Last night at about 19.50 a pair of 455s split apart whilst departing platform 3 at Waterloo, I saw the passengers being detrained and the police being summoned. I assume this was a rare incident but am surprised that it could happen - does anyone know more about this?
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Class 455 incident at Waterloo Sunday evening
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PG
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Not sure if it fulfils the criteria for the RAIB or not, but if it does then we'll find out... in about a years time.
Glad to hear nobody was injured.
Glad to hear nobody was injured.
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carriageline
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Nothing terrible, disastrous or sensational could of happened!
Of course trains separating can happen, I'm sure any type of coupling can break/fail/or come apart for whatever reason. The important thing is, that it 'fails safe', and the air brake comes on immediately. Which, as the train stopped,I'm sure that happened.
Aslong as no passengers or staff where hurt, and it wasn't a mess up on a member of staffs behalf, then hopefully we can just live and learn from it!
Of course trains separating can happen, I'm sure any type of coupling can break/fail/or come apart for whatever reason. The important thing is, that it 'fails safe', and the air brake comes on immediately. Which, as the train stopped,I'm sure that happened.
Aslong as no passengers or staff where hurt, and it wasn't a mess up on a member of staffs behalf, then hopefully we can just live and learn from it!
the 455's use pipes and jumper cables that are separate to the coupler face. If two units separated in service through mechanical failure of the knuckle, im not sure how immediately obvious it would be until the units separated far enough for the air lines and jumper cables to de-attach. 
cjmillsnun
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the 455's use pipes and jumper cables that are separate to the coupler face. If two units separated in service through mechanical failure of the knuckle, im not sure how immediately obvious it would be until the units separated far enough for the air lines and jumper cables to de-attach.
That wouldn't exactly be very long though. Only about a second or two.
Surely it depends on whether the rear unit kept taking power after the coupling parted
With the delays on the systems the front unit always seems to pull away from the rear unit, whether by design or luck I couldnt say.
Oh the jumper cable can be over 9ft (3m in euros) long wjhen it is pulled out and no I am not saying how I know!
No Fault Found
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With the delays on the systems the front unit always seems to pull away from the rear unit, whether by design or luck I couldnt say.
Oh the jumper cable can be over 9ft (3m in euros) long wjhen it is pulled out and no I am not saying how I know!
What delays on the 'system' are those? Does electricity take that long to pass down a train wire?
PG
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I'd guess (so could well be wrong!) since it's under investigation and the units parted at Waterloo that they'd want to take them separately off to Wimbledon. Not much point re-coupling them in case it was a faulty coupler only to have them split again in an awkward place eg blocking half the approaches.
BestWestern
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What on earth were the BTP expected to do about it!? 
swt_passenger
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What on earth were the BTP expected to do about it!?
Force an early takeover of services by TfL, because they'd be much better than any TOC. On arrival, they'd say LO, LO, LO...
Force an early takeover of services by TfL, because they'd be much better than any TOC. On arrival, they'd say LO, LO, LO...
That comment deserves some kind of award! Made my morning.
In all seriousness, I should imagine they only attended to assist with detraining if they were needed.
ralphchadkirk
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What on earth were the BTP expected to do about it!?
Assist with a detrainment, deal with any annoyed passengers that their train has been cancelled, provide support to the rail staff dealing with it, quickly make sure that it hasn't happened due to criminal activity.
You lot complain that the BTP are nowhere to be seen most of the time, and then complain when they do turn up!
swt_passenger
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I think they wanted them to be able to work with other stock available in the 'DC area' for rescue purposes, such as 73s? The 442s were another stock which maintained the separate connecting hoses and cables when already passed their sell by date.
I dont know hence the last bit of my post you quoted but selectively removed, yawn :roll:, perhaps rather than be sarcastic about it you could explain why the front unit always seems to pull away from the rear unit even when it is powering away no matter which end you are driving from?
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Because the Southern preferred all their units to be able to couple to each other.
The 508s couldn't which caused massive delays when it was needed so the Southern region went back to a (semi) compatible coupling when the 455s were designed.
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Someone could have fallen through if they were in the corridor connection when they split!
It could have been a child!
Somebody think of the children!!!
Sensational enough? :P
Were 455s often rescued by or used to rescue slam door trains, or was this one of those ideas that in the end was not needed?
So, a staff member could be in the wrong place at the wrong time and fall! :P
Seriously though, has there ever been a case in the history of corridor stock of someone falling because units have split or carriages have detached?
I'd imagine it to be similar odds to winning the lottery whilst dialling a random 020 number and getting the Queen's direct dial number, whilst being hit by lightning?
I have spoken to a few staff that say they have done it but it certainly wasnt done very often, probably because back then most trains could manage to clear themselves off the line (even if it took some lateral thinking
) rather than need rescuing.Its only nowadays when the computer says no that we have problems.
Units, and certainly 455s, have split in service before. Either due to mechanical problems or put together incorrectly. Even with pipes like 455/6s have instead of boxes the brakes will come on immediately and you will loose interlock as the drum switches will be incorrectly set-it's designed to stop if it splits basically. It would take a while to stop by waiting for the air to drain out alone.
The rule book does cover trains splitting in service and checking no one has fallen is part of it on corridor stock.
The rule book does cover trains splitting in service and checking no one has fallen is part of it on corridor stock.
No Fault Found
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Why would i need to quote your whole post? You were stating there are delays in the system which i wanted you to explain.
I can't explain why it seems like the leading unit pulls away from the trailing unit because the fact is it doesn't. A signal is passed down the train wire which will demand power from all engines / transmissions or motors simultaneously.
JB25
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Happened last year in Selhurst Depot. A Shunter Driver I believe drove off but the 455/456s weren't uncoupled properly. Completely wrecked the pipework on both units.
Are you saying that as a driver with experience on that class, or as someone who (like me) has no idea or experience. Whilst in theory, it should drive simultaneously, 455driver, who I have no doubt has driven this type of train at least a couple of times, says that there is a delay, and I'd probably believe him. I too don't know why, but it could be that there is some delay in the PCM movement on the second unit, which might see the system synchronise when the new traction pack is installed, or it could be any small feature in the system. Just a suggestion
Why is it then that whichever end I drive from the leading unit always cammes up faster than the rear unit. When I change ends its the same thing, the front unit (which was the rear unit) now takes the lead and cammes up quicker!
JB25
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You tend to get a tug on 455s... As if the rear unit isn't going as quick as the front so it tugs back.
So that's why you get that sharp lurch just as you start motoring? I was on a 455 twice on Saturday and noticed it at every pullaway, plus the jolt as you suddenly stop motoring :P. Don't mind these two as much but when acceleration is not smooth it really bugs me for some reason
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