being realistic about your prospects, otherwise you will probably be in for a nasty shock.

 

[Abpj17]

ExRes - Luxembourg didn’t have a central bank, so that’s a precedent. It did, however, create one for the euro although most of its functions are done by the ECB.

http://www.bcl.lu/en/bcl/index.html

The BCL’s contribution is important for the euro area and for the country. The Maastricht Treaty and the advent of the euro made the creation of a central bank necessary.

 

[St Rollox]

Don't wish to rain on anybody's parade or opinions but many of these arguments have been done to death at Scottish street level over the last couple of years.
There comes a point when there's nothing left to say other than, i wish my fellow Scottish voters on here good luck in which ever way THEY decide to vote.

 

[Johnuk123]

Scotland has spent years telling everybody they need to get away from being ruled by an undemocratic and unaccountable country.

It now seems bizarre that they intend to reapply to be in the EU which is both of those things and massively inefficient and utterly corrupt too for fine measure.

If Scotland is so sure they're going to be a roaring success why then go into another position of being told what to do and when by unelected bureaucrats from afar.

 

[Butts]

It will be interesting to see how the yes/no vote shapes up in the regions and to compare that to the split on the vote for the post 1997 Assembly.

It should not be forgotten that some regions voted against the creation of the Assembly or Parliament as it now known.

Although not as close as the result in Cymru where it went to the wire, I'm sure some parts of Scotland voted no.

 

[Spamcan81]

It is quite perplexing. but somehow understandable. 80% of the UK population is English, so in the house of commons, roughly a similar number of MP's will be from England. This means 80% of laws will be suited for England, and even those that are not, will probably still be reasonable palatable for the English public. (I've not phrased that particularly well, but I hope you get the point) The main issues recently where things like student fees, where the welsh and Scottish MP's voted to introduce/Increase them, and their National assemblies later vetoed this decision.

Good post. Labour won't want an English parliament as they'd almost always be in opposition without their many Scottish MPs. Tories won't want an English Parliament as they believe in the Union. I suspect the assemblies/parliaments in NI, Wales and Scotland (set up by Labour?) are tolerated and would be repealed if they could.

 

[ExRes]

ExRes - Luxembourg didn’t have a central bank, so that’s a precedent. It did, however, create one for the euro although most of its functions are done by the ECB.

http://www.bcl.lu/en/bcl/index.html

Have you actually read the link you placed ?

The Luxembourg situation has nothing whatsoever to do with the present time and so it is not a precedent in any shape or form for Scotland today
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Don't wish to rain on anybody's parade or opinions but many of these arguments have been done to death at Scottish street level over the last couple of years.
There comes a point when there's nothing left to say other than, i wish my fellow Scottish voters on here good luck in which ever way THEY decide to vote.

I can't say I agree with you, there is a lot left to say and it all comes under the headings of Truth and Reality

 

[Clip]

http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck...821?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

FactCheck: is Scotland’s NHS under threat from Westminster?

The NHS has suddenly become one of the key battlegrounds in the Scottish independence debate as the countdown begins to the referendum on 18 September.

The yes campaign says this: “More and more people are waking up to the threat to Scotland’s NHS that a No vote poses. Labour in England say that the English NHS is being broken up, as the UK Government privatises the health service – which would mean automatic cuts for Scotland’s budget.”

Pro-union critics have variously described this line of argument as “desperate”, “scaremongering” and “the biggest lie of the independence campaign”.

We think both sides have made dubious claims about public service spending in recent days. Let’s try to nail some of them.

Read this last night... Cant link properly as work block their blog

 

[St Rollox]

It will be interesting to see how the yes/no vote shapes up in the regions and to compare that to the split on the vote for the post 1997 Assembly.

It should not be forgotten that some regions voted against the creation of the Assembly or Parliament as it now known.

Although not as close as the result in Cymru where it went to the wire, I'm sure some parts of Scotland voted no.

Every area of Scotland voted YES to Home Rule at the 1997 referendum.

 

[Butts]

Every area of Scotland voted YES to Home Rule at the 1997 referendum.

Did they ? , the old brains going :cry:

I must have been thinking of the one in the seventies !!!

 

[Flamingo]

So, if any geographically discrete parts of Scotland (eg Shetland Islands) wished to remain (or form a new) union with England, or indeed go for status like the IoM or Channel Islands, how would an independent Scotland react, I wonder...

 

[Butts]

So, if any geographically discrete parts of Scotland (eg Shetland Islands) wished to remain (or form a new) union with England, or indeed go for status like the IoM or Channel Islands, how would an independent Scotland react, I wonder...

Well if Norway/Denmark ever cough up the money from the Dowry pledged (but never paid) for Margaret's marriage to James III of Scotland they could theoretically have The Shetlands and Orkney back which were the collateral involved until the money was paid.

I'm sure Norway's "oil fund" could stand the hit (even with 600/700 years interest !!)

 

[St Rollox]

Has London finally woke up to the fact GB PLC is being broken up?

 

[Clip]

Has London finally woke up to the fact GB PLC is being broken up?

No idea. however I did wake up in London to a lovely omlette and beans this morning.


Maybe you could explain what you mean?

 

[ExRes]

Has London finally woke up to the fact GB PLC is being broken up?

GB PLC may need to suck a few rennies to get over the obvious problems that independence would/could cause, with the massive infrastructure that's in place it shouldn't take too long to get over that though

Scotland (Groatstretcher) PLC has zero infrastructure in place, no currency, no central bank and most financial institutions ready to start packing their bags to move south

Who is going to be most the broken up of the two ?

 

[chris89]

Well two lots of poll releases.

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/508367937003347968

(Panelbase)
NO - 52%
YES - 48%

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/508351468827860993

(YouGov):
YES - 51% (+4)
NO - 49% (-4)

 

[St Rollox]

GB PLC may need to suck a few rennies to get over the obvious problems that independence would/could cause, with the massive infrastructure that's in place it shouldn't take too long to get over that though

Scotland (Groatstretcher) PLC has zero infrastructure in place, no currency, no central bank and most financial institutions ready to start packing their bags to move south

Who is going to be most the broken up of the two ?

Am i sensing anger?

 

[ExRes]

Am i sensing anger?

I've spent about 15 minutes replying to this and, once again, this poxy site has logged me out while I've been typing and I've lost the lot

Strangely I believe that's probably what will happen to Scotland and the people of Scotland should they vote yes

Am I angry ?, no, just sad that so many people are falling for the unsubstantiated rhetoric of a bully like Salmond who has no answers to the real questions of what will happen to so many people in an independent Scotland that cannot support itself in the real world

 

[St Rollox]

I've spent about 15 minutes replying to this and, once again, this poxy site has logged me out while I've been typing and I've lost the lot

Strangely I believe that's probably what will happen to Scotland and the people of Scotland should they vote yes

Am I angry ?, no, just sad that so many people are falling for the unsubstantiated rhetoric of a bully like Salmond who has no answers to the real questions of what will happen to so many people in an independent Scotland that cannot support itself in the real world

Can i put you down as a don't know then.

 

[ExRes]

Can i put you down as a don't know then.

I'd rather you didn't .........

My own personal don't know is why and how so many intelligent Scottish people and residents of Scotland, are falling for the half truths and exaggerations being put forward by Salmond

 

[yorksrob]

Heard an interesting interview from the head of Aberdeen Asset Management on the radio a couple of days ago.

He basically said that he felt that Scottish independence was no biggie, yet a proposed UK referendum on EU membership was a huge risk.

I found this quite strange, not because I don't think there would be a risk in a UK referendum on EU membership (there would), rather because we all know Scotland's readmission to the EU is a grey area at best, therefore what's risky for the rest of the UK must, logically be risky for Scotland.

I could only conclude that his views reflected one of the following:

• His fund might be named after Aberdeen, but has nothing to do with Scotland, therefore wouldn't be affected by uncertainty over the independent Scotland's position in the EU

• He thinks there is less risk to a country not being in the EU than he is letting on, but his fund would be disadvantaged by the City of London not being in the EU so he can't spell it out.

• He's a strident nationalist who believes the Scots should have a say in their own future but not the rest of the UK.

I would have liked Today to have grilled him on this, but sadly, as is often the case when it comes to the real question reading behind the lines, they let him off the hook at this time.

 

[GaryMcEwan]

With the way things are looking at the moment, does England have a space for a Scottish immigrant on the 19th of September?

 

[chris89]

With the way things are looking at the moment, does England have a space for a Scottish immigrant on the 19th of September?

Either way i'd rather up to Scotland :P But more to be with other half.

Myself if was able to vote it has gone No - Borderline No - Borderline Yes.

Chris

 

[Johnuk123]

I don't think the yes voters care one bit about money/politics/economics etc. it's all about the ability to govern one-self and not to have to take orders from afar.

If this vote goes the yes way I think it will encourage even more anti-EU sentiment in England than there already is.

 

[chris89]

I don't think the yes voters care one bit about money/politics/economics etc. it's all about the ability to govern one-self and not to have to take orders from afar.

If this vote goes the yes way I think it will encourage even more anti-EU sentiment in England than there already is.

Honestly don't believe that with the majority of Yes voters really. Some of course will vote yes without the concern for those such things.

Also doubt it will increase more Anti-EU sentiment either. Will though cause more dislike towards Westminster though.

Lies have been told from both sides without question or what appear to be lies. With the Currency Union i seriously doubt the current Goverment would block a currency union.

One thing though. I would love to know what was said by The Queen and David Cameron at Balmoral though.

 

[bnm]

I don't have a vote as I reside in England, but with a Scottish father it seems I'd get dual nationality. Kinda cool I suppose, but not the sole reason to form opinion on the Independence issue. Being half-Scot, half English it's right that I'm sat on the fence. Although the fence is leaning a little toward the YES side.

Now, being born in Germany it'd be even cooler if I could get triple-nationality!

As for Alex Salmond wooing voters with bribes he can't deliver on. That's just what all politicians do to curry favour. Westminster's (running just a little scared following this weekend's polls) package of bribes is to be announced 'within days'. I urge all those with a vote in the referendum, who are sceptical about what Alex Salmond can and will deliver, to also take the offers from London with a pinch of salt. When the NO campaign was over 20 points ahead in the polls there was no talk about further devolution for Scotland. Now the polls are much closer suddenly we hear talk of 'more tax powers, more spending powers, more powers over the welfare state.' Funny that.

There is, however, a lesson from history that Scots would do well to remember. Darien.

That scheme, in which Scotland attempted to become a colonial power, all but bankrupted the country at the turn of the 18th century and was one of the important factors in bringing about the Act of Union in 1707.

 

[yorksrob]

With the Currency Union i seriously doubt the current Goverment would block a currency union.

Are you sure ?

I only say because we've been pretty unkeen on currency unions for a few years now and the Euro fiasco doesn't seem to have made people warm to the idea much.

Unfortunately, currency unions don't tend to work without political unions - the same applies to England and Scotland as well as anywhere else.

To be honest, if the Scots really want independence, they shouldn't want a currency union anyway.

 

[chris89]

Are you sure ?

I only say because we've been pretty unkeen on currency unions for a few years now and the Euro fiasco doesn't seem to have made people warm to the idea much.

Unfortunately, currency unions don't tend to work without political unions - the same applies to England and Scotland as well as anywhere else.

To be honest, if the Scots really want independence, they shouldn't want a currency union anyway.

Im not fully sure, as no one can be honestly. I just don't think the Goverment will follow through with it is all. Especially after things such as Tuition Fees etc in Rest of UK.

I do agree about the currency union though. How Better Together have been going though, they will/ may cause more people to go Yes.

As mentioned if i could vote. I would be Borderline yes. Girlfriend is now a Yes support (Guess one reason, seen what has happened with the NHS in Shropshire, Although that fear is unknown at the moment)

Her parents are both Unknown/ No or moving towards yes and extended family going towards yes now.

 

[yorksrob]

Girlfriend is now a Yes support (Guess one reason, seen what has happened with the NHS in Shropshire, Although that fear is unknown at the moment)

That doesn't surprise me. Conservative policies (pursued by the Conservatives and New Labour) have probably led more than anything to the partition of Britain.